Cruisers Forum
 


Join CruisersForum Today

Reply
 
Thread Tools Rate Thread Display Modes
Old 21-09-2013, 18:06   #1
Registered User

Join Date: Sep 2013
Posts: 10
Interchangeability of tractor version with marine diesel 4107

Sometimes, when you are looking desperately for parts for your 4107, you come across another engine, perhaps marine, perhaps stationary from a tractor, it's possible.

Are the engines interchangeable? Are there parts that are not interchangeable? Are the basic components interchangeable?

Such as block, pistons, rings, injector pump, radiator, etc.
__________________

__________________
bahmi is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 21-09-2013, 23:54   #2
Registered User

Join Date: Feb 2012
Location: Ireland, French canals/Med/Spain
Boat: Birchwood Centre Cockpit 33, Broom Shannon Class 42 flybridge.
Posts: 476
Re: Interchangeability of tractor version with marine diesel 4107

Hello, Engine manufacturers can't make money from the relatively small volume of marine diesels (Sorry but my experience is only with diesels) so the majority are marinised versions of car/van/truck engines. The base engines are identical, as are all the internal parts, the only difference is in the engine mountings and the cooling system. You mentioned the Perkins 4107, millions of these are fitted to different models of Massey Ferguson tractors, combine harvesters, forklifts, small earth movers and generators etc. If you need new parts for the engine then I suggest you contact parts4engines.com. For marinising parts, engine mountings, cooling systems etc.contact ASAP Supplies.com, another excellent family business is Lancing Marine.co.uk for all things on all marine diesels. The company that marinises new Perkins engines are Perkins-Sabre.com Whilst these company's are based in the UK in the best of British business tradition they will ship worldwide to any boat owner.
Perkins engines are now a subsidiary of Caterpillar and apart from using Perkins engines themselves they also supply spare parts. However I do urge you to 'shop around' and compare prices to get the best deal and avoid heavy dealer 'mark ups' on prices.
I hope this helps, if you need more information drop me a message.
__________________

__________________
Irish rambler is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 22-09-2013, 02:15   #3
cruiser

Join Date: Sep 2007
Location: Tampa to New York
Boat: Morgan 33 OutIsland, Magic and 33' offshore scott design "Cutting Edge"
Posts: 1,594
Re: Interchangeability of tractor version with marine diesel 4107

The engine production number and a copy of the Perkins parts listing pdf will tell you what you need to know. It was more a matter of when the engine was built as to what parts may have been changed or upgraded. When you order an injection pump or other internal engine part the first thing the dealer will want to know is aforementioned production /engine id number.
__________________
forsailbyowner is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 22-09-2013, 02:47   #4
Registered User
 
Wraith_Mac's Avatar

Join Date: Aug 2013
Location: Central Coast, NSW, Australia
Boat: Avon Rib, 65hp
Posts: 304
Re: Interchangeability of tractor version with marine diesel 4107

Great advice from both posts, saved me typing LOL
Can't stress the importance of the numbers enough to a good parts dept.
Cheers,
Mac
__________________
NEW SCIENCE: You fund the research and we provide the desired facts.
NEW ECONOMICS:See Above, obfuscation extra.
Wraith_Mac is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 22-09-2013, 07:07   #5
Senior Cruiser
 
Blue Stocking's Avatar

Cruisers Forum Supporter

Join Date: Dec 2008
Location: St. Georges, Bda
Boat: Rhodes Reliant 41ft
Posts: 4,114
Re: Interchangeability of tractor version with marine diesel 4107

Probably (haven't really looked) not so much with small diesels, but the camshaft lobes may be ground with a milder rise and overlap. Too much overlap can lead to water ingestion. Its one of the reasons some big gas engines are rated at lower HP than their automotive brethren.
__________________
so many projects--so little time !!
Blue Stocking is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 22-09-2013, 09:29   #6
Registered User

Join Date: Oct 2011
Posts: 2,432
Re: Interchangeability of tractor version with marine diesel 4107

The marine or industrial version of a particular engine may have a slightly different cam grind, and governor setting than that same engine in a truck or taxi, but from my limited experiance with a marinized automotive Mercedes engine in a boat, it wont make any significant difference. In fact, the Mercedes engine in my boat, which started in a sedan, was one of the nicest diesels that I have owned. As has been already said, NUMBERS MATTER. ____Good Luck ________Grant.
__________________
gjordan is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 22-09-2013, 11:37   #7
Nearly an old salt
 
goboatingnow's Avatar

Cruisers Forum Supporter

Join Date: Jun 2009
Posts: 13,649
Images: 3
Re: Interchangeability of tractor version with marine diesel 4107

Just be aware that there are loads of minor variants of Perkins engines around.

Furthermore while its true that many engines are marinations of automotive or truck engines, its not true that in all cases base parts are interchangeable. Many engines are significantly tweaked by big marinizers like Yanmar and Volvo Penta. Head, pistons, cranks, cams, etc are often difficult, tweaked or modified in some way.

Its not an area for the uninformed to tread.

Dave
__________________
Check out my new blog on smart boat technology, networking and gadgets for the connected sailor! - http://smartboats.tumblr.com
goboatingnow is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 24-09-2013, 12:20   #8
Registered User

Join Date: Feb 2012
Location: Ireland, French canals/Med/Spain
Boat: Birchwood Centre Cockpit 33, Broom Shannon Class 42 flybridge.
Posts: 476
Re: Interchangeability of tractor version with marine diesel 4107

I agree with goboatingnow but would respectfully add that small Volvo diesels (up to 30 hp) along with Case engines amongst others are built in Perkins Engine factories. Like wise Yanmar use Toyota base engines as well as other Japanese manufactured engines.
When Perkins update their engines the parts are generally replacements for older designs and are interchangeable, some for engineering reasons and some for environmental. For example the 'new' big end bearings are now lead free but as a result the replacement has more than twice the working life of the old superseded part. If in doubt and you need part numbers you can download a workshop manual free online.
I hope this helps you.
__________________
Irish rambler is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 24-09-2013, 13:48   #9
Registered User

Join Date: Oct 2011
Posts: 2,432
Re: Interchangeability of tractor version with marine diesel 4107

It amazes me that a manufacturer could make a bearing that will last twice as long, but didnt do it until an environmental issue required it. Even if the new bearings cost twice as much to make, I dont think it would make a big difference in the cost of a new engine. It is also nice to see an environmental issue that improved an engine rather than making it more complicated and less reliable. It sounds like a great thing. _____Grant.
__________________
gjordan is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 24-09-2013, 18:09   #10
Registered User

Join Date: Feb 2012
Location: Ireland, French canals/Med/Spain
Boat: Birchwood Centre Cockpit 33, Broom Shannon Class 42 flybridge.
Posts: 476
Re: Interchangeability of tractor version with marine diesel 4107

Yep, I guess its called progress. I'm not sure of the regulations in the US on particulate emissions but here in Europe it was the ever tightening regulations that drove the engine manufacturers to the common rail diesel because they couldn't reduce the emissions by mechanical means.
__________________
Irish rambler is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 24-09-2013, 20:02   #11
Registered User

Join Date: Oct 2011
Posts: 2,432
Re: Interchangeability of tractor version with marine diesel 4107

I live in California, and the regulations here have been the cause of a fair amount of the unemployment in this state. Diesels before a certain year have to be upgraded to a new smog standard that costs between $12000, and $20000, depending on the vehicle. last year I saw a beautiful Peterbuilt tractor and double flat beds go for $5000 at auction. It was sold to another state where it will probably work for many years. A huge Caterpillar generator that was big enough to run a small city, went for $15000 to a contractor that was building a hotel in Africa, and could not depend on the local power supply. The rules have hit the big boats in the state at replacement time, but I dont think they are saying that you cant run it anymore until an upgrade. Farmers with engines over 50 HP are getting hit. I am not opposed to the govt. or to environmental regulations if they are reasonable, but damn, cant they do this in a reasonable manner. Do we all want to upgrade our old Volvo,Perkins,Yanmar engines even tho, we are a grain of sand in the environmental problem. Sorry for the rant. _____Grant.
__________________

__________________
gjordan is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply

Tags
diesel, marine

Thread Tools
Display Modes Rate This Thread
Rate This Thread:

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are Off
Pingbacks are Off
Refbacks are Off




Copyright 2002- Social Knowledge, LLC All Rights Reserved.

All times are GMT -7. The time now is 01:58.


Google+
Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.8 Beta 1
Copyright ©2000 - 2017, vBulletin Solutions, Inc.
Social Knowledge Networks
Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.8 Beta 1
Copyright ©2000 - 2017, vBulletin Solutions, Inc.

ShowCase vBulletin Plugins by Drive Thru Online, Inc.