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Old 02-10-2015, 01:37   #1
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Identifying a Hurth (I think) Gearbox

Hi there, I have this transmission and it is playing up so I would like to order parts. Trouble is it has no name plate or ID marks on it that I can find

It looks like a lot of Hurth boxes on google images but trouble is mine has the gear changer is on the top and all of the HBW150s I can see on google have the changer on the side .

Can any wise people help my work out what model this one is?
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Old 02-10-2015, 04:09   #2
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Re: Identifying a Hurth (I think) Gearbox

A picture is worth a thousand words!!


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Old 02-10-2015, 04:30   #3
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Re: Identifying a Hurth (I think) Gearbox

So sorry!!!! I guess no pics makes it pretty tricky!

How about now?

Sorry about the image rotation, both of these are from above but either side of the engine, will try again...
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Old 02-10-2015, 04:37   #4
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Re: Identifying a Hurth (I think) Gearbox

Right way up, I hope...

Looks like a Hurth but the shifter is on top. Is there a serial number somewhere? can't find anything (doh!) I should add it's on a Perkins 4108.
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Old 02-10-2015, 16:10   #5
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Re: Identifying a Hurth (I think) Gearbox

I have a Hurth HBW 360 gearbox fitted to my Perkins 6354 and it has the gear select mechanism top mounted. It looks very similar to the one in your pics except for the actual gear shift attachment method. This might give you a starting point, at least.
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Old 02-10-2015, 16:17   #6
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Re: Identifying a Hurth (I think) Gearbox

If it has no drive in forward but OK in reverse it might be a ZF Hurth. I have had 3 go bad in 5 years. Admittedly in the Pacific heat.They do not seem to hold enough oil, maybe get too hot. Maybe the oil cooler might help.

The one sent to Tonga arrived with an oil leak! Started to make a strange high pitched sound. I replaced the oil and it got me back to Australia with much nursing. That one was reconditioned, not new.

As an aside on The Tonga one, it took a month to get that box to Neiafu. I got to know the people at Customs well. They had a pile of stuff not collected by yachties over a long period. Could not wait I guess. Anyway they gave me a list of owners for that stuff. I wen to the Mermaid Restaurant which was the unofficial yacht club, now burned down. They went through the list. Unfortunately they advised that one addressee would not be collecting, he was taken by a tiger shark a mile or two south of the harbour entrance.
Neiafu...Vava'u cruising does not get better. (Sharks are very rare in the Pacific, I mean the ones that bight). Not the case lately here in Australia.
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Old 02-10-2015, 16:32   #7
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Re: Identifying a Hurth (I think) Gearbox

YUP, dats a Hurth.
Looks like a later HBW-2.
Rugged box and worth rebuilding
May have to search about for anthing other than clutches and bearings.
If you will be motoring a lot you might want to make a cooler to bolt on the side. The cooler can be a simple box with ears to allow bolting to the side of the trans. -- run either fresh or raw water thru it and it will transfer enough cooling to keep the box below 140 f even on long runs.
Use a NON- synthetic auto trans fluid in this trans.
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Old 02-10-2015, 19:41   #8
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Re: Identifying a Hurth (I think) Gearbox

Thanks Guys!

Delmo, thanks, that one does have the shifter on top but the shape is slightly different.

Captain Mitch, can you give me any more help with the model number? I can't find any reference to a HBW-2 anywhere.

If I can't find a model number from the look of it, what might be the next step? Would there be a serial number stamped inside somewhere or something?
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Old 03-10-2015, 03:03   #9
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Re: Identifying a Hurth (I think) Gearbox

Looks like a Hurth to me. I had a Hurth HBW100 that was playing up and so got it replaced with a new ZF10 and still had a few problems. I reconditioned the old one $650 at the time for the parts and took it with me on our cruise up to Queensland.
I became somewhat of an expert at removing and fitting the gearbox after spending many a happy hour behind the engine in wonderfully cramped conditions.
It is worth the rebuild, so take it apart and take to ZF in western Sydney if that's feasable, to get the new clutch plates etc.
Good luck
Michael
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Old 03-10-2015, 13:38   #10
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Re: Identifying a Hurth (I think) Gearbox

Quote:
Originally Posted by micknor51 View Post
Looks like a Hurth to me. I had a Hurth HBW100 that was playing up and so got it replaced with a new ZF10 and still had a few problems. I reconditioned the old one $650 at the time for the parts and took it with me on our cruise up to Queensland.
I became somewhat of an expert at removing and fitting the gearbox after spending many a happy hour behind the engine in wonderfully cramped conditions.
It is worth the rebuild, so take it apart and take to ZF in western Sydney if that's feasable, to get the new clutch plates etc.
Good luck
Michael
Hi Michael

Wow there are two of us experts at changing Hurth and ZF gearboxes

I also changed from the Hurth HBW 100 to the ZF10M box which has slight difference in the gear ratio but has not been a problem, however I have found by changing the oil every 100 hrs or 12 months whichever the sooner has made a big difference, I also changed the R & D drive plate at the same time when I changed the boxes over 2 years ago.
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Old 03-10-2015, 14:19   #11
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Re: Identifying a Hurth (I think) Gearbox

Sorry,
Looking again I'd vote for it being a HBW30-2.
I have some info on it , but will have to scan it and send.
I do not believe that you will find any identifying marks on the box if the glued on ID plate is missing (it would be right on the top).
All of the clutch parts and tension springs atre still available from ZF
the bearings are from Timken or any major bearing co.
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Old 03-10-2015, 15:54   #12
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Re: Identifying a Hurth (I think) Gearbox

I changed my ZF 10 for one of these...a PRM 120
PRM 120D Drop Centre Gearboxes
As I remember, if interested check the figures, it was a tiny bit longer, but I had to lift the engine 10 mm. Adjust and shim. Clutch problem solved. Airfreight from UK was surprisingly cheap. For some reason I do not remember paying any import taxes.
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Old 04-10-2015, 16:33   #13
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Re: Identifying a Hurth (I think) Gearbox

Quote:
Originally Posted by captain mitch View Post
Sorry,
Looking again I'd vote for it being a HBW30-2.
I have some info on it , but will have to scan it and send.
I do not believe that you will find any identifying marks on the box if the glued on ID plate is missing (it would be right on the top).
All of the clutch parts and tension springs atre still available from ZF
the bearings are from Timken or any major bearing co.
Thanks all again so much!
Captain I have sent an enquiry to ZF, if they are no help, I might ask for your help with the info you have. Tranny is working today fingers crossed. Lots gears yesterday but it was the split pin on the shifter falling out, hilarious! Fixed proper now
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Old 05-10-2015, 11:50   #14
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Re: Identifying a Hurth (I think) Gearbox

If it is the HBW series one of the best things you can do to extend the service life is to use synthetic ATF, also someone suggested installing a cooler that is a great improvement. These gears don't hold much fluid and anything you do to help them run cooler will make them last longer, the synthetic helps as does adding a cooler which increases the amount of fluid, change it every 100 to 120 hours. I have the HBW 450 gears and have learned all I can about them, the one thing I know a good clean lubricant is cheaper than buying parts or a new gear. Good luck


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Old 05-10-2015, 19:57   #15
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Re: Identifying a Hurth (I think) Gearbox

Thanks everyone again! Patprice thanks for the recommendation for the PRM from asap supplies, I've used them before and they were great. Looks like ti would be a good fit.

The boat is new to us and I hadn't changed the fluid in the tranny yet and after I started suspecting trouble I have now. Came out brown Changed it twice now with a brief run (five minutes) in between changes.

Went out on the boat over the weekend and was very sparing with engine use. It behaved well (Except when the shifter slit pin fell out but that happened while on anchor so no dramas).

The original symptoms were a racing engine which could be shut down with the stop handle easily. This turns out to have been bad fuel, starving the governor. I've dumped the fuel, scrubbed the tank, replaced all filters and lines. I really got the feeling during that drama that the tranny was slipping too. In any case with the brown fluid, i would love to get the rebuild parts on board.

The search continue. If I don't hear back from ZF (which would be a worry) I will try ZF in Sydney (thanks Michael) and yes a cooler of some kind wil be on any future list
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