Is the Max Boring diesel class a good idea?

[Canibul]

We got a couple of 3HM Yanmars with the catamaran we bought recently. I know they're obsolete, but I'd like to keep them. I for sure don't want to replace them with anything that has the word "computer" associated with it.

I've got a fair bit of experience around internal combustion engines, just not diesels. I've rebuilt a lot of gasoline engines, for boats, cars, trucks, motorcycles and small aircraft. Owned two Land Rover diesel Defenders until recently, but never had a single problem with either engine so I didn't get much experience working on them.

I've been wondering about this three day seminar that the Max Boring company does up in New Jersey. Have any of you guys gone through this? It's advertised as being for sailboat diesel owners, but I have to question how much useful knowledge I would get in only three days from a course that covers a number of different engines. If it's mainly for people who never did their own engine maintenance, I don't really need help changing belts and filters. All I need is a manual for that.

Any experiences with the diesel course at Max Boring? Is it worthwhile?

[marlinmike]

Well I think for part of the class it will be helpful (valve adjustment, injector replacement, injection pump etc), but for the water pump/cooling circuit/fuel system bleeding it would be boring. The instructor is excellent (Larry Berlin), and he will answer any of your questions, so from that perspective it could be worth it if you going in prepared.

[carlylelk]

I'm going to the Chicago area class in two weeks, I'll let you know.

[Canibul]

Originally Posted by carlylelk

I'm going to the Chicago area class in two weeks, I'll let you know.

Well that's good timing. I can't wait to hear what you think of it. Are you already pretty familiar with internal combustion engines? Or is mechanical repair something new you are starting to get into because of the boat?

I kind of consider myself somewhat of a decent shade tree mechanic to start with and am trying to get a feel for what level this course addresses. .

[carlylelk]

On a scale of 1 to 10 I'm a 3. Great at replacing parts. Sometimes good at diagnosing problems. But, of course, that's why I'm taking the class.

[rockDAWG]

Originally Posted by Canibul

We got a couple of 3HM Yanmars with the catamaran we bought recently. I know they're obsolete, but I'd like to keep them. I for sure don't want to replace them with anything that has the word "computer" associated with it.

I've got a fair bit of experience around internal combustion engines, just not diesels. I've rebuilt a lot of gasoline engines, for boats, cars, trucks, motorcycles and small aircraft. Owned two Land Rover diesel Defenders until recently, but never had a single problem with either engine so I didn't get much experience working on them.

I've been wondering about this three day seminar that the Max Boring company does up in New Jersey. Have any of you guys gone through this? It's advertised as being for sailboat diesel owners, but I have to question how much useful knowledge I would get in only three days from a course that covers a number of different engines. If it's mainly for people who never did their own engine maintenance, I don't really need help changing belts and filters. All I need is a manual for that.

Any experiences with the diesel course at Max Boring? Is it worthwhile?

I have a feeling that you don't get much from the course. I am in the same boat as you. I have worked on cars and trucks most of my life and understand how things work. Mack Boring in NJ is not too far from me, but I am unwilling to pull the trigger to take the course.

I am afraid that the course is for boat owners who have no experience with internal combustion engine. Diesel engine is so much simpler than today's car engine. I don't think the course will show you how to rebuild the engine. Understandably, it is not the boat owner's need.

I am holding out on this.

[ranger58sb]

I dunno about the Mack Boring course(s)... but I can comment about the diesel courses at Annapolis School of Seamanship, and maybe some of that will apply across the board.

ASofS offer two courses. The first (Basics) is one day of familiarization, diesel theory plus some emphasis on routine service like water pump impellers, oil and filter changes, fuel filter service/changes, etc.

The second course (Level II) is two days of much more. Afterwards, I could change water and fuel pumps; remove, service, or change our heat exchangers; remove, service, or charge turbochargers (although that was theoretical, no hands-on turbo work in class); troubleshoot and/or replace starters; remove/replace injectors; adjust valves; and essentially troubleshoot a diesel problem from scratch. This was a very hands-on course. The "exam" was each team was given a sabotaged engine (with several introduced faults) and had to get it running.

The courses used small diesels (one was a Yanmar), in the classroom. While not as elaborate as our installed diesels, they were easily sufficient to illustrate the major details. I felt the courses were well worth my time and the expense.

That said, my background was pretty much a clean slate. I knew a lot about the theory of internal combustion engines, but at the time wouldn't have recognized a carburetor or a fuel pump if it bit me on the a$$.

-Chris

[blackkayak]

I took the classes in Wilmington, NC about 5 years ago. There were two, a day of theory and two of engine work. You told them ahead what engine you had on board and they had one there for you to strip and rebuild. We took the engines down to the valves and lifters, changed out heat exchanger, water pump, ect. After we put them back together the instructor hooked it up to a battery cart, gave it a shot of fuel, and varoom!
Surprised the heck out of me. The course gave me a good understanding of the engine but more important it gave me confidence in attempting my own repairs.

[Canibul]

Originally Posted by ranger42c

Afterwards, I could change water and fuel pumps; remove, service, or change our heat exchangers; remove, service, or charge turbochargers (although that was theoretical, no hands-on turbo work in class); troubleshoot and/or replace starters; remove/replace injectors; adjust valves; and essentially troubleshoot a diesel problem from scratch.

Thanks, Chris, that is exactly the kind of feedback I was hoping for.

For us, me going up to NJ for three days in May is kind of a big deal. For starters, there are a few boat units of air fare involved, hotel, car rental, the $900 course fee, and of course the agony of having to survive that environment for three days.... I'd probably have to buy socks and shoes with tops on them, and long pants....a t shirt without holes...go without conch for almost a week while listening to that funny accent.....while they make fun of mine...

Seriously, though, I've already done everything on Chris' example list, except adjusting the valves, and I did a quick look at that section in the tech manual and using feeler gauges and adjusting valve lash and clearance is really very straightforward. I've had a few dozen rocker arm covers off in my day.

There were two manuals for the Yanmars that came with the boat, the four language owners/operators and a 400 plus page maintenance manual. From what I've seen so far, that tech manual is pretty good as a step-by-step and I've just downloaded it to the laptop. Familiarity with the hardware, tools, and theory of operation should be enough, with good documentation. I've rebuilt much more complex engines with a lot less manual than that Yanmar one.

I think I'll just put the tech manual on an ipad in a watertight case so I can take it into the engine rooms with me. A better use of some of the money I would have spent on the course, I think.

Thank y'all for the input.

[eyschulman]

I did the two day course. 2nd day was a teardown and put together including valve timing and what you have to do to maintain the motor. I had previous motor experience and still found the course very useful. There was an option for one or two days go for the two day.

[Brien]

Did the three day course several years ago. First day is basic maintenance info, but I still learned a thing or two. The remaining days were tears downs and reassembly on an engine that was most similar to what you might have in your vessel. For me, it added confidence to deal with most diesel problems and took the mystery out of diesels. That, along with Larry's vast experience and his willingness to answer virtually any question, made it worthwhile to me. At the time, the course was offered in Massachusetts, so no travel involved.

[keyspc]

Dont know about the boring class.
But when i bought my boat i signed up for diesel engine repair class at Florida Keys Community College. Spent couple of hundred to go through my engine with a certified engineer/instructor. Mark Woods made class very fun and "exciting"
FKCC is short dinghy ride from Key West mooring field, good hot showers and a pool.
Well worth the trip and price for anyone on east coast!

[Safari38LH]

I found the course worth it for my level of knowledge. It improved my comfort level a great deal.

[Canibul]

Originally Posted by carlylelk

I'm going to the Chicago area class in two weeks, I'll let you know.

Did ya go?

[Cuttyhunk]

I did the two-day class for women they run in conjunction with the National Women's Sailing Association. It was a very good class. Larry Berlin taught it then; this year it is John Farrell, and up in MA again, March 15-16, for any women who might be interested.

They will let you dig in as deep as you are willing. They have a bunch of diesels that were warranty issues or just old and left over after repowering, and they all run and you can take apart your heat exchanger, etc. Obviously nothing like what I did in my 9-month fulltime marine systems course at IYRS, but very good. I had come to Mack Boring with several specific questions and areas I wanted to learn more about, and I learned what I needed to. And I don't even have a Yanmar.