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Old 19-02-2009, 22:45   #16
TOM
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Boracay, Chief Engineer, Thanks for your ideas i suspect that i may have got everything right but in doing so have not left enough grunt in the batts {2x120 amp cranking brand new} .I have noticed before that there is a very fine line between having enough charge or not .However the idea of taking the batts out 30kg each and bringing them home to charge is not that apealing as i'm on a swing mooring and not at a marina . The motor is a 1979 wortham blake fisherboy {brittish leyland} starts first time every time before now that is!
Interestingly i was going to spend the $25,000 to repower with a volvo or yanmar but both mechanics said i was mad cause the motor was in such great condition 2500hrs since rebuild 7 years ago.
Anyway i think making sure the batts are o.k is my next step will let you know how i get on.

Tom.
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Old 20-02-2009, 12:29   #17
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If it ran OK before and now it won't, really not much to blame but air in the lines.
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Old 22-02-2009, 23:26   #18
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My normally reliable motor refused to start this weekend. I cracked open the injectors and saw fuel pumping out, the battery is new (previous sail) and was turning the engine over like a champ.

I'm scratching my head and holler over at our neighbor Chuck; he says fuel, compression and air, thats all you need....

So I look closer at the air intake and the grill protecting it is covered in a thick grime.

After cleaning she fired right up, we went out and had a blast.
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Old 23-02-2009, 03:05   #19
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CHECK THE ENGINE KILL SWITCH>
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Old 23-02-2009, 07:57   #20
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+1 on checking air filters and kill switches, but this topic started with "I changed fuel filters and now it won't start". I'd go with air in the lines in this case. But, yep, for general "it won't start" woes - the comment about needing air, fuel, and fire is spot on.
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Old 23-02-2009, 08:27   #21
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It was running befor you changed the filtre, just befor the filtre change, or months befor. It sounds like air in the lines, but I wonder if you do not have bad fuel??
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Old 23-02-2009, 09:37   #22
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if it is a yanmar you did not need to bleed to the injectors ... only to the fuel pump. i assume it was running fine before you changed the filter? are you sure the lift pump is ok?
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Old 23-02-2009, 10:53   #23
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Does your engine have a electric kill switch? make sure there is 12 volts to the solenoid with key in on/start position. I had a problem with the metering bar that the solenoid controls in a Perkins. That problem developed during storage without treated fuel. A loose or bad wire would also keep selenoid from operating. The fuel would be sent to return line and not to the cylinders. If the solenoid is working you should be able to hear or "feel the throw of the piston". Due to lousy fuel in US I NOW add transmission fluid to diesel for conditioning. I was convinced I had air in my system, spent 2 weeks looking for "air" turned out to be metering bar in injector pump. Pump had to be removed and soaked overnight in treated fuel, after 24 hours metering bar was again working. I added a conditioner to the fuel, however bar stuck closed prevented treated fuel from getting into pump or injectors. I changed fuel lines etc. thinking air, it was not air but it was very frustrating
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Old 23-02-2009, 12:23   #24
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Diesel engine does not start

Most likely air but you have checked and rechecked. Sometimes it is the combination of different problems that contribute to poor starting, eg. First air in the lines fail to start then recheck and do it properly but now too much water in aqua lift back pressure now batteries not turning over fast enough etc. One other cause not mentioned is lower compression caused by tight intake valves, if valves never seat properly allowing compression to escape out the intake filter which robes pressure so Diesel does not explode to give compression. I had an engine that ran ok but became harder to start I checked the valve clearance and for some reason the clearance was not .040 but .000
Once adjusted, starts easy. See if you can borrow a battery to jump start. Some thoughts from fellow suffer. Good luck.
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Old 02-03-2009, 02:16   #25
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At last we are up and running again !.I would like to say thanks to all your advise I have learnt alot about diesels in the last few weeks alot of that thru this forum. In the end I had to call in the mecanic.Well he bleed the fuel system [same as i had done a dozen times} it still did not start even though fuel was getting right up to the injectors .He then noticed that one of the glow plugs was a bit dodgy we ended up replacing all four of them at $135 each OUCH!!! {they were getting old} .He was more then confident that he could get us started with new glow plugs {we had to wait 24 hours for delivery} He put them in and guess what managed to break one off and got stuck inside the cylinder .By this stage we ,especially my wife were getting more then a bit depressed .There is somethig very sad about a sailboat or any boat that can't move under there own power and we were starting to feel that sadness.As things were not looking good the head mechanic was called in .REMEMBER THIS HAS ALL HAPPENED AFTER CHANGING THE SECOUNDARY OIL FILTER!
He managed to extract the offending glow plug bit after some effort .Then put the whole thing back together ,still it would not start ,by this stage there was murmerings about compression problems which i knew was not true . The head mechanic disapeared and returned with a can of AEROSTART! I cringed and walked away while they sprayed ether into my faithful {up until now} diesel.
Yes
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Old 02-03-2009, 02:20   #26
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Yes it started and is going fine . Sometimes the old diesel might just need a bit of chemical help.
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Old 02-03-2009, 05:55   #27
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Please understand that nothing is fixed if you need to spray anything into the intake to start the engine. Moreover, not knowing what Aerostart is, I'll say that ether (chances are, that's what's in there) is death to diesel engines (it dilutes the fuel charge to the point where the rings scrape against the cylinder wall without lubrication, wearing down either the rings or wall, depending on which is softer - neither is good) and it's generally dangerous stuff to work with (too much ether in an enclosed space is literally a bomb looking to happen). If at all possible, use a hair dryer to inject hot air into the air intake, instead.

Finally, based on your recent note(s), it's time to pay the people who worked on your engine and then tell them to never come back. Based on your comments, again, nothing is really fixed. It's a very sick engine that won't fire on ether. If that's their "fix" for your engine, they're simply not competent mechanics.

Although most pros wouldn't snap off a glow plug, some days stuff happens, so we'll give these people a pass for that. Nonetheless, did you see them ever test the glow plugs to see if a) the old plugs ever heated up (they should glow red hot if they're working) and b) did they do the same test for the new plugs? It's possible that, while changing the filter, wiring was bumped and the plugs no longer work as they should.
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Old 05-03-2009, 18:16   #28
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Aerostart is ether...which should never be used...esp in a diesel engine with GLOW PLUGS!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

You posted that your batteries were on the down side......the amp draw of GLOW PLUGS is very high.......A marginall Battery would not heat the GLOW PLUGS up enough and once the starter engages....they are for all intents and purposes OFF.

If you continue to use ether....well....save your dollars for a big job.
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Old 05-03-2009, 19:10   #29
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Aloha Tom,
Let's hear how it starts from now on. I had to replace my glow plugs but found out how to test them. I had to replace the head of my engine after trying to start it with the injector pump timing being off. I've had to have the injector pump rebuilt. There isn't much I haven't done to my engine except rings.
A battery fully charged that will spin the engine very well is required. If you bleed to the injectors then bleed all of them. There can't be any bubbles in the fuel when bleeding. Once you see no bubbles then tighten that injector line and you hear it firing and there is a solid stream of fuel coming from the other injector lines then close each one in turn until they are all tight and the engine is running on all cylinders. Stand clear of anything that rotates while you are in the engine compartment. Don't be wearing a tie or long floppy sleeves.
Good luck Tom. No one is born knowing about diesel engines. We've all learned either by mistakes or by books. I learned by both.
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Old 05-03-2009, 20:02   #30
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Our Perkins 4-108 had been sitting idle in the boat on the hard for a year and a half before we bought her. With a fully charged battery she spun like a champ but would not start. Figured all the oil had drained to the sump and cylinder walls were completely dry, thus low compression. Gave her a very tiny squirt of ether and she fired right up. Has never had to turn over more than twice to start ever since. Also use ether during the winter on a Ford tractor engine. Neither engine has glow plugs. Ether does not have to be a disaster, or even damaging, but I have found I need to use the smallest (non zero) amount possible on the tractor. You'll know you've used too much if you hear any knock. The Boat has needed no help since this time last year. But I sure wouldn't use it with glow plugs as it will explode at the wrong time and could cause great damage.
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