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Old 30-04-2016, 05:33   #46
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Re: In need of new engine - What do you think/what is your opinion?

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Originally Posted by hsi88 View Post
If you plan to keep the boat and want to go with an outboard, do yourself a favor and don't get a john boat motor. Hanging over the back to start the motor, shift gears and throttle is a HUGE PIA.

More money, but a "real" sailboat outboard will give you remote throttle and shifting and can be set up for remote steering as well (stick or wheel). For the money, you also get power tilt and a good size alternator for charging your batteries.

Suzuki 9.9 HP DF9.9BTL
It's not so bad on a Bristol 27 because you have easy access to an engine on the stern, and you only have to get back there during docking. You can reach both the motor's tiller and the boat's tiller

Plus, if you want to remove the engine and relocate it to the stern rail possibly, it's pretty simple without all that extra hooked to it (remote steering, etc)

Remote steering, throttle control etc is just more stuff you don't need on the boat

It takes about two minutes or so to clear the slip then the engine is lowered all the way down and locked then you simply steer with the boat's tiller or autopilot (or just raise sails, go to autopilot, and raise the engine)

I use solar (100 watts) to charge the two 12 volt batteries I have in parallel. I didn't need the starter battery anymore after I bought a small outboard so I had an extra battery.

No need to run the engine to charge the batteries with solar......


But, if you are going to mainly motor your sailboat then that's another story...
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Old 30-04-2016, 06:04   #47
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Re: In need of new engine - What do you think/what is your opinion?

Sounds like it is dropping a cylinder. Poof of smoke is when dead cylinder starts working again and burns of the excess gas and oil.

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It's a 2 stroke Mercury - 15hp.

When we got it(came with the boat), one spark plug cable was bad, so i had replaced that along with the plugs and the impeller. I also had changed the oil in the lower end as well.

When we took the boat out for a test run after redoing this work, it took us out to the bay just outside of Everett marina and wasn't having issues going up to 1/2 throttle.

Once we got out to the bay, we had sailed for a few hours then we decided it was time to head in. On return, the engine was running fine(had 0 wind), then after about 5 minutes of running at 1/2 throttle it started to bog down. I immediately switched to neutral and let it catch itself and thats when the "poof" of exhaust came about. Every time we revved up and it'd bog down it'd do the "poof" when it would catch itself at the idle speed(too much unburned gas in the cylinder creating the smoke poof?).

I did NOT replace the fuel filter(will be giving that a go this week/weekend), and will likely purge the external fuel tank for some new ethanol free fuel. I'll also be cleaning out the carb when i replace the fuel filter.

Other than this issue that we are seeing, the engine runs fine. I guess the third option that I can look into is getting an extra leg extension for this engine after getting it to actually run beyond idle.
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Old 03-05-2016, 16:42   #48
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Re: In need of new engine - What do you think/what is your opinion?

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Originally Posted by thomm225 View Post
It's not so bad on a Bristol 27 because you have easy access to an engine on the stern, and you only have to get back there during docking. You can reach both the motor's tiller and the boat's tiller

Plus, if you want to remove the engine and relocate it to the stern rail possibly, it's pretty simple without all that extra hooked to it (remote steering, etc)

Remote steering, throttle control etc is just more stuff you don't need on the boat

It takes about two minutes or so to clear the slip then the engine is lowered all the way down and locked then you simply steer with the boat's tiller or autopilot (or just raise sails, go to autopilot, and raise the engine)

I use solar (100 watts) to charge the two 12 volt batteries I have in parallel. I didn't need the starter battery anymore after I bought a small outboard so I had an extra battery.

No need to run the engine to charge the batteries with solar......


But, if you are going to mainly motor your sailboat then that's another story...
I will agree its a PITA hanging off the back to control the motor. But as you said, your only back there for a short period, or unless your engine gives you troubles.

I dont think remote steering/throttle is really needed unless your on a power boat. Sure sailboats have engines, but the convenince of it is not worth it IMO.

One i am debating about going with diesel over a gas OB is purely because living in the PNW, I know winds are incredibly light during summer, and these boats are a tad bit heavy for light wind sailing, which means I have a feeling we'll be motoring more than we truely want to. I also am concerned about the currents here as I have been told some areas can have 7-8knts of current. Coming from the south pacific I have never had to deal with major currents before.

On the other hand, I am discussing with someone about a Universal diesel that is being pulled from an Ericson 32. He isn't sure on HP range, but quite possibly could be a good size and price(around $2500).
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Old 03-05-2016, 17:21   #49
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Re: In need of new engine - What do you think/what is your opinion?

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On the other hand, I am discussing with someone about a Universal diesel that is being pulled from an Ericson 32. He isn't sure on HP range, but quite possibly could be a good size and price(around $2500).
The question would be ...why is it being pulled?

It's your choice though. A new 2016 outboard or some old diesel possibly 40 plus years old
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Old 03-05-2016, 18:07   #50
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Re: In need of new engine - What do you think/what is your opinion?

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The question would be ...why is it being pulled?

It's your choice though. A new 2016 outboard or some old diesel possibly 40 plus years old
The boat was surrendered to a yard due to not being able to make payment. Yard sold it to cover back costs and the person that bought it is a salvager who strips all parts off it, sells the lead and trashes the hull and sells everything he strips off.

We all know diesels are stinky, and one that is maintained will last just as long.

The same can be said about these exact boats that we are discussing. Why buy a 40+ year old boat instead of a 2016 model?
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Old 03-05-2016, 18:24   #51
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Re: In need of new engine - What do you think/what is your opinion?

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The same can be said about these exact boats that we are discussing. Why buy a 40+ year old boat instead of a 2016 model?
You are joking right? You are comparing an old engine to an old boat?

A 40 year old fiberglass boat such as a Bristol 27 is cheaper, stronger, and most likely will last longer and is more seaworthy than a newer much higher priced boat of similar size.

A 40 year old diesel will most likely not last as half long as a new 2016 4 stroke outboard especially with the great oil we have these days

Here's a 2008 30'Hunter for $62,500

https://moreboats.com/boats/hunter/31/27375

I paid $2,000 for my Bristol 27 then added a 2012 4 stroke outboard after two 40 year old diesels failed. Then added a new mainsail....

HUNTER 31-2 sailboat specifications and details on sailboatdata.com

BRISTOL 27 sailboat specifications and details on sailboatdata.com
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Old 03-05-2016, 22:27   #52
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Re: In need of new engine - What do you think/what is your opinion?

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You are joking right? You are comparing an old engine to an old boat?
I never said that the cost of maintaining a diesel of such age is cheaper, i merely stated they will last just as long given proper maintenance.

Yes a 4 stroke OB is cheap, but talking directly about longevity, a diesel of such age should be able to perform just as well given the proper maintenance. They have solid cast iron blocks and often the heads are also cast iron, though now days the heads are becoming aluminum. That doesn't mean all other parts are reliable, but that is where maintenance comes in. Again I never said anything about cost of maintaining these things. As these new generation of OB come to maturity and age, I would suspect parts over a long term(far longer than diesel i bet) are going to be just as costly as an old diesel.

The benefit of a diesel? The engines are often found outside of the marine industry, giving you a wide range of industries to find parts...

Though just like with anything, maintenance is key, and again I am not stating that a diesel is cheaper to maintain than a gas outboard.

Comparing price of a 2008 hunter to a Bristol seems widely unfair considering the Bristol has had time to depreciate in value while the new boats haven't.

Yes the bristol is solid fiber, while the hunter is probably a foam core, in theory the core should never become rotted if proper measures are taken, which in turn greatly increases the longevity of the boat. Your not going to be running the boat up onto docks, or run it aground at 8kts and be able to pull it off and continue on sailing like nothing happened, but one should strive to never have that happen, regardless of the boat being solid fiber or not.

On the bright side with the Bristol, atleast you will be able to float away knowing there is likely very little damage and the haul out can wait till you get to your destination.
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Old 03-05-2016, 22:31   #53
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Re: In need of new engine - What do you think/what is your opinion?

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I paid $2,000 for my Bristol 27
I forgot to mention in my last post that your photos are quite lovely! Were they taken when you took ownership? What model do you have?

That glossly hull and the beautiful lines of a B27 make me drool! No boat built in today's day and age has the look and feel of any plastic classic boat!
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Old 04-05-2016, 04:40   #54
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Re: In need of new engine - What do you think/what is your opinion?

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Originally Posted by chowdan View Post
I forgot to mention in my last post that your photos are quite lovely! Were they taken when you took ownership? What model do you have?

That glossly hull and the beautiful lines of a B27 make me drool! No boat built in today's day and age has the look and feel of any plastic classic boat!
I was very lucky with this boat.

It was so cheap because the PO had passed. (Estate Sale, but there was no For Sale sign on it) He left the boat near here after a two year cruise to Florida and possibly the Bahamas from Massachusetts.

It was loaded with stuff and appeared to have been totally gone over carefully before that cruise which I didn't totally discover for a month or two being new to monohulls. He had owned the boat for maybe 20 years or more and was an "Old Salt" according to the retired Coast Guard fellow that owned the marina where I bought the boat

It made sense though. As lots of cruisers on here speak of prepping their boats for cruising. replacing all bad hoses, rigging, etc.....the stuffing box packing even looked quite good

The picture on the hard is from when I bought it in 2011 where it had been sitting for 5 years. (after new bottom paint) The interior has been changed a bit but it was the dinette model at some point. The table etc was stuff onboard also

The other picture is from last year after I had completely sanded off all the paint down to the 40 year old gelcoat. I then roll and tipped it with Pettit Easypoxy $85.00. It was like 2 days after. It's not that glossy now. It was off white semigloss paint 3108 I believe

Btw, I got to use my boat with the diesel (Bukh 10) a few times. There's really not a lot of difference as compared to my 5 hp 4 stroke

One thing for sure though, it's much easier than a diesel to come and go from the dock in most any condition because you can rotate the outboard through 90 degrees


Below picture is how I found it
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Old 04-05-2016, 05:11   #55
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Re: In need of new engine - What do you think/what is your opinion?

Also, have you checked out this Bristol 27 Site

http://www.bristol27.com/category/bristol-specific


here's a pretty B27 from that site: Looks like he has his outboard in the well. Maybe?

http://www.bristol27.com/bristol-spe...ll-second-wind
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Old 04-05-2016, 05:38   #56
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Re: In need of new engine - What do you think/what is your opinion?

Check out the yacht atom website and I guess he has a new company website. He has put a lot of outboard wells into boats like yours. He would run a 6hp tohatsu in you boat $1500. Will sail a lot better assuming you can retract the leg all the way.
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Old 23-05-2016, 15:32   #57
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Re: In need of new engine - What do you think/what is your opinion?

@thomm - I'm sure your going to be happy to hear. I pulled the trigger on a 2016 4 stroke Merc 9.9hp. Has the "command thrust" lower end(2.42:1 ratio), with the 4 blade high thrust prop.

Merc is also offering $200 mail in rebate with 5 year warranty. Question now stands, how much can my bracket hold, and how should I go about beefing it up to support the added ~20lbs.
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Old 24-05-2016, 01:25   #58
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Re: In need of new engine - What do you think/what is your opinion?

If you are willing to accept drastically reduced performance, the 5kw electric with generator will work for getting in and out of a slip. For a small older boat for local day sailing, that can be perfectly acceptable.


Keep in mind that 2kw generator is probably only rated at 1.6kw continuous, so you start with only around 6hp, and if you go much more than an hour, you are going to be limited to around 2hp. If it's dead calm with no current, that will work but any kind of head wind, current or waves and its not going to do much.


PS: How much does your boat heel and how much out of horizontal can the generator handle without oil issues?
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Old 24-05-2016, 06:04   #59
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Re: In need of new engine - What do you think/what is your opinion?

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@thomm - I'm sure your going to be happy to hear. I pulled the trigger on a 2016 4 stroke Merc 9.9hp. Has the "command thrust" lower end(2.42:1 ratio), with the 4 blade high thrust prop.

Merc is also offering $200 mail in rebate with 5 year warranty. Question now stands, how much can my bracket hold, and how should I go about beefing it up to support the added ~20lbs.
Nice.

I hope it works out for you. I was a bit worried about the weight of a 9.9 hp (83lbs) and thought I could get away with a smaller one (5 hp, 57 lbs) since I had never had a sailboat with an engine before. (four beachcats that I day sailed and raced).

Plus the 5 hp Merc had the 25" extra long shaft which combined with an 11" swing on the bracket gets the motor quite deep in the water

There's a guy at our dock though that has a 9.9 hp Four Stroke Yamaha (same weight as yours) on a Catalina 27 and it appears to sit perfectly normal (level) in the water.

I try and keep my forward water tank nearly full to keep the boat slightly nose down so the cockpit drains properly and the boat sits right in the water. The sails take care of that underway

As far as brackets, a heavy duty Garelick (or Panther) 4 stroke bracket would be great but they are expensive. I have a Panther 2 stroke bracket rated for up to 115 lbs, two stroke engines up to 20 hp. I'd buy a Panther Heavy Duty four stroke bracket if I had it to do over. Also make sure the bracket is mounted low on the stern. I had a wedge shaped piece of wood made to level out the bracket where it mounts to the stern also.

2 Stroke vs 4 Stroke Outboard motor mounts
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Old 24-05-2016, 10:30   #60
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Re: In need of new engine - What do you think/what is your opinion?

One more thing, try and find an adjustable bracket with a 14" swing or more especially if your shaft is 20". See link on CF above. Some of those guys have brackets with swing/lift of 15" plus. That would be great

I have a 25" shaft and adjustable bracket with an 11.5" swing I believe.....which works in most conditions but sometimes I have to sail.

In really bad conditions where there isn't a lot of room (narrow channel etc), I sail with the motor running and let the overrev governor handle engine popouts
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