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Old 28-07-2014, 12:48   #1
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Electrical Conversion

Hello!

I have a Cal 2-27 with a dead FARYMANN A30 Diesel.

I would like to remove the motor and put in an electric motor.

Does anyone know a good place with the best VALUE (so not necessarily cheapest) to buy a DIY kit or separate parts?

I found this online.... anyone know if it is any good?? >>Package MotEnergy ME-0709 Motor, Kelly 24-72V 500A Reversing/Regen Programmable Controller

THANKS
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Old 28-07-2014, 13:30   #2
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Re: Electrical Conversion

May be good idea to read everything you can on this subject then jump in speaking with experience.
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Old 28-07-2014, 13:53   #3
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Re: Electrical Conversion

I've long thought diesel electric could be an interesting approach for a sailboat, particularly a multi-hull. Have you thought about how you would charge the batteries? (diesel genset, I assume)? Of course, converting rotation to electricity and electricity back to rotation will take power through inefficiency -- have you considered what efficiency the system might have? You'll need an engine at least as large, in capacity, as the one you're taking out -- have you considered how much weight the generator and electric motor will take? On the other hand, if you're replacing a diesel auxiliary and a diesel genset with a single diesel genset, you might be saving on weight and space, but removing the advantages or redundancy. I'm not a motor expert, but if you're going for a DC system, I believe the best efficiency can be had from brushless DC motors -- and they have the advantage of no brushes to wear and need replacement. The link you provided is to a brushed motor -- old technology, less efficient, and more maintenance.
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Old 28-07-2014, 13:57   #4
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Re: Electrical Conversion

Growley is in the process of doing the conversion:

It Begins: Converting Cal 2-27 to Electric Propulsion!

Good luck
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Old 28-07-2014, 14:09   #5
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Re: Electrical Conversion

Thank you for the replies!

The current motor is shot, so I can't use it to recharge. Right now, there is a gap where all that rust is located going horizontally in the attached picture... the engine itself overheats. I could put the time and money into repairing it, but at the end of the day, it is still a 20 year old motor with hard-to-find parts. And it makes the boat smell terrible! I am living on board, and it is hard enough without the smell of diesel getting on everything.



I currently have two large solar panels on-board for charging the house batteries. Now I know that won't be enough to recharge batteries for an electric motor. But it is something. I was thinking of just using my little Honda portable generator to recharge the batteries, if I needed to do so while away from shore. I otherwise will just use shore power. I am going to be re-doing all the electrics, so I thought it would be wise to change out the motor while I have everything open and I am designing the system.

Now, I was also looking into having the rotational force of the propeller shaft while under sail be converted back into energy, using that inefficiency more effectively. I wanted a controller(?) or motor(?) that could handle that.

Other than that.... I'm still just trying to find a good kit to put together for the boat. I'll need a throttle, controller, battery set, motor, mounting brackets, cables.... and I think that's it....

I'm a college student, so budget is number one....

Thanks again for the advice!
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Old 28-07-2014, 14:20   #6
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Re: Electrical Conversion

Lots of people (well, some) sail without a motor at all -- perhaps you can do without external propulsion? The propeller you would want for regenerative charging would be MUCH larger than the one normally on a sailboat and would kill the sailing performance.

If your goals are to save space and money and still provide mechanical propulsion, have you considered simply fitting a gasoline outboard? With the plumb transom on a Cal 2-27 that shouldn't be too hard.
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Old 28-07-2014, 14:28   #7
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Re: Electrical Conversion

That's a good point. I didn't think about the size of the propeller needed...

And yeah, I've thought about it, but I am sailing in the SF Bay and coastal... I'm not sure if the outboard would work because it might rise out of the water in rough seas. Maybe a long shaft outboard? I also like making use of the propeller and shaft that are already on board. But yes, it is an option and one that I have been thinking about.

And the electric negs are that I would have to find some way of recharging the batteries... that's what the portable generator is for, but then again- there is another engine on board at that point.

Either way, I am looking to spend about
$1,000 on the electric motor and components (w/o batteries).... I feel an outboard would cost more and have more operational costs. But, anyone that can work on an engine can fix it. Only a few people can fix electrical parts... even then it's usually replace rather than repair.

I also like the simplicity and quietness and ease of use of an electrical motor. Once the boat is wired up, almost all maintenance is done!

Either way, it is a tough choice. But I am leaning towards an electrical motor at this point. Ce'st la vie...
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Old 28-07-2014, 14:32   #8
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Re: Electrical Conversion

For how long do you intend to motor? If it is just a few minutes to get off the dock, that is one thing. If you want mechanical propulsion for more than just a few minutes, you will need a way to feed the motor while underway -- the battery capacity required would be very large. If you're using a gas engine to run an AC generator to feed a battery charger to feed a brushed DC motor, I'd be surprised if you achieved 50% overall efficiency. Keep that in mind.
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Old 28-07-2014, 14:33   #9
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Re: Electrical Conversion

So long as you are realistic about range and recharging it is doable. The best option is to just plug into shore power to recharge. After that... The numbers aren't in favor of real range with electrical only. And a honda 2kw generator alone is going to blow thru your $1k budget.
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Old 28-07-2014, 14:42   #10
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Re: Electrical Conversion

Thanks Accomplice for the advice.

I already own a Honda generator. We recently replaced it with a larger one for our home in case of an Earthquake! (Pretty good timing to do a switch).

I was just going to plug the charger directly into the generator and then the charger connected to the batteries. I think that it would work pretty well... but that is a last case scenario. I am mainly going to use Shore Power! Other than that, it is good ol mother nature to push me along.

If anything, I was thinking about a 5kw motor... maybe slightly larger. I don't mind having batteries on board. I was thinking a bank of 3 AGM's to power my trips from out the marina and down the channel. Then maybe a little use if the wind dies and then again when anchoring... I think I could get a few hours run time at 3 knots. Nothing fast, just slow and steady...
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Old 28-07-2014, 15:01   #11
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Re: Electrical Conversion

Electric Seas - A Resource For The Electric Boating Community

Check it out. There's a couple of decent forums you can hook up with from this site & get all the info you're looking for.

Bob
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Old 28-07-2014, 15:05   #12
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Re: Electrical Conversion

Quote:
Originally Posted by SailerMatt View Post
Hello!

I have a Cal 2-27 with a dead FARYMANN A30 Diesel.

I would like to remove the motor and put in an electric motor.

Does anyone know a good place with the best VALUE (so not necessarily cheapest) to buy a DIY kit or separate parts?

I found this online.... anyone know if it is any good?? >>Package MotEnergy ME-0709 Motor, Kelly 24-72V 500A Reversing/Regen Programmable Controller

THANKS
It's too bad the Farymann isn't supported the way Moyer Marine does the A4. A sick Farymann is a good candidate for repowering. Rebuilding a Farymann would be quite a job, I think.

Remember you can not have a brushed motor if you have gasoline or propane accessories such as stoves, etc. The 0709 is a brushed motor. The 0907 and the 0913 and the 0201014201 are brushless. I am using the Kelly KBL48301 controller kit, with a 4201 brushless motor.

What reduction gear are you going to use? What batteries?

Regeneration from the prop is pretty iffy, especially if your top speed under sail is under 10kt. That of course includes practically all cruising boats under 45 feet under normal conditions. SOME regeneration is possible, but it won't be much. Charging the Batts takes a multi pronged approach... solar, wind, regen, and generator. Charging from shore power is often the primary charging method. A portable gas generator is not very fuel efficient, but the unit is cheap and light, and a 2kw or bigger unit is enough to help you limp home in an emergency. Mostly, you just don't use the prop except when maneuvering in close quarters. An electrically driven prop has advantsges, but range is not one of them. So figure on doing practically no open water motoring.

My boat is also a 2-27 but mine had an Atomic. Leaky gas tank was the final straw... I had enough, and I had been planning to go electric for some time anyway. There is another member who has completed electrification of a 2-27 and seems happy with it.
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Old 28-07-2014, 15:37   #13
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Re: Electrical Conversion

Motor ME0913 MotEnergy 24-72 volt 700 amp Brushless PMAC BLDC

Glad u made me revisit the cloud electric sIte. This is practically a giveaway price on the 0913 motor, which is definitely all the power you would ever need for a Cal 2-27. See the Kelly Controller site for a suitable controller kit, and get a 2 to 1 reduction drive, run it at 72v, and you will have a great setup. I suggest a Kelly KBL72301 or 401 controller. You will have plenty of reserve power for when you really need it. Thunderstruck has a reduction belt drive, and you can fine tune the reduction ratio by changing pulleys. If you would rather have an enclosed gearbox, Electric Motor sports has a pretty cheap unit at 2:1 or 3:1 ratio. Unless you are swinging a pretty big prop I suggest 2:1.

There are a lot of options for batteries but I think the most cost effective is GC-2 golf cart batteries from Sams Club. Your Cal can carry plenty of battery weight so no need to pay 3x or more for higher tech and quality batts.
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Old 28-07-2014, 16:22   #14
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Re: Electrical Conversion

If you are in the SF Bay, I'd be glad to come help you convert your boat.
I have a few different motors you could use and would be under $1,000 no problem.
As I suggested to GM, a golf-cart motor is an inexpensive way to go, I have a controller for one that will be pulled out of my electric Porsche Boxster when the high power one goes in.
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Old 28-07-2014, 16:43   #15
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Re: Electrical Conversion

Wow, thank you very much for that information Growley. That's perfect. I'll order the parts soon and get moving on it! This is just the information I was looking for!

One more thing: how many Golf Cart batteries should I purchase? Run them in a series?

Also, what is a good way of mounting the electric motor?

What selections should I make on the Kelley selection? Like CAN Bus? heatsink? etc...

I will give you a hollar nimble if I run into any hiccups!
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