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Old 07-07-2015, 16:15   #16
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Re: outboard fuel tank bulges in sun

I keep a cloth in the dinghy and in some hot windless places I wet the cloth and drape it over the tank.

I do not vent the gas because that is expensive stuff!!
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Old 07-07-2015, 16:16   #17
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Re: outboard fuel tank bulges in sun

Quote:
Originally Posted by FamilyVan View Post
Yikes, good thing I'm not in the state's- gas tanks with no vents. No doubt you can vent them by cracking the lid.

Sent from my SGH-I547C using Cruisers Sailing Forum mobile app
Judging by the multiple cracks that formed in the original tank supplied with the motor, that was the basis of the new design, self cracking tanks, no vents needed!
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Old 07-07-2015, 17:23   #18
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Re: outboard fuel tank bulges in sun

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Originally Posted by Robin3 View Post
Judging by the multiple cracks that formed in the original tank supplied with the motor, that was the basis of the new design, self cracking tanks, no vents needed!
:thumbup:

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Old 07-07-2015, 18:16   #19
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Re: outboard fuel tank bulges in sun

The new tanks are vented, but not until they reach 5 psi. They are supposed to let air in as the tank empties in use.

Features (sarcasm) of the new rules are possibility of fuel spray, and flooded engines. See link below. You can now buy a regulator to put in the fuel line.

http://www.nmma.org/assets/cabinets/...12%20Final.pdf
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Old 07-07-2015, 20:36   #20
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Re: outboard fuel tank bulges in sun

The cheap thin plastic is the problem the old tanks did not allow any venting and did not swell like the new ones ,allowing to vent all the time I think would contribute to the fuel going bad sooner I have had gas go bad in as little as 3-4 months in containers that were not sealed properly
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Old 07-07-2015, 22:00   #21
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Re: outboard fuel tank bulges in sun

this all smells of inventing problem where non really existed and then finding a solution to it. Who truly believes that an environmental problem actually existed outside of someone's imagination or caused potential danger to the use??

So, what shall I do, a blown up tank that escapes it's tie downs and slithers hither and thither is not my idea of fun and the fact that one such inflated tank resulted in splits and leaked fuel in the dinghy fills me with alarm.

I think as a test I will half fill my 'spare' old style 6 gallon tank ( the normal one supplied with the 9.9hp mercury 4 stroke is a 3 gallon)and see if that one swells less or not at all in the sun with it's screw down vent fully closed and then make sure it connects correctly to the engine and works well. The extra range of the 6gallon over the 3 gallon might be useful too.

I wonder also how they apply these same new rules to those engines with built in fuel tanks

I'm all for useful innovation and improving the breed but this is ridiculous.
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Old 08-07-2015, 07:37   #22
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Re: outboard fuel tank bulges in sun

While I'm sure it's illegal, if you go online, I'm sure you can find a retro-fit vent you can put in the fuel cap.

Barely cracked, the vent in our outboard tank solves the issue.
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Old 08-07-2015, 21:27   #23
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Re: outboard fuel tank bulges in sun

Love perusing this 'forum' after a few beers. A perfectly legal* mizzippi vent...

*Didn't get caught
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Old 09-07-2015, 07:48   #24
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Re: outboard fuel tank bulges in sun

Well yesterday I tried the ventable cap from our old tank on the new wondertank and it is the same thread but sits sa bit skewed so not sure how good a seal it is, irrespective of the vent in it. Next idea is to revert to the old (Quicksilver) tank which came from the defunct 9.9 Mercury 2 stroke motor.This will not have the extra fuel pressure regulator in line like the wundertaker one but I believe these are available now separately and one could be fitted later if I feel the need, but it wasn't needed on the old motor so why add more complication.

There are great long explanations on line from the tank suppliers and West Marine as to how it is perfectly normal for these new type tanks to inflate when in sunlight, but it certainly isn't something I consider 'normal' at all, worrying , yes, normal, no, especially when tank number one (supplied with the new motor) leaked under pressure via the fuel line elbow to tank joint and number 2 tank, supplied under warranty by West ( who supplied the motor) had visible deep cracks all over from where it was inflating and deflating so much with temperature changes.

I understand that Attwood offer two tanks, one EPA approved for USA use and the other for the rest of the world(including Canada), but not available in the USA it seems.

If I had bought a used engine from pre 2011, instead of buying new I would not be having these problems and would have a few more beer tokens left as well.
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Old 10-07-2015, 11:25   #25
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Re: outboard fuel tank bulges in sun

Quote:
Originally Posted by Robin3 View Post
We have a Mercury 9.9hp 4 stroke motor on our RIB tender and it has a 3 gallon fuel tank that blows up like a ball in the sun. The original one that came with the motor cracked and leaked an West Marine, who suppliedthe motor, replaced it with one of theirs, which so far hasn't cracked but sure gets expanded. What do others do about this please, we carry our RIB in davits and the tank is left strapped in place? We still have an older style 6 gallon tank that came from a 2 stroke 9.9 Mercury we replaced, will this work with the 4 stroke engine or even could we perhaps just swap the vented cap on that one with the non-venting one on the current tank.

This strikes me as a legally mandated environmental 'improvement created mess that was ill conceived
Hi Robin,

BOATUS had an article recently about installing the fuel demand valve (~US$25) to prevent outboard flooding when using the new ventless tanks. That doesn't eliminate the basketball envy your tank feels in the sun, however.

We needed to replace our outboard tank last year and bought one while in Canada so we didn't have to give up the vented cap... Of course it still bulges when warm, but we can conveniently do something about it... [The Canadian brand Scepter fuel cans of all types are great products... e.g., On their gas cans, their CARB compliant fuel spout fits inside the can instead of permanently hanging on the outside waiting to be sheared-off like so many US fuel canisters... ]

Just a thought...

Cheers!
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Old 10-07-2015, 13:26   #26
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Re: outboard fuel tank bulges in sun

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Originally Posted by wrwakefield View Post
Hi Robin,

BOATUS had an article recently about installing the fuel demand valve (~US$25) to prevent outboard flooding when using the new ventless tanks. That doesn't eliminate the basketball envy your tank feels in the sun, however.

We needed to replace our outboard tank last year and bought one while in Canada so we didn't have to give up the vented cap... Of course it still bulges when warm, but we can conveniently do something about it... [The Canadian brand Scepter fuel cans of all types are great products... e.g., On their gas cans, their CARB compliant fuel spout fits inside the can instead of permanently hanging on the outside waiting to be sheared-off like so many US fuel canisters... ]

Just a thought...

Cheers!
Thanks. my tank already had the fuel line overpressure gizmo included in the fuel line when I bought the engine but the real problem is at the the tank rather than the engine as the tank expands significantly even at below the 5 psi figure at which the system i is supposed to vent itself. When expanded the tank is so rounded it slips out of it's hold down straps on the RIB floor and is free to slide wherever it wants because the dinghy normally resides in davits with the tank installed (nowhere else convenient to stow it if I took it off). Imagine short tacking with such a mobile molotov cocktail doing it's dance .

One tank vented itself by leaking via the fuel connection elbow to tank fitting, the next by splitting open multiple cracks. Each time a new tank was supplied free under warranty, but nothing has changed.


I wishI had just bought a use motor instead of buying new. We live too far from Canada to pick up a tank there and I imagine but will check, none can be shipped to the USA. I HATE DUMB DESIGN and this is a prime example.
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Old 10-07-2015, 13:30   #27
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Re: outboard fuel tank bulges in sun

Here's what I did; I bought an old Mercury 5hp outboard at an auction for our 9.7M Zodiac. I bought a plastic fuel tank and sprayless fuel connector. First day out in the sun the fuel tank swelled up. I drilled and tapped a small hole in the tank near the molded-in handle and threaded in a brass elbow with a barbed hose connection. I installed a short piece of fuel line hose on the elbow and connected the hose to a quarter-turn fuel valve from the lawnmower parts selection at the farm store. I installed another short piece of fuel line hose on the free end of the valve and at the last free end of the hose I installed an 'aerator stone' designed for aquarium use. When I use the tank I leave the new vent valve open. When the tank is not in the dinghy I close the vent valve. Now the tank doesn't stink up the car when I haul the tank. Random splashes of water do not get into the tank through the vent hose, my outboard motor does not stall because the carburetor can't draw fuel from the tank and everybody is happy.
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Old 10-07-2015, 13:56   #28
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Re: outboard fuel tank bulges in sun

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Originally Posted by guyfromiowa View Post
Here's what I did; I bought an old Mercury 5hp outboard at an auction for our 9.7M Zodiac. I bought a plastic fuel tank and sprayless fuel connector. First day out in the sun the fuel tank swelled up. I drilled and tapped a small hole in the tank near the molded-in handle and threaded in a brass elbow with a barbed hose connection. I installed a short piece of fuel line hose on the elbow and connected the hose to a quarter-turn fuel valve from the lawnmower parts selection at the farm store. I installed another short piece of fuel line hose on the free end of the valve and at the last free end of the hose I installed an 'aerator stone' designed for aquarium use. When I use the tank I leave the new vent valve open. When the tank is not in the dinghy I close the vent valve. Now the tank doesn't stink up the car when I haul the tank. Random splashes of water do not get into the tank through the vent hose, my outboard motor does not stall because the carburetor can't draw fuel from the tank and everybody is happy.
Great minds.... My mind was also wandering like that but had not got as far as the aerator stone just to adding a simple vent screw fitting somewhere in the tank body. I will sleep on it like with all design mods!
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Old 11-07-2015, 11:31   #29
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Re: outboard fuel tank bulges in sun

OK, I think I got lucky! I looked on line and found replacement fuel tank caps for pre 2010 tanks and found some with screw vents by Moeller and got even luckier because my local West Marine actually had one in stock. I could even have bought an old model vented cap type tank had I $95 to spare plus another $50 for a matching fuel line, but as it was, the cap was only $11.99 and I even had a $10 voucher that took care of most of that. The very helpful guy at west even tried the new cap on one of these new style EPA approved tanks, like the one I have, to make absolutely sure it would fit, which it does. So my apologies to any tree huggers who think I may be contributing to climate change by venting fuel to the atmosphere, but the alternative of dumping 3 gallons or more of liquid fuel when the tank splits open or worse explodes is surely much worse. Hopefully now I have a working set up again. Thanks to all who replied.
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Old 14-07-2015, 11:40   #30
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Re: outboard fuel tank bulges in sun

Update o results as I just checked the tank in the dinghy today, currently 95F and the new cap has kept the tank bulge free and no leaks of fuel either. it is nice to solve a problem, even if there should have been none to solve other than in the mind of an obsessive environmentalist law. I hear you now have to have prior permission to light a wood or coal fire in your own home in SO California. The world has gone mad, but at least, after thinking outside the box, I now have a useable outboard motor again. I hope my experience is of help to those who follow in my wake.
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