Perkins M20 - Removed head and this lovely sight presented me!

[Lepke]

If money is an issue, a proper rehone and new rings could make the engine run ok. It may smoke a little more and maybe put some oil in the exhaust. But for the trouble to take the engine down that far a real overhaul makes the most sense.

[chowdan]

Originally Posted by Lepke

If money is an issue, a proper rehone and new rings could make the engine run ok. It may smoke a little more and maybe put some oil in the exhaust. But for the trouble to take the engine down that far a real overhaul makes the most sense.

Yeah, money is a issue right now. I may not have funds to do it all now, but by end of summer I should be in a position to afford a full rebuild.

Even if the engine burns oil, I would be fine with it because it would be far cheaper getting it running than having it replaced outright.

On another note, can the pistons be removed and rings replaced while the engine is in the boat? Or does it need to be pulled for that work?

[four winds]

Unlikely to be able to pull the pistons and rods with engine mounted. The pan must be removed to access the rod caps.

[chowdan]

Originally Posted by four winds

Unlikely to be able to pull the pistons and rods with engine mounted. The pan must be removed to access the rod caps.

That's what I had figured.

Well we can hope pistons and rings and lower half isn't in need of work cause I don't really want to pull the engine

[jimbunyard]

Have you drained and inspected the oil? That might give you a better idea of what to expect.

[chowdan]

Originally Posted by jimbunyard

Have you drained and inspected the oil? That might give you a better idea of what to expect.

I have - I drained it using the westmarine pump system that pulls from the dip stick.

The oil was black as can be, no indication of water. The dipstick also showed no water beads or any signs of rust.

I then pulled the drain bolt at the base of the pan, a tablespoon or two of water came out then nothing else. The water was clear as what comes from the tap. I stuck a screwdriver up inside, and that seemed to cause the rest of the oil to flow out, id' say about a cup or so. The oil was also black as black can be, no chunks, no sludge, just black thick oil.

[japarker11]

Originally Posted by chowdan

I have - I drained it using the westmarine pump system that pulls from the dip stick.

The oil was black as can be, no indication of water. The dipstick also showed no water beads or any signs of rust.

I then pulled the drain bolt at the base of the pan, a tablespoon or two of water came out then nothing else. The water was clear as what comes from the tap. I stuck a screwdriver up inside, and that seemed to cause the rest of the oil to flow out, id' say about a cup or so. The oil was also black as black can be, no chunks, no sludge, just black thick oil.

Chowdan,

Our Perkins 403-7 in the kohler genset is now a 403-11 after 10 months of googling and ebaying. All that is left is to haul it from the desert to PNW and install it back into Odyssey.

You have gotten great feedback and have found the availability and non-marine sourcing of parts that took me 4 months to discover.

This latest investigation of the crankcase oil situation is good news, too as the seawater in the top end will often migrate past the rings and destroy the lower end in engines that have sat frozen as long as yours. Our experience has been that parts and machining creep was substantial, pistons, rods unusable after breaking loose, machining cylinder bores, injectors shot......

As you want to go sailing and you have a functional outboard that has serviced previous owners for a decade and the sailing, absent SJDF and Admiralty Inlet, present little chance of hobby horsing the outboard, GO SAILING after completing your standing rigging restoration and taking your Perkins home with you. You can take your time and do a decent job at the lowest cost sourcing the parts. Top end refits for seawater lock ups have a horrible track record. I will send you pics of the piston condition after they were beaten out of the block after only four months seized if you like.

You won't be the first to use a Port of Everett dock cart to wheel their auxiliary to their car.

John

PS. I have a bunch of donor parts from the 403-7 that probably crossover, such a deal for you.

Sent from my LG-V410 using Cruisers Sailing Forum mobile app

[Jdege]

Originally Posted by chowdan

Thanks!! That seems like an effective method from what I'm reading! I'll have to give this a try!

How fast does the acetone evaporate out of the mixture?

If you're finding that acetone works, but evaporates too quickly, you might try one of the slower-evaporating ketone solvents - IIRC methyl ethyl ketone is next on the list.

[chowdan]

Originally Posted by japarker11

Chowdan,

Our Perkins 403-7 in the kohler genset is now a 403-11 after 10 months of googling and ebaying. All that is left is to haul it from the desert to PNW and install it back into Odyssey.

You have gotten great feedback and have found the availability and non-marine sourcing of parts that took me 4 months to discover.

This latest investigation of the crankcase oil situation is good news, too as the seawater in the top end will often migrate past the rings and destroy the lower end in engines that have sat frozen as long as yours. Our experience has been that parts and machining creep was substantial, pistons, rods unusable after breaking loose, machining cylinder bores, injectors shot......

As you want to go sailing and you have a functional outboard that has serviced previous owners for a decade and the sailing, absent SJDF and Admiralty Inlet, present little chance of hobby horsing the outboard, GO SAILING after completing your standing rigging restoration and taking your Perkins home with you. You can take your time and do a decent job at the lowest cost sourcing the parts. Top end refits for seawater lock ups have a horrible track record. I will send you pics of the piston condition after they were beaten out of the block after only four months seized if you like.

You won't be the first to use a Port of Everett dock cart to wheel their auxiliary to their car.

John

PS. I have a bunch of donor parts from the 403-7 that probably crossover, such a deal for you.

Sent from my LG-V410 using Cruisers Sailing Forum mobile app

Thanks for that japarker! I'd love for you to post/share some of those photos! I'd like to see what your pistons and everything else looked like!

How are you planning to haul over to the PNW?

I do plan to not put to much money towards the engine right now. It would be nice to have it running again, but its not a top priority, its more of a "nice to have" thing right now. My top priority is getting the vessel into a cleaner state and looking good and doing the chainplates. Standing rigging will be done towards end of summer, early winter of 2016.

The focus right now is getting the boat in a state that we can take it out(it is already, just chainplates i felt needed to be done sooner than later along with standing rigging). Once the plates are done(next week), we'll start taking the boat out a bunch more!

I'm not too worried about the hobby horsing, its a concern, but not a high one. Mainly just not a fan of how the boat sits witht he outboard on the back(also the look of it really bothers me). I like the lines of the bristol, and the outboard on the back really detracts from that stern view that the boats have.

[JTHAW]

ALL.....GO to parts4engines...in England....total rebuilt perama... $3600..plus 500 bucks for shipping...excellent prices on parts and kits too.....looks like a great place....!!!!!

[chowdan]

Originally Posted by JTHAW

ALL.....GO to parts4engines...in England....total rebuilt perama... $3600..plus 500 bucks for shipping...excellent prices on parts and kits too.....looks like a great place....!!!!!

Umm that's WAY over my budget. If I'm spending 4.1k, I might as well go for a new one.

Also parts4engines wasn't that great of a deal for parts plus they lacked parts for my engine...

[corbieres]

Hello all and hoping this thread has not gone dead since I am mucking around in the same area with my Volvo Penta MD2020D. To cut a long story short, I need one piston and three sets of rings that are oversized .025. VP want over 500 E for these so you know where they can go...

From this thread I have understood that the engine is the equivalent of the 103-07 since the bore is 67mm. It seems strange that the first rebore would have been done at .025 since the service manual suggests .05 but I have no choice but to believe that is the case since the pistons all have a 25 on top of them. Attempts to get an accurate measurement of the bore that confirms this has been inconclusive.

So I can find very reasonably priced oversized pistons at.05 and .1, but the only place I can find the .025 is with VP. Does anybody know what the Shibaura and or Ford engine model is for this engine...Otherwise might be looking at a rebore...

Thanks in advance

[deblen]

Originally Posted by corbieres

Hello all and hoping this thread has not gone dead since I am mucking around in the same area with my Volvo Penta MD2020D. To cut a long story short, I need one piston and three sets of rings that are oversized .025. VP want over 500 E for these so you know where they can go...

From this thread I have understood that the engine is the equivalent of the 103-07 since the bore is 67mm. It seems strange that the first rebore would have been done at .025 since the service manual suggests .05 but I have no choice but to believe that is the case since the pistons all have a 25 on top of them. Attempts to get an accurate measurement of the bore that confirms this has been inconclusive.

So I can find very reasonably priced oversized pistons at.05 and .1, but the only place I can find the .025 is with VP. Does anybody know what the Shibaura and or Ford engine model is for this engine...Otherwise might be looking at a rebore...

Thanks in advance

Look at this Perkins Perama manual-pg4 to determine the KD # of your engine. The engine is an SHIBAURA & was marinized by both Volvo & Perkins. The tag is on the engine block-lower stbd side if I recall.

Perkins parts are less expensive.


Perhaps you being confused by metric vs imperial oversized rings.
.025 /.050/.100



Len


https://manuals.casecoltingersoll.co...atermarked.pdf

[travellerw]

Originally Posted by corbieres

Hello all and hoping this thread has not gone dead since I am mucking around in the same area with my Volvo Penta MD2020D. To cut a long story short, I need one piston and three sets of rings that are oversized .025. VP want over 500 E for these so you know where they can go...

From this thread I have understood that the engine is the equivalent of the 103-07 since the bore is 67mm. It seems strange that the first rebore would have been done at .025 since the service manual suggests .05 but I have no choice but to believe that is the case since the pistons all have a 25 on top of them. Attempts to get an accurate measurement of the bore that confirms this has been inconclusive.

So I can find very reasonably priced oversized pistons at.05 and .1, but the only place I can find the .025 is with VP. Does anybody know what the Shibaura and or Ford engine model is for this engine...Otherwise might be looking at a rebore...

Thanks in advance

Unfortunately I don't think you will have good luck trying to chase down the Shibaura or Ford parts. Shibaura, Perkins and Volvo have done a VERY good job ensuring these parts are controlled. Most dealers will require a serial number and simply will not sell to you if you can't provide a proper serial number.

With that being said, I'm pretty sure the MD2020 is that same engine block in the Ford GT-67 tractor.
TractorData.com Ford GT-75 tractor engine information

You are correct that your block is a 103.07 (or 103-07) Perkins. Volvo had no part in designing or marinizing these engines. They simply bought them from Perkins and painted them green.

I think you best option is to contact the following company and talk with them. I have bought numerous parts from them and they have been excellent.
https://www.parts4engines.com/perkin...-overhaul-kit/

[corbieres]

Thanks for your replies.

First of all apologies for getting confused with the metric vs imperial and putting the dot in the wrong place .25 over is what I am looking for. So my bore is 67.25 mm and the pistons that came out of it were marked "25" on top.

Additional research seems to indicate that this engine is used in the Ford GT75. The Shibaura egine number appears to E673L.

My issue remains with the size of my bore. Volvo Penta seem to be the only ones with the .25 oversize. I spoke with parts4engines and he was very helpful, but only has .5 for his smallest oversize. I spoke with a tractor dealer in the states about the GT75, and he sais the same thing. .5 is his smallest oversize.

It seems strange that this engine was bored out at this diameter. Any thoughts? VP couldn't have done it to insure that we can't find fairly priced pistons, could they have?