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Cheechako · 23-07-2013, 18:21

Quote:

Originally Posted by sailorchic34

Yes I would do the rod bearings too. Pooped and messy for the 6 day in a row. Yuck. Have not heard back from the yanmar dealer if the .10 over is available. One sleeve might be cheaper then over size.

Not really, they have to bore it to sleeve it anyway, and you already need a new piston/rod assy.

model 10 · 23-07-2013, 18:26

Quote:

Originally Posted by nimblemotors

You can't just bore the one cyl to oversize and get one new piston and rings?
Do they not make oversize or not sell the parts separately?

That kind of thing is not usually done unless you are cheating.
Any kind of ridge that you can feel is going to need the max oversize. So, you would probably need to use a sleeve to keep things about the same.

**sailorchic34** · 23-07-2013, 19:03

Quote:

Originally Posted by Guy

That kind of thing is not usually done unless you are cheating.
Any kind of ridge that you can feel is going to need the max oversize. So, you would probably need to use a sleeve to keep things about the same.

That's what the car guy helping me today said too. There is some question weather going 10 over would get rid of the gouge caused by the failed oil ring/ land. There is another deep but shallow pit where top of second ring lands at TDC, but its small and does not extend down the cylinder like the oil groves do.

Note that there is no ridge at #1 and #2 cylinders, just light scuffing in a few places. #3 the broken piston, just popped right out the top. Both 1 &2 came out the top too. According to the old car/marine guy who saw it this morning, the #3 cylinder is majorly messed up.

Original honing is still seen in both good cylinders. Plus ring gap is still well with in maintenance standard. So will most likely just rering 1 &2. That keeps things stock. Got to talk to the machinist to see if its better to go with a sleeve on #3 and keep #1 #2 with a light honing. Then use new standard size piston for #3/ rings and big end bearings all around. plus oil seals, gaskets, etc, etc. Don't want to go to 20 over on all three just because one piston failed.

fjwiley1 · 23-07-2013, 19:39

Good decision on sleeving #3 to sock, light honing of 1 &2, then you'll rock and roll again soon.

This has been a good thread......lotta respect shown by all.....

S/V Water Wings

RaymondR · 23-07-2013, 19:55

With only 1100 hours and no lip at the top I don't think you will have a problem with cylinder bore wear.

I am wondering whether somehow or other a small amount of water may have found it's way into the damaged cylinder, corroded the top ring to the cylinder wall and that when the engine was cranked the corroded section of the top ring sheared out and started a cascade of land failures then the other rings?

cheoah · 24-07-2013, 04:11

Quote:

Originally Posted by RaymondR

With only 1100 hours and no lip at the top I don't think you will have a problem with cylinder bore wear.

I am wondering whether somehow or other a small amount of water may have found it's way into the damaged cylinder, corroded the top ring to the cylinder wall and that when the engine was cranked the corroded section of the top ring sheared out and started a cascade of land failures then the other rings?

+1 on that. The mounts seem pretty corroded for a 1000 hour installation, but not sure how long it has been in there. It does seem to be a lot of carnage and can see some rust in the block too. Did it sit unused for a long time in salt air?

Wish someone from MAck Boring would contribute to the thread. Or contribute a new engine

Keep ip the good work with the repair.

brutb · 24-07-2013, 05:17

"Wish someone from MAck Boring would contribute to the thread. Or contribute a new engine

"

Keep up the good work with the repair.

OR
Yanmar could step up to the plate with a sleeve, new piston and rod, new rod bearing and a complete gasket set. It would do a lot to improve their image for this motor. The cost to them would be minor and I can tell you now that the readers of this forum would be sending Yanmar a lot of thanks and well done emails. I am surprised that the west coast distributor of Yanmar has not received a few emails on this problem.
COME on YANMAR. step up to the plate on this one. Sailor Chick deserves a break from you on this problem.

**HappyMdRSailor** · 24-07-2013, 06:02

Thread drift... This whole thing sucks donkey....

Make sure you save all of the 50+ pieces of #3 piston assy ....

And mail a letter with 1 piece a week to Yanmar ....

**Jim Cate** · 24-07-2013, 06:20

Quote:

Originally Posted by Cheechako

.1? wow, that's alot. I'm thinkin .030.... is that damage that deep?

Actually, I think that you will find that 0.1 mm is .003937+ inches, not .030!

Jim

**sailorchic34** · 24-07-2013, 07:41

The engine was installed in 1994. I've a survey from 1995 showing it as a new engine, and another from 2002. In late 2007 when I purchased it, it had about 300 hours on it. I've put 700 hours on it since then and was out sailing every week or two most of the time. More so the last three years.

So it sat a lot like many boats do. The rust I think came from a leak in the raw water side but not sure. I did touch up the paint in 2007, but not very well.

Oddly enough the transmission looks pretty new.

Just sent yanmar an email with a link to this thread.

You know it would have been nice if I could have ordered parts online, but that does not look possible on the west coast of the USA. The East coast folks have it so easy..

sy_gilana · 24-07-2013, 08:54

Hey Sailorchick. I know you have certain financial constraints, but I want to give you some advice. If you have the engine torn down to this state, please don't do a half baked job. If it were mine, I would do everything and do it 100%. There are going to be balance problems, load problems, all sorts of unforeseen things. Imangine a crankshaft with 120degree journals and 2 pistons weighing in differently from the third.

Now, to the money. You have some 3000 readers of this thread, nearly 100 commenters. I know you cannot solicit money on this forum, but what if someone else did? What If I stated that I never met you, don't know you, and probably never would. Then, if I went on to say "Why don't you open a Paypal account?" Then, you can tell me, here, what that account number was, and maybe, just maybe some forum users could kick a few $$ your way. 5 here, 10 there, it all helps.

Then of course you could send photos of the job in progress, with you in a bikini, playing with your pistons to the contributors as thank you emails.

Would that work for you?

On a practical note, did you see any pitting on the sleeve of the lowest piston? and was that piston the one with broken lands? if so...Yanmar are going to say that hydraulic hammer (water in the cylinder) is what broke the lands.

I hope this idea works, and you get to do a proper rebuild on your engine. I know that cruisers are a tight fisted bunch, but hey, some of them out there still have day jobs, maybe they could help ya along, you are most entertaining...

**sailorchic34** · 24-07-2013, 09:43

The piston that broke was the highest and farthest from the exhaust. Engine has a slight slope towards the exhaust, so I would expect that water entering would have trashed the lowest/closest to the exhaust elbow and not the one furthest away. Thats whats so odd about it.

BTW I have looked at the discharge elbow, it's the loop up type, and it does not seem to have any issues. That is no leaks between the water inlet and exhaust inlet. Though I will look at that again.

Though others have commented on that it looks like water damage. Just don't know how that happens. I've a racor 500 filter and have never seen any water in the bowl either.

While I would never ask for money, should I somehow receive pennies from heaven, lord knows, I would not turn it away. Gee I would love it if a 3gm block and pistons, rings fell into my lap. Ideally already together. Hint. hint.

Of course, I don't even have a bank account anymore, let alone a paypal account. I must be dragging down the average net worth of the boating public, all by myself. Pretty sure I'm in the lowest 0.01 percentile of net worth, on this forum.

Its such a daunting task working on this and I'm only a 1/3 of the way through to having a working engine again. It's been a pretty high stress week and I am totally exhausted today.

Gee just having the $%^&* special tool that is needed to remove the nut next to the governor weights, would make my day. I'm thinking, I'll need to take a 36mm socket and have it cut and the two parts welded to a pipe at a machine shop. I really hate special tools, when I've just about down to having the $%^Y& block torn down. Sometimes I think Yanmar learned diesel construction from Mercedes-Benz. Though I like the geared timing arrangement.

I pretty sure my body has passed its "best if used by date". At least in regards to Bikini's anyway. Maybe a nice cat photo instead would work

. Of course, Mr. Timmy, AKA "grumpy cat", is definitely past his "best if used by date".

**roverhi** · 24-07-2013, 10:31

Water enters the combustion chamber through an open valve. Doesn't matter what the height of the cylinder in relation to others. It'w where in the rotation cycle that the engine stopped if and when water floods in through the exhaust. Still no reason to assume that the problem was caused by water ingress without evidence. It's nearly impossible to get an engine started with enough water in a cylinder to cause hydraulic lock. I did it on my old Volvo by activating the compression releases and getting the engine started on one cylinder before dropping the compression release on the offending cylinder. Yes, it was a very stupid thing to do.

The Yanmar mounts on my engine were very rusty after 10 years in the boat. No direct contact with salt water, just atmosphere in a boat.

Is there a Yanmar dealer in your area or one that is following this thread who might rent you the tool that you need to get the flywheel nut off??

**sailorchic34** · 24-07-2013, 11:19

Quote:

Originally Posted by roverhi

Is there a Yanmar dealer in your area or one that is following this thread who might rent you the tool that you need to get the flywheel nut off??

There are a few yanmar dealers down in the central bay. But that's a two drive away and I have to make arrangements for someone to drive me down there. Most of my trips to the bay are by boat, a more civilized mode of travel if a little slower.

There is a welder nearby. So if I can fine a 36mm socket and a 1-1/2 steel pipe 6 inches or so long, I can have it (a really deep socket) made pretty quick, without descending into the central bay craziness.

I checked the discharge elbow again and its fine. That is no leaks/ burn through between the exhaust inlet or raw water inlet. Plus I cleaned out the carbon in the exhaust side of the elbow with a small chain (dog chain size) threaded through the exhaust port, running it back and forth. So it should be fine...