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Old 08-07-2015, 14:59   #16
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Re: Is this reasonable ??

Contact the Office of Far Trading ASAP. You can lodge the complaint and confirm you want to proceed with an investigation. No issue of a prosecution yet, they will issue a "please explain" to the Company and then pass these comments back to you.
If they have previous complaints, you then get to hear of them.
If no other complaints, then you have at least started them on the Watch list.
Make a separate copy of your correspondence and make diary notes of your conversations with the guys - be truthful though and no embellishments as that is the quickest way to be dismissed.
If they made genuine mistakes, they should be happy to negotiate a better deal. They should also be able to show direct copies of their purchase of the parts they claim they used (and are trying to get you to pay for).
Threaten to Name and Shame them in Afloat magazine.
Good luck
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Old 08-07-2015, 15:21   #17
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Re: Is this reasonable ??

Quote:
Originally Posted by hamburking View Post
A circuit board is easy to replace by just about anyone.
Electric motors have only 1 moving part.
A diesel has hundreds of moving parts.
A HUGE feature of electric motors is that they require almost no maintenance or repair...there is just nothing to break (they don't need to be winterized either). This is a HUGE reason why auto manufacturers are against electric...they make all their money at the dealerships doing tune-ups, maintenance, oil changes, etc....all that would go away.

As for generators to run electric motors...they don't need to be attached to the hull or driveshaft. So a small generator (like the panda diesel genset) can easily be removed for servicing or replacement.

Electric solves so many of the issues with engines, and brings almost no new issues. The big ships have seen the light, and many ferries and military vessels have already made the switch... around here the Wolfe Islander III, a 55 car ferry is all diesel electric. Also the HMS Kingston is diesel electric too. There are other advantages too...like multiple small generators for backup and redundancy, or multiple electric engines. I find the whole field to be terribly exciting, and can't understand why more boats haven't gone electric...especially new boats.
Ships and large commercial vessels bear almost no relation to this discussion. They use electricity as a tranmission and due to the scale, they are very efficent and simpler. These advantages do not apply to small cruising boats.

If you read threads on the experimentors, they are mostly tinkerers who like to play with it and do thier own work. Just like thier are tinkerers who like to work on diesels. Neither is relevant to this thread.

The few retail electric boats I've come across seem to have a high rate of problems and the average guy isn't going to diagnose and replace electronics.

There is a myth that less parts equals more reliable and that is flat out false with respect to modern engines. My last truck was a 25 yr old diesel with a quarter million miles on it. The body was rusting away when the guy drove off in it but other than oil/filter changes, I never had to work on the engine (by the way what dealership is making money off tune ups? Other than my first used junker of a car a few decades back, none have required tune ups.)

There is no conspiracy. Electric drivetrains simply can't compete with diesel based drivetrains at this point in time. That may change at some point but not now.

Back to the point of the thread. A repair guy is just as likely to mess up and/or try to take advantage of you regardless of the drivetrain type.
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Old 08-07-2015, 15:28   #18
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Re: Is this reasonable ??

Also add to Valhalla's comments - Pommy naval vessels are not the best examples for Aus as they do not mix in our waters since they tried to park that frigate next to our island paradise.
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Old 08-07-2015, 16:01   #19
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Re: Is this reasonable ??

It would be nice to have a thread where names can be listed by state. If good work is done at a good price or a case like this. When it's not passed on someone else gets screwed. Car Talk has a base like that and no matter where you are in the country ( I was on the road for five years straight) if you have car trouble you can always find a good and trusted mechanic. I think a lot of folks will say info can be found on Active Captain. Yes, some, but not a definitive list. CF would have to set up a referral page we log into and add our favorite or not favorite folks.
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Old 08-07-2015, 16:45   #20
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Re: Is this reasonable ??

Quote:
Originally Posted by Djarraluda View Post
Contact the Office of Far Trading ASAP. You can lodge the complaint and confirm you want to proceed with an investigation. No issue of a prosecution yet, they will issue a "please explain" to the Company and then pass these comments back to you.
If they have previous complaints, you then get to hear of them.
If no other complaints, then you have at least started them on the Watch list.
Make a separate copy of your correspondence and make diary notes of your conversations with the guys - be truthful though and no embellishments as that is the quickest way to be dismissed.
If they made genuine mistakes, they should be happy to negotiate a better deal. They should also be able to show direct copies of their purchase of the parts they claim they used (and are trying to get you to pay for).
Threaten to Name and Shame them in Afloat magazine.
Good luck
+1 Fair trading and sadly an opinion from an appropriately experienced legal professional.
Good luck.
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Old 08-07-2015, 16:54   #21
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Re: Is this reasonable ??

appreciate you may be at a sensitive part in the negotiations but would appreciate eventually to know who these rogues are. Fair Trading is a pretty good idea.
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Old 08-07-2015, 17:17   #22
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Re: Is this reasonable ??

Quote:
Originally Posted by zengirl View Post
It would be nice to have a thread where names can be listed by state. If good work is done at a good price or a case like this. When it's not passed on someone else gets screwed. Car Talk has a base like that and no matter where you are in the country ( I was on the road for five years straight) if you have car trouble you can always find a good and trusted mechanic. I think a lot of folks will say info can be found on Active Captain. Yes, some, but not a definitive list. CF would have to set up a referral page we log into and add our favorite or not favorite folks.
The offending mechanic is in Sydney, Australia.

The forum already has the ability for people to recommend (or not) using the World Cruising and Sailing Wiki that is part of this forum. Link is towards the top on the right hand side of every page.
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Old 08-07-2015, 17:27   #23
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Re: Is this reasonable ??

Quote:
Originally Posted by zengirl View Post
It would be nice to have a thread where names can be listed by state. If good work is done at a good price or a case like this. When it's not passed on someone else gets screwed. Car Talk has a base like that and no matter where you are in the country ( I was on the road for five years straight) if you have car trouble you can always find a good and trusted mechanic. I think a lot of folks will say info can be found on Active Captain. Yes, some, but not a definitive list. CF would have to set up a referral page we log into and add our favorite or not favorite folks.
I can't agree more. Something like a Yelp for the boating industry and yes I agree that Active Captain doesn't cut it for what is really needed. The list could be broken down by service category like sail making, electrician, rigging, motor repairs etc. Should be an open contribution but moderated so as to watch our for vendors posting self serving trash. Also like Yelp there has been a problem with competitor vendors getting on and pretending to be a service buyer and then trashing their competition. Maybe if you had a requirement that real name and phone number must be supplied to a moderator or acesable only by a moderator who in the case of a disputed posting could check the validity of the poster. Shouldn't stop honest postings as in the USA truth is a defense against defamation. Also would stop the lying competitor since he could end up being exposed and then in legal hot water. The internet is a great resource for the benefit of the group but it needs rules to protect from the bad guys.

Now regarding the boat owner in Sydney who looks like he is being ripped off by a disreputable marine mechanic I would bring in another mechanic pronto. Ask your insurance company for a reputable mechanic and explain what is going on. They may be very helpful and have someone they use for investigating claims. Otherwise hire another mechanic even if you have to get him from out of the area and pay for his travel and get him to check the motor as well as talk to the original mechanic. I would have him take notes of what he finds and what is told him and then have it witnessed by a justice of the peace ( from my days in Australia I think thats what they call them). Then go with your information to the small claims court and file a claim. You won't even need a lawyer if you gather the right evidence and get yourself a good new mechanic. Make sure you don't compromise the independence of his testimony by promising him to give him the work to take over from the old mechanic. This is something you could do after the case but not before. I would hit the mechanic up for all your out of pocket costs including hiring the other mechanic as well as your lost enjoyment time on the water which could include a percentage of your boating costs for the 3 or 6 months for marina, insurance etc. etc. Handled right you will get out of this and teach that son of a sea urchin a lesson.

Good luck.
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Old 08-07-2015, 21:05   #24
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Re: Is this reasonable ??

Quote:
Originally Posted by Djarraluda View Post
Contact the Office of Far Trading ASAP. You can lodge the complaint and confirm you want to proceed with an investigation. No issue of a prosecution yet, they will issue a "please explain" to the Company and then pass these comments back to you.
If they have previous complaints, you then get to hear of them.
If no other complaints, then you have at least started them on the Watch list.
Make a separate copy of your correspondence and make diary notes of your conversations with the guys - be truthful though and no embellishments as that is the quickest way to be dismissed.
If they made genuine mistakes, they should be happy to negotiate a better deal. They should also be able to show direct copies of their purchase of the parts they claim they used (and are trying to get you to pay for).
Threaten to Name and Shame them in Afloat magazine.
Good luck
Some very good advice here. Parts and labor cost is outrageous !! I would document everything you can and see if you can find a certified diesel mechanic to look at the engine and try to figure out what was done and not done.
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Old 08-07-2015, 22:19   #25
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Re: Is this reasonable ??

Its a gasoline engine. It is so simple to work on that with a engine manual that you said was on the boat, you could have fixed it your self. I imagine that you have just been hit by someone that is greedy and dishonest and thinks you are just a dumb dumb. They would be called a politician if they were in government. Mac
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