Diesel Engine Evaluation

[Eddiefuego]

I'm getting ready to tear into a Westerbeke 4-107 that has been sitting for a couple of years in Panama. I have some gasoline engine experience but little diesel. I've got a local mechanic who will provide assistance as needed, but the funds are limited. Question. How far into the engine do I need to tear prior to making a decision to run/rebuild/replace? She had some salt water half way up the tranny and to the starter but seems no higher. Starter was rebuilt. New battery, but have not been able to hand crank the engine as yet....will try today. Thoughts are welcome. Thanks

[perchance]

Pull the injectors and squirt some penetrating oil in the cylinders and allow to soak for 24 hours then try to bar the engine over by hand with the injectors out. Doing it dry may cause broken rings if they are corroded to the cylinder walls.

[Eddiefuego]

I don't have any more BP Blaster but I do have kerosine so will pour into injector holes and across the lifters. I'll let sit for a day or two and try to break it loose. I have a socket on the crankshaft nut now but it only backs off and retightens.

[perchance]

If you can get it to move even a little you can gradually move it back and forth till you get the full range of motion. Be patient and try not to force it too much till you get some movement.

[Dave852]

Better to remove the glow plugs to access the cylinders unless you are planning to rebuild or replace the injectors.

[donradcliffe]

Originally Posted by Dave852

Better to remove the glow plugs to access the cylinders unless you are planning to rebuild or replace the injectors.

glow plugs on a 4107 are rarer than hens teeth

[Eddiefuego]

No glows but thanks. Dumped right at 9 liters of water out of the crankcase....well...sucked it out actually. No movement on the flexhandle on the 1 1/8 socket. It looks dire. Wouldn't the water pretty well nail the crank bearings? What else? I would love to get this puppy going but I'm a little disheartened after dumping that much water out. Thoughts? There is a Perkins 4-108 that claims to be rebuilt for sale locally. If I check the rebuild what would a reasonable amount be to have someone take out the old engine and put in the perkins? I know there are a lot of variables...but if your would...make some assumptions. This is my first major "project".

[Eddiefuego]

Just a thought, but if I were to repower with a Yanmar what size would you go to? 27,000 lb

[bornyesterday]

Out of pure curiosity I looked around a bit and found this. Posting it because spares prices will presumably affect your decision whether to rebuild or replace - and because the low price of the kit was such a surprise to me.
No connection btw, never even heard of the company until now. Sadly they don't list Bukh parts.

Perkins 4.107 engine overhaul kit - £349.75 : Parts4Engines: Perkins Diesel Engine Overhaul Kits and Spares

[gjordan]

Eddie, with 9 liters of salt inside for several years, the chance of reviving that engine are slim to none. I would check to see if the Perkins that you mentioned has the same mounting foot print, since that would be an easy swap. Dont just trash the 107. Take off every possible part that you can salvage. I dont know what parts are interchangable with the 108, but what you cant have as spares, you can sell or trade. I dont envy working in that heat and humidity. Good Luck. ______Grant.

[Cheechako]

Originally Posted by gjordan

Eddie, with 9 liters of salt inside for several years, the chance of reviving that engine are slim to none. I would check to see if the Perkins that you mentioned has the same mounting foot print, since that would be an easy swap. Dont just trash the 107. Take off every possible part that you can salvage. I dont know what parts are interchangable with the 108, but what you cant have as spares, you can sell or trade. I dont envy working in that heat and humidity. Good Luck. ______Grant.

Yep, that engine is shot. You might find a replacement rebuilt 4-107 and use yours as the core.
BTW,if that much water in the boat... what are the bulkheads like below the waterline?

[Eddiefuego]

Originally Posted by bornyesterday

Out of pure curiosity I looked around a bit and found this. Posting it because spares prices will presumably affect your decision whether to rebuild or replace - and because the low price of the kit was such a surprise to me.£349.75 : Parts4Engines: Perkins Diesel Engine Overhaul Kits and Spares[/url]

Ok...that is quite a surprise to me too. So, we're talking MAJOR difference in cash here.

Would someone like to give me an educated quess and what i'd find if I start tearing this beast apart? POS? 50/50 rebuildable? How would I tell and at what point would I know to close it up and buy new or rebuilt??

[jimbunyard]

Well...2 1/2 gallons of salt water sounds bad, but it ain't necessarily so. No need to try and turn the engine over though, you'll probably do more harm than good. The engine has to come out anyway, so pull it, drop the pan and pull a rod brg. Bet they're not too bad. Even if they are, a crank can be ground, the question is at which point do you stop repairing and start replacing? When I first read your inquiry my thought was the governor would be a mess. Turns out that that engine is hydraulically governed, so no worries there (I think). But if the engine is well and truly seized, the pistons may be too corroded to use (but probably not). You will have to replace the liners, bearings, seals and oil pump, but as you know that is normal in a rebuild. Of course that is if you want to have an easy starting, full power engine. You may well be able to break the engine loose, but diesels are even more dependent on compression that gas engines, and any losses will definitely affect performance.

So to get to your question, it depends. There's a low hour 4-107 on ebay for 2750.00 right now. It's from a generator, but depending on how it's governed, it could be a direct replacement or you may have to swap your fuel pump. Of course it's used so
are you buying someone else's problems? My boats' engine is a Volvo MD2020 (Perkins M20) that I paid 400.00 for 3 years ago. It runs fine as purchased, no smoke, starts instantly. The only maintenance so far, besides oil and filter changes has been to rod out the exhaust elbow.

So if when you open it up and the actual bearing surfaces on the crank and cam shaft are pitted (not just coated or discolored) and/or any of the timing gears are pitted, I'd guess that, unless you have a friend in a machine shop, it might be time to start looking at the benefits of replacement versus rebuilding.

And of course that leaves the question "What is the intended use for the boat?" I realize this might be anathema to a lot of people, but I'd be much more inclined to use a boat with an engine I beat apart with a 2x4 and a hammer in a protected waterway than on a circumnavigation.

[Cheechako]

It might depend on how many hours are on it before it was waterlogged. Potentially you could tear it all apart, hone the cylinders if not too worn. put the new piston set etc in. Did the water get into the bearing surfaces and corrode into the crankshaft surfaces? etc etc. If not it's likely very rebuildable, but you will need to completely disassemble and clean it up/boil it out. New timing stuff etc. A big question is how is the injection pump? if it's water logged too... better off to just find a rebuilt engine maybe. Things start adding up..
inj pump, $2000?
injectors, $600?
gaskets +misc $250?
piston/rebuild kit, $1800?
head rebuild $600?
Timing set $200?
etc.... these are wild A** guesses....

[Eddiefuego]

Taking the head bolts out....the Tech manual gives no order but I've read I can crack the head if I do it wrong. Any words of wisdom here? Thank you for the previous comments.