Cruisers Forum
 


Reply
  This discussion is proudly sponsored by:
Please support our sponsors and let them know you heard about their products on Cruisers Forums. Advertise Here
 
Thread Tools Search this Thread Rate Thread Display Modes
Old 30-06-2008, 07:21   #1
Registered User
 
Little Otter's Avatar

Join Date: May 2008
Location: Augusta, GA
Boat: Ranger 22, currently saving for a larger cruising boat
Posts: 550
Images: 3
Here's an idea

I posted a thread on food asking if anyone put a still on their boat and Knotybouyz gave me the idea of using moonshine for fuel but i think it would only work on gas engines but its cheaper than gas at $4 a gallon.
__________________
Sailing and exploration are necessary for life to endure
Little Otter is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 30-06-2008, 12:43   #2
Senior Cruiser
 
Alan Wheeler's Avatar

Cruisers Forum Supporter

Join Date: Dec 2003
Location: Marlborough Sounds. New Zealand
Boat: Hartley Tahitian 45ft. Leisure Lady
Posts: 8,038
Images: 102
It's already done and it's called Methanol and I imagine cheaper than moonshine :-) But yes it will only work in Petrol Engines.
__________________
Wheels

For God so loved the world..........He didn't send a committee.
Alan Wheeler is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 30-06-2008, 13:00   #3
Registered User
 
Little Otter's Avatar

Join Date: May 2008
Location: Augusta, GA
Boat: Ranger 22, currently saving for a larger cruising boat
Posts: 550
Images: 3
Thanks for the reply Mr. Alan I appreciate what you said.
__________________
Sailing and exploration are necessary for life to endure
Little Otter is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 30-06-2008, 18:34   #4
Registered User
 
Therapy's Avatar

Join Date: Jul 2007
Location: W Florida
Boat: Still have the 33yo Jon boat. But now a CATAMARAN. Nice little 18' Bay Cat.
Posts: 7,086
Images: 4
It can also ruin fiberglass tanks, fuel hoses, gaskets, etc.
Therapy is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 30-06-2008, 19:14   #5
Registered User
 
Little Otter's Avatar

Join Date: May 2008
Location: Augusta, GA
Boat: Ranger 22, currently saving for a larger cruising boat
Posts: 550
Images: 3
Talking

Oh i'm sure it could,but think of it this way if you ever runout of water you can always drink the engines fuel without killing yourself!
__________________
Sailing and exploration are necessary for life to endure
Little Otter is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 09-07-2008, 10:09   #6
Senior Cruiser
 
sandy daugherty's Avatar

Cruisers Forum Supporter

Join Date: May 2008
Location: near Annapolis
Boat: PDQ 36 & Atlantic 42
Posts: 1,178
Bad idea Otter. The first product of a still in Methanol.
Methanol is toxic. If you are not already impaired, you are likely to throw up most of the methanol you consume, which will dehydrate you.
Wikipedia says:
'Alcohol has been known to mitigate the production of the ADH (antidiuretic hormone), which is a hormone that acts on the kidney, favoring water reabsorption in the kidneys during filtration. This occurs because alcohol confuses osmoreceptors in the hypothalamus, which relay osmotic pressure information to the posterior pituitary, the site of ADH release. Alcohol makes the osmoreceptors signal as if there was a too low osmotic pressure in the blood, which triggers an inhibition of ADH. Consequently, one's kidneys are no longer able to reabsorb as much water as they should be absorbing, leading to creation of excessive volumes of urine and subsequently overall dehydration.'
Dehydration is not a desireable result if you're original problem was not enough water.
Your intent was to stay alive, not to opt out.
sandy daugherty is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 09-07-2008, 10:11   #7
Registered User
 
Stranded Mariner's Avatar

Join Date: Sep 2007
Location: Shanghai, China
Boat: Dix 43 CC, steel, 43 ft
Posts: 149
Send a message via Skype™ to Stranded Mariner
On top of that, drinking methanol makes you blind.
__________________
'How inappropriate to call this planet Earth when it is quite clearly Ocean.' - Sir Arthur C. Clarke
Stranded Mariner is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 09-07-2008, 10:40   #8
Registered User
 
CaptHead's Avatar

Join Date: Jul 2008
Location: Los Angeles, CA
Boat: Grand Banks 42 Classic - Heads Up
Posts: 109
Images: 1
Send a message via Yahoo to CaptHead
I think you meant ethanol which is being added to gas now in ratio's of 10% ethanol to 90% gasoline. There are many problems with ethanol as a fuel, one it absorbs water, two it eats most fuel lines, tanks, gaskets, rubber parts, etc and third it gives a 25% loss in power.

This means if you burn 3 GPH now you will burn 4 GPH to go the same speed and HP rating.

Overall not a good source for fuel. I might add that a boater has sued the oil companies for the destruction it did to his engine and fuel system. It will be interesting to see how this law suit goes. It might stop all ethanol for marine applications.
__________________
Captain Head
1966 Grand Banks 42 Hull #17
Twin Ford Lehman Diesels
Sterling LP over Epoxy
Life is Great, Skip the Beach
CaptHead is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 09-07-2008, 11:16   #9
Sponsoring Vendor
 
Tellie's Avatar

Community Sponsor

Join Date: Oct 2007
Location: Hollywood, Fl.
Boat: FP Athena 38' Poerava
Posts: 3,984
Quote:
Originally Posted by Stranded Mariner View Post
On top of that, drinking methanol makes you blind.
The no no list gets longer for the lonely sailor.
Tellie is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 09-07-2008, 11:50   #10
Registered User
 
Cowboy Sailer's Avatar

Join Date: Aug 2007
Location: on the boat. Gulf Coast
Boat: C&C 38'
Posts: 351
Images: 2
I must disagree with CaptHead on several points but he raises some good issues. I think that Wikipedia has a very good discussion about ethanol as a fuel. It is true that that ethanol/gasoline blends must be a richer fuel/air ratio than straight gasoline. It is true that fuel systems need to be designed for the ethanol in ethanol/gasoline blends.
In my opinion corn is a good food and a bad fuel feedstock. But, a little ethanol can be a very good thing to add to gasoline. Some plants can be much better ethanol producers than corn.
__________________
Jerry and Denver
Happy Old cruisers!
Cowboy Sailer is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 09-07-2008, 14:44   #11
Registered User
 
CaptHead's Avatar

Join Date: Jul 2008
Location: Los Angeles, CA
Boat: Grand Banks 42 Classic - Heads Up
Posts: 109
Images: 1
Send a message via Yahoo to CaptHead
All my points are verifiable.

Here is a much better alternative to ethanol. It is called Butanol. ethanol only has 2 carbon atoms and as such it is a weaker alcohol as fuel. Butanol has 4 carbon atoms and has almost the same BTU per gallon as gasoline. In fact, you can use Butanol as a direct replacement for gasoline powered cars with no power loss, no destruction of fuel systems and storage problems.

Let me address the storage problem with ethanol. It can't be sent in pipelines so it can only be trucked. That causes air pollution, higher costs, etc. Butanol can be shipped by pipeline.

A car run on 100% butanol has emission tests showing it produces no Sox or Nox, thereby yielding additional significant environmental benefit. The same can be said about ethanol but running a car on 100% ethanol will result in a 25% decrease in fuel mileage.

I know the cars of today are built with ethanol resistant rubber, gaskets, plastic and fuel lines so a newer car/boat isn't going to see a problem.

I have an 8 HP Johnson and I always run the engine with the fuel line off so it runs out all the fuel in the carb. It is a 2001 and I bought it new. Last year I left the fuel line attached on a three day weekend and it softened the rubber on the float valve seat which in turn made it not run properly and in fact it stopped running.

I had to buy a new carb gasket set and I specifically asked if it was ethanol resistant, they told me it was and all the new sets are now. Builders are catching up.

My last boat was a gas inboard and I had a computer that did MPG, Miles covered, GPH, etc. It had an inline measuring device which was FFA cert. at 99.9 gals per 100 for accuracy. It softened and almost filled my boat with raw gas, all from only a 9.9% mix of ethanol. The fuel dock was Union 76 and they don't have to report ethanol until it is a 10% mix. I called the mfg of the computer, told them what happened and they had a new alcohol resistant one made and shipped by the next week.

Please look up butanol and what they are doing with it and spread the word. It is made from biomass just like ethanol and I read they have improved the yield now to where it is cost effective and can be a viable alternative green fuel.
__________________
Captain Head
1966 Grand Banks 42 Hull #17
Twin Ford Lehman Diesels
Sterling LP over Epoxy
Life is Great, Skip the Beach
CaptHead is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 09-07-2008, 14:52   #12
Registered User
 
CaptHead's Avatar

Join Date: Jul 2008
Location: Los Angeles, CA
Boat: Grand Banks 42 Classic - Heads Up
Posts: 109
Images: 1
Send a message via Yahoo to CaptHead
BUTANOL

ButylFuel,LLC Main Page


__________________
Captain Head
1966 Grand Banks 42 Hull #17
Twin Ford Lehman Diesels
Sterling LP over Epoxy
Life is Great, Skip the Beach
CaptHead is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-07-2008, 11:34   #13
Registered User
 
coot's Avatar

Join Date: Feb 2006
Posts: 367
Images: 2
Quote:
Originally Posted by CaptHead View Post
A car run on 100% butanol has emission tests showing it produces no Sox or Nox, thereby yielding additional significant environmental benefit. The same can be said about ethanol but running a car on 100% ethanol will result in a 25% decrease in fuel mileage.
Look on the web site ButylFuel,LLC Main Page : 110,000 BTU/gallon in butanol, vs 84,000 BTU/gallon in ethanol. The ethanol car sees about 25% fewer miles per gallon because there is 25% less fuel in a gallon of ethanol. Unless you are concerned about range between refuelings, there isn't really any difference there at all.

People usually equate "decreased fuel mileage" with "increased operating cost", but that is only valid if you are paying the same amount for fuel.

For example, that company's web site says butanol costs $6.80 per gallon in a 55 gallon drum. If you can get ethanol for less than about $5.19 per gallon, then you get more miles per dollar with the ethanol.

They claim they have a new patented technique that reduces the cost of producing butanol. That may change the price of butanol, but I'll believe it when I see it.
__________________
Mark S.
coot is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-07-2008, 11:52   #14
Registered User
 
CaptHead's Avatar

Join Date: Jul 2008
Location: Los Angeles, CA
Boat: Grand Banks 42 Classic - Heads Up
Posts: 109
Images: 1
Send a message via Yahoo to CaptHead
I think that web page is dated but it goes to show you, some people are hard to convince.

New Techniques Create Butanol, A Superior Biofuel

This is dated 1/28/08
__________________
Captain Head
1966 Grand Banks 42 Hull #17
Twin Ford Lehman Diesels
Sterling LP over Epoxy
Life is Great, Skip the Beach
CaptHead is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-07-2008, 12:09   #15
Moderator Emeritus
 
David M's Avatar

Cruisers Forum Supporter

Join Date: Sep 2007
Location: Eastern Tennessee
Boat: Research vessel for a university, retired now.
Posts: 10,406
I think it is dumb idea to use the food we eat for generating Ethanol. All it has done is driven up the cost of corn and done virtually nothing to clean up the air.

Hi Cowboy Sailor....FYI, I really need to strain my eyes to read that font. My monitor is a high quality one and I just got a new eyeglass prescription! Just thought I would let ya know.

David
__________________
David

Life begins where land ends.
David M is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply

Thread Tools Search this Thread
Search this Thread:

Advanced Search
Display Modes Rate This Thread
Rate This Thread:

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are Off
Pingbacks are Off
Refbacks are Off


Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
What About This Idea? Canibul Boat Ownership & Making a Living 50 15-08-2009 10:41
Just an idea........ David_Old_Jersey Forum Tech Support & Site Help 3 22-04-2008 11:51
Just an Idea seafox Other 13 24-06-2007 14:41
idea for watermaking northerncat Plumbing Systems and Fixtures 22 04-01-2007 03:27
Just how insane is this idea? Tspringer Monohull Sailboats 22 09-11-2006 14:43

Advertise Here


All times are GMT -7. The time now is 23:04.


Google+
Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.8 Beta 1
Copyright ©2000 - 2024, vBulletin Solutions, Inc.
Social Knowledge Networks
Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.8 Beta 1
Copyright ©2000 - 2024, vBulletin Solutions, Inc.

ShowCase vBulletin Plugins by Drive Thru Online, Inc.