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Old 07-02-2018, 16:39   #46
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Re: Making a diesel electric trawler for coastal/loop

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I sail in the PNW. We use these things called tide charts and don't try to motor against a 6 knot tide.
ya, started using them around 50 years ago in pnw. you sail in a trawler? limited at 4 knts? ha ha ha, whatever you say hotrod.
and I motorsail all the time against the tide, pretty hard to get anywhere here unless you can and do. so where are you "sailing" on your trawler on? lake union?
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Old 08-02-2018, 09:45   #47
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Re: Making a diesel electric trawler for coastal/loop

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ya, started using them around 50 years ago in pnw. you sail in a trawler? limited at 4 knts? ha ha ha, whatever you say hotrod.
and I motorsail all the time against the tide, pretty hard to get anywhere here unless you can and do. so where are you "sailing" on your trawler on? lake union?
Sailboat, but we have left Friday Harbor in zero wind situations and had to use our 6HP outboard which only pushes us at roughly 5 knots hull speed. By timing the tides we are able to easily make Anacortes by late afternoon.

Sorry but you made it sound like all you need is 250HP and 600 gallons of diesel and you can ignore tides.
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Old 08-02-2018, 10:13   #48
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Re: Making a diesel electric trawler for coastal/loop

With 250HP and 600 gallons of fuel you CAN ignore the tides - provided you have your wits about you. Take note that that is PRECISELY how the commercial traffic negotiates Skookumchuck Narrows in Sechelt Inlet. If you like you can have a go at it in Deception Pass when she's in full spate.

My technique for Deception Pass as well as Dodds Narrows, if I miss the slack, is to go on a fair tide, turning about and stemming it while going full bore ( = 6 1/2 Knts). That sets me BACKWARDS over the ground at several knots. As I said: Keep you wits about you if you try it. Deception is fairly safe. Dodds requires far more vigilance. And don't ever try it in Skookumchuck or Dent Narrows. If you do, the likelihood that you will be sunk is quite high!

We can all do the math of electric propulsion. I see that you've been toying with the thought for a decade or so. I think it'd be wonderful if you could give us a report of actual, real life operational results of any trial runs you may have to report on.

Cheers

TP
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Old 08-02-2018, 10:31   #49
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Re: Making a diesel electric trawler for coastal/loop

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I used an older Torqueedo 1003 on our 17 foot sailboat (about 2500 pounds displacement loaded with 2 of us in it). This is a geared down brushless motor turning a fairly large prop. It had a 300 watt-hr battery.

I could get 2 hours or so of run time doing about 3 to 3.5 knots.

This is why I was saying even a small solar system could beat a sculling oar. My personal experience. Maybe not "any" electric motor/drive, but something like that Torqueedo system.
Actually, on my boat, a torqeedo with 270 watts of solar is a fairly even match to the sculling oar. I tried this, and the torqeedo needed 200 watts to equal what I can do with the sculling oar.

The torqeedo is designed for lighter displacement, actually even smaller than 2500 pound boats. It is going to be more efficient on the 2500lbs than my 8000 pounds. I'm fairly sure I could scull this boat you have at least 3 knots for hours provided I made a custom sculling oar for it.

To get the same efficiency pushing a larger boat you would need a different propeller more reduction gears, and lower rpm.

So yes, a 270 watt solar panel could (in strong sunlight) beat a sculling oar, but not with typical drive systems that most people use, and certainly not by using the existing inboard shaft and propellor with a motor on a belt drive which is common.
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Old 08-02-2018, 10:51   #50
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Re: Making a diesel electric trawler for coastal/loop

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If it was ANYBODY else I’d say you’re crazy.

You though, sound like you could pull this off ;-)
My thoughts to !

KTP, welcome to the land of the all-knowing !
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Old 08-02-2018, 11:40   #51
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Re: Making a diesel electric trawler for coastal/loop

To go back to the first couple posts, Budweiser and Tesla seem to think the electric trucks will work out ok.

I think a catamaran is going to work better. You say a 4’ draft so that must be a 36 or 38’ trawler. That will need more than 2000 watts to make 4 knots. But maybe a 32’ cat could do that speed and more square footage for solar. Likely more living space as well.

You probably do want a backup gen atleast a Honda 3000 so you can get out of emergency situations and maybe a small sailing rig.
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Old 08-02-2018, 15:00   #52
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Re: Making a diesel electric trawler for coastal/loop

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My thoughts to !

KTP, welcome to the land of the all-knowing !
I'm not all knowing and never claimed too, but I do what I do and I know what I know.
The real problem is not what I said or how I said it. The problem would seem to be more of along the line of as you said, "my thought's to" and KTP saying
"well it sounded like" maybe both of you can stop trying to read crap in to post's where none exist. know it all indeed ha ha, but you two both read a **** ton into a simple post, so who thinks they know what?
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Old 08-02-2018, 17:03   #53
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Re: Making a diesel electric trawler for coastal/loop

Well it looks like we are going to be spending all of our funds on a Crealock 34 sailboat so I guess there goes the experiment idea (I will not be chopping off the keel and mast on this baby)

Going to have a lot more room than our Monty 17!
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Old 08-02-2018, 18:18   #54
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Re: Making a diesel electric trawler for coastal/loop

Nice choice. Beautiful boat with a strong reputation.
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Old 09-02-2018, 13:38   #55
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Re: Making a diesel electric trawler for coastal/loop

I think you will be pleased.
A sailboat can be phenomenally efficient on motor, we motored down the ICW from Brunswick Ga to Vero Beach Fl, burned 35 gls of Diesel and that includes 20 hours of generator time.
My fuel burn at 1900 RPM is less than a half a gallon an hour, and I think the generator burns maybe a quart an hour.
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Old 09-02-2018, 20:27   #56
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Re: Making a diesel electric trawler for coastal/loop

Trawlers are awful designs for so many reasons, we should recycle them. You are better off getting a trimaran that can sail efficiently in light wind. Keep it light. Now you will make the great loop much faster without any propellers than you could on a "solar trawler"[/QUOTE]

The trawler label is so overused it's almost meaningless. Most have inefficient semi-displacement hard chined hulls. However, real full displacement "trawlers" are awesome boats & superior to multihulls for exactly the reason that you point out,"Keep it light". That's not an issue for a displacement hull trawler which means you can bring as much stuff as you need & push it around with very little horsepower. When cruising & living aboard that's a great feature.
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Old 11-02-2018, 04:30   #57
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Re: Making a diesel electric trawler for coastal/loop

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Trawlers are awful designs for so many reasons, we should recycle them. You are better off getting a trimaran that can sail efficiently in light wind. Keep it light. Now you will make the great loop much faster without any propellers than you could on a "solar trawler"
The trawler label is so overused it's almost meaningless. Most have inefficient semi-displacement hard chined hulls. However, real full displacement "trawlers" are awesome boats & superior to multihulls for exactly the reason that you point out,"Keep it light". That's not an issue for a displacement hull trawler which means you can bring as much stuff as you need & push it around with very little horsepower. When cruising & living aboard that's a great feature.[/QUOTE]

Partly true. You can load up a trawler with an extra few tons of gear and have almost no impact on efficiency or HP required. The problem is a true displacement trawler hull is like riding a weeble-wobble unless you add stabilizers or a steadying sail which eats into that efficiency.

As with most things, there is no "best" option for all considerations.
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Old 11-02-2018, 05:16   #58
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Re: Making a diesel electric trawler for coastal/loop

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Well it looks like we are going to be spending all of our funds on a Crealock 34 sailboat so I guess there goes the experiment idea (I will not be chopping off the keel and mast on this baby)

Going to have a lot more room than our Monty 17!
Excellent decision! That's a tough, seaworthy vessel which will get you anywhere you want to go.

I presume it's got a nice, direct drive diesel engine for the times you can't sail?
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Old 12-02-2018, 21:46   #59
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Re: Making a diesel electric trawler for coastal/loop

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Partly true. You can load up a trawler with an extra few tons of gear and have almost no impact on efficiency or HP required. The problem is a true displacement trawler hull is like riding a weeble-wobble unless you add stabilizers or a steadying sail which eats into that efficiency.

As with most things, there is no "best" option for all considerations.
Small ones yes big ones not so much of a problem
We have no stabilisers or steadying sails and in two years of full time liveaboard and cruising have only wanted them once for about 20 minutes on a 30 knot beam sea section.
Changed course, added a few miles to the trip, problem sorted.
Being retired and full time on board does mean we can be smart about our movements.
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