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Old 16-07-2013, 20:03   #1
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New Small Car Diesels - Convert For Marine Use?

was looking through old threads on converting auto/tractor engs for boat use - anyone thought about/tried converting any of the new small car engines now popping up on the market - last time i asked i was quoted $10000 for a new yanmar 30hp 3 cyl eng and trans, gotta be able to do a conversion for half that...
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Old 17-07-2013, 01:13   #2
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Re: New Small Car Diesels - Convert For Marine Use?

Thought about it, did the numbers, brought a new John Deere 4045 DFM marine engine and ZF 63 gearbox.

Cost just under $17k a few years ago.
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Old 17-07-2013, 04:23   #3
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Re: New Small Car Diesels - Convert For Marine Use?

I know of a guy in Bay of Islands, NZ, who has a diesel ATV engine out of a Polaris quad bike running his 14 foot tinnie (aluminium dinghy). The guys a mechanic who had a busted outboard, a busted ATV and a boat with no engine. Installed the quads engine in a casing inboard, driving a hydraulic pump and ran hoses to the back of the boat where he took the top off the outboard and fitted a hydraulic motor to the leg shaft in place of the busted outboard engine.

Anything is possible if you have the tools and the experience in using them, or otherwise have enough cash to pay people with the tools and experience.



On the other hand, if you're just a normal duffer who can't tell the difference between a thingy and a widget, and no cash to pay the pros, just stick with the tried and true.


You're only limited by your money and skills, imagination is free.
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Old 17-07-2013, 05:42   #4
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Re: New Small Car Diesels - Convert For Marine Use?

There are lots of boats with Volkwagon 1.9 L diesels running in them.
So much so that VW now markets the 1.9L as a Marine engine.

TDI | Mercury Marine#

Same engine as in my car, but with a marine heat exchanger and different oil filter. Its 200 lbs lighter than a Beta 60 hp

Lots of diesels comming to the US in 2014, so we may see more conversions in the future
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Old 17-07-2013, 07:21   #5
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Re: New Small Car Diesels - Convert For Marine Use?

The main issue is a source of marinization parts, like heat exchangers combined with exhaust coolers etc, First look up sources of marixaztion parts then decide on what engine base to use.

In the UK , its common to see small Ford, Peuguet , Mercedes engines being marinized , as well as the common BMC diesel. This is because the heat exchangers are available.

Outside that it can be difficult.

Dave
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Old 17-07-2013, 07:54   #6
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Re: New Small Car Diesels - Convert For Marine Use?

The Smart car diesel is 800cc common rail, latest technology , very good fuel economy and performance.
Motors like these are heading in the right direction for some lightweight better performing motors that someday will see their way into the outboard market.

You can pick up one of these used for about 600 Euros.
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Old 17-07-2013, 08:16   #7
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Re: New Small Car Diesels - Convert For Marine Use?

Sadly many of the new diesels have been overly "tinked" to comply with emissions. Some even run trap oxidizers (like a catalitic converter) that will not only require special consumable fluid to work, but set a trouble code on the computer if they do not get it.

Unfortunately, the "new generation" diesels being imported to the US will not make very good candidates for transplant.
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Old 17-07-2013, 08:17   #8
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Re: New Small Car Diesels - Convert For Marine Use?

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Some even run trap oxidizers (like a catalitic converter) that will not only require special consumable fluid to work, but set a trouble code on the computer if they do not get it.
Examples ?

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Old 17-07-2013, 08:22   #9
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Re: New Small Car Diesels - Convert For Marine Use?

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Some even run trap oxidizers
Mostly for California, but I mean trap oxidizers have long been supplanted by other forms of catalytic convertor. ( see MB history of their use)


Quote:
Unfortunately, the "new generation" diesels being imported to the US will not make very good candidates for transplant.
Could you justify that remark, I see no validity in it.

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Old 17-07-2013, 08:45   #10
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Re: New Small Car Diesels - Convert For Marine Use?

This guy is using a Smart Cdi diesel engine. It gets 71 mpg in a car, so just imagine what it would dofor your boat.

Engine Smart CDI-Motor OM 660
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Old 17-07-2013, 08:45   #11
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Re: New Small Car Diesels - Convert For Marine Use?

Dave,

Wiki is your friend. wiki on /Diesel_exhaust_fluid.

Some great motors that you have available are simply not allowed in the US. Others have had to have their particulate emissions reduced for import.

The MB 6 cyl was a great motor, used in the w124/w126 chassis... They tried to put a trap oxidizer on it in 1987. MB was trying to head off deisel restrictions in the US and had to recall the cars and scrap the emissions device because it destroyed the motors.... (Melted the aluminum heads).

Of course, this is not the example of modern motors I refer to, but the kinds of things manufactures do to comply complicate installation. For a device to be accepted, it not only has to reduce emissions, but has to resist being removed to the point of disabling the motor (or impact functionality) if tampered with.

One example (gasoline) of the way this is enforced is the OBD II engine control system. After 96, US cars had a second set of O2 sensors that were only used to verify the presence of the cat. If these were removed, to motor went into a less efficient mode and set a code. There are o2 sensor simulators available now, and folks figure out how to work around such problems..... Just takes more effort.

I do not dispute there are some really great new motors out there, just that US policy will make them tough to transplant into boats. No longer is it a question on just bringing over they motor, or even the motor and computer... Now there are provisions made to further complicate matters...l

Not impossible, just complicated.
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Old 17-07-2013, 08:53   #12
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Re: New Small Car Diesels - Convert For Marine Use?

Believe the new auto diesels use electronic controlled injection. That alone makes them unsuitable for boat use. Supplying clean, water free diesel is enough of a problem on a boat, without having to worry about those pesky electrons.
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Old 17-07-2013, 08:58   #13
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Re: New Small Car Diesels - Convert For Marine Use?

Our VW turbo diesel needed synthetic oil and was built for efficiency at 4,500 rpm. You'd need a 4:1 reduction gearbox to the prop or it just wouldn't run at an efficient level.

I'd sooner look at a Kubota tractor engine conversion. Cheaper maintenance parts as well.
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Old 17-07-2013, 08:58   #14
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Re: New Small Car Diesels - Convert For Marine Use?

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Believe the new auto diesels use electronic controlled injection. That alone makes them unsuitable for boat use. Supplying clean, water free diesel is enough of a problem on a boat, without having to worry about those pesky electrons.
you've obviously not seen most modern marine diesels over about 80hp then ( see Volvo penta D series, Yanmar etc)

Increasing emissions controls will force electronic control onto all diesels in th next few years
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Old 17-07-2013, 09:00   #15
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Re: New Small Car Diesels - Convert For Marine Use?

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I do not dispute there are some really great new motors out there, just that US policy will make them tough to transplant into boats. No longer is it a question on just bringing over they motor, or even the motor and computer... Now there are provisions made to further complicate matters...l

Not impossible, just complicated.
Couldnt you just force California to secede , think of all the benefits...

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