Difference? - Page 3

Chief Engineer · 11-05-2008, 16:11

Can I sell you a case of filters????

Just KIDDING!!!!!!!

Please don't tell us that you have Algae-X installed too.!!!!!

Seriously, tho' the customers I find that want these extensive systems (read overdoing filtration) are ones who have been either burned by bad fuel, or read (or most likely hear) horror stories about "bad fuel"

"It was a sark and dormy night, off the coast of East Bejeezus, we were close to the horal ceads, the blind was blowing at knorty fots out of the East Southwest.....suddenly and without warning (the same thing) our trusty Rolls-Canarrdley engine quit.

Extemporaneous · 11-05-2008, 18:47

Thanks for that.
Just KIDDING!!!!!!!

Quote:

Originally Posted by Chief Engineer

Can I sell you a case of filters????

Just KIDDING!!!!!!!

Please don't tell us that you have Algae-X installed too.!!!!!

Seriously, tho' the customers I find that want these extensive systems (read overdoing filtration) are ones who have been either burned by bad fuel, or read (or most likely hear) horror stories about "bad fuel"

"It was a sark and dormy night, off the coast of East Bejeezus, we were close to the horal ceads, the blind was blowing at knorty fots out of the East Southwest.....suddenly and without warning (the same thing) our trusty Rolls-Canarrdley engine quit.

GreatKetch · 11-05-2008, 19:20

I love the ALGEA-X. They are always good for entertainment. Doesn't anyone remember when they first started hawking there product? It "worked" by disrupting the cell walls of the microbes in the oil with their magic magnets. Now algea isn't the real problem.

So these days their magic magnets do magic chemistry instead of magic biology. P.T was wrong: There are hundreds born every minute.

JiffyLube · 12-05-2008, 00:10

Quote:

Originally Posted by Hud3

Don't you have a filter mounted on the engine itself?

Most boats have the engine-mounted filter, which becomes the secondary filter when a Racor is added as the primary, giving you two filters in series. You don't need three filters in series, and the Racor 500 MA has more than adequate capacity for your engine.

As Raptor Dance noted, plumbing two Racors in parallel allows you to switch over to the clean one instantly if the one being used clogs. A vacuum pressure gage tells you to switch before the engine lets you know by quitting.

My boat has a Pathfinder diesel, and the engine fuel filter is mounted on the engine room wall...not on the engine. I also have a racor in series with the Pathfinder filter.

JiffyLube · 12-05-2008, 00:19

Quote:

Originally Posted by never monday

Using a 2 mcn filter for primary filtration can cause a lean conditions and decrease the available power from the engine.
This topic has been debated many time on the forum alone.

Pathfinder Marine told me the same thing.

Extemporaneous · 12-05-2008, 17:28

Quote:

Originally Posted by JiffyLube

Pathfinder Marine told me the same thing.

With a Diesel engine, what does "lean" mean?
It can't have the same meaning as it does with a gas engine, can it?

JiffyLube · 12-05-2008, 18:07

Quote:

Originally Posted by Extemporaneous

With a Diesel engine, what does "lean" mean?
It can't have the same meaning as it does with a gas engine, can it?

I'm not very engine inclined, but I took it to mean that two small of a micron filter would restrict the required flow of fuel to the engine.

Extemporaneous · 12-05-2008, 19:02

Quote:

Originally Posted by JiffyLube

I'm not very engine inclined, but I took it to mean that two small of a micron filter would restrict the required flow of fuel to the engine.

I kind of thought that is what everyone meant, however, with a rated 60 gallons of fuel per hour, that should leave a little room to spare.
Now I suppose ANY plugged filter 30 micron or 2 micron would create this "lean" condition.
I can manage that, I'll change the filter when the vacuum becomes too great.
Thanks,
Extemp.

never monday · 12-05-2008, 19:04

remember, flow rate and burn rate are different for diesels.

A diesel typically will flow 5x the burn rate.

Therapy · 12-05-2008, 19:06

Quote:

Originally Posted by never monday

remember, flow rate and burn rate are different for diesels.

A diesel typically will flow 5x the burn rate.

What the 7734 does that mean?

never monday · 12-05-2008, 19:11

Quote:

Originally Posted by Therapy

What the 7734 does that mean?

I'm saying of the 100% of fuel delivered to the injector only 20% is used and the rest returned to the tank.
A fine filter up stream will clog quicker. reducing the fuel flow, reducing the power.

Extemporaneous · 12-05-2008, 19:18

Quote:

Originally Posted by never monday

remember, flow rate and burn rate are different for diesels.

A diesel typically will flow 5x the burn rate.

I agree, but I'm pretty sure that my Westerbeke 46 does not pump close to 60 gallons per hour through the system. Correct me if I'm wrong.

Extemporaneous · 12-05-2008, 19:39

Quote:

Originally Posted by never monday

I'm saying of the 100% of fuel delivered to the injector only 20% is used and the rest returned to the tank.
A fine filter up stream will clog quicker. reducing the fuel flow, reducing the power.

A couple of things:
Is there a more proper term then "lean condition" for this? Or is that the right term? In a gas engine lean would have to do with the fuel / air mixture and that is not really what we are talking about.
If it is the right term then let me know, it just seams that it would be more properly described as a fuel starved condition, just like a plugged filter.
To say that a finer filter would clog quicker is a given, but once ANY and ALL filters clog it starves the engine of fuel. I think running a larger micron filter in front of a smaller micron filter should cut down on extensive filter changing and give better filtration, would it not?
Would not running filters, 10 micron then 2 micron or 30 micron then 10 micron in series provide both better filtration and minimize premature filter changes? Clearly this would depend on what you are trying to filter through it, but all things being equal.

Therapy · 12-05-2008, 20:13

I agree Ext...
Sometimes this stuff gets over technical.
I think oversized 2 micron filters in paralell would be the best bet.
Something I don't like about the series thing unless you can see vacuum on each seprately.

JiffyLube · 12-05-2008, 21:40

Quote:

Originally Posted by never monday

remember, flow rate and burn rate are different for diesels.

A diesel typically will flow 5x the burn rate.

Was my assumption correct?
"I'm not very engine inclined, but I took it to mean that two small of a micron filter would restrict the required flow of fuel to the engine."

12-05-2008, 19:04	#39
never monday Commercial Vendor Join Date: Jun 2005 Location: Lake Lanier, GA Boat: Glouchester 22, SeaRay 340 under restoration Posts: 1,212	remember, flow rate and burn rate are different for diesels. A diesel typically will flow 5x the burn rate. __________________ www.inlandmarinediesel.com

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11-05-2008, 16:11	#31
Chief Engineer Registered User Join Date: Aug 2006 Location: North of Baltimore Boat: Ericson 27 & 18' Herrmann Catboat Posts: 827	Can I sell you a case of filters???? Just KIDDING!!!!!!! Please don't tell us that you have Algae-X installed too.!!!!! Seriously, tho' the customers I find that want these extensive systems (read overdoing filtration) are ones who have been either burned by bad fuel, or read (or most likely hear) horror stories about "bad fuel" "It was a sark and dormy night, off the coast of East Bejeezus, we were close to the horal ceads, the blind was blowing at knorty fots out of the East Southwest.....suddenly and without warning (the same thing) our trusty Rolls-Canarrdley engine quit.

11-05-2008, 19:20	#33
GreatKetch Registered User Join Date: Jun 2006 Location: Sausalito, CA Boat: Northstar 80/20, Fetchin' Ketch Posts: 343	I love the ALGEA-X. They are always good for entertainment. Doesn't anyone remember when they first started hawking there product? It "worked" by disrupting the cell walls of the microbes in the oil with their magic magnets. Now algea isn't the real problem. So these days their magic magnets do magic chemistry instead of magic biology. P.T was wrong: There are hundreds born every minute.

12-05-2008, 20:13	#44
Therapy Registered User Join Date: Jul 2007 Location: Florida Posts: 1,452	I agree Ext... Sometimes this stuff gets over technical. I think oversized 2 micron filters in paralell would be the best bet. Something I don't like about the series thing unless you can see vacuum on each seprately.