Cruisers Forum
 


Join CruisersForum Today

Reply
 
Thread Tools Rate Thread Display Modes
Old 18-09-2015, 12:50   #1
Senior Cruiser
 
zengirl's Avatar

Cruisers Forum Supporter

Join Date: Jun 2014
Location: Florida
Boat: 1985 Freedom Mach1 32'
Posts: 292
Budget for Engine Removal

I know it will differ and I will shop around, but I need an approx figure for someone to hoist my atomic4 out and replace with Elco electric engine. No-Rewind is a 30' 1972 Bristol. I know all you handy men can do it yourself, but I don't have a prayer of doing that way. Thanks for all input.
__________________

__________________
"I'm an idealist. I don't know where I'm going, but I'm on my way." Carl Sandberg
zengirl is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 18-09-2015, 13:07   #2
Senior Cruiser
 
DeepFrz's Avatar

Cruisers Forum Supporter

Join Date: Mar 2006
Location: Winnipeg
Boat: None at this time
Posts: 7,930
Re: Budget for Engine Removal

zengirl, you can save yourself a bundle of money by disconnecting everything from the engine in preparation for removal. If the engine works maybe you can sell it for the cost of removal. Once everything is disconnected it is a simple, or maybe not so simple, matter of lifting it through the hatch. You may then wish to remove all the instrument wiring, fuel lines, etc. Then you can use the time before installing the electric motor to clean and paint the engine room to make it ready for the new gear.

You may also want to remove the fuel tank which may be a far more difficult thing.

I know this doesn't answer your question directly but its the best I can offer.


The more you can do yourself the less expensive it will be and the more to your liking.
__________________

__________________
The Blue Dot Campaign. This Changes Everything.
DeepFrz is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 18-09-2015, 13:11   #3
Marine Service Provider

Join Date: Sep 2012
Location: Annapolis aka sailing capital of the world
Posts: 525
Re: Budget for Engine Removal

Removing the relatively small and lightweight Atomic 4 is a pretty straightforward job that one mechanic can probably do by himself in four to eight hours and have that engine on the ground. A come-along, forklift or perhaps even halyard could do the work--two halyards better if possible. It should fit through the companionway. However, considering the age of the boat--how about sails, mast, spars and re-rigging before a new engine? Also--think long and hard about the pluses and minuses of an electric engine. You may very well need a new shaft, stuffing box and prop...many things to consider--many advantages to electric but some serious drawbacks too. You will need to remove the fuel tank and do a lot of serious battery and wiring work--and how will you charge those batteries? If the engine starts and runs, why not use it until it dies, and instead invest in sails, rigging and other items? The Atomic 4 was an awesome engine, very popular and reliable and many are still in use and get rebuilt and serviced...but think long and hard about recharging those batteries...how will you do it?
__________________
Paul Annapolis is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 18-09-2015, 14:31   #4
Registered User

Join Date: Feb 2013
Location: WY / Currently in Hayes VA on the Chesapeake
Boat: Ocean Alexander, Ocean 44
Posts: 922
Re: Budget for Engine Removal

My first thought was "Cool. Should be a fun project to go electric ." But, if you are not handy enough to remove the old engine I fear that you may get a huge amount of money tied up in fussing with the electric system with maybe or maybe not a satisfactory conclusion. If you only use your boat for day sailing it could be a good thing but the skills to make it work properly may be harder to find than some would lead you to believe.
__________________
darylat8750 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 18-09-2015, 15:35   #5
Registered User

Join Date: Dec 2014
Location: Brisbane, Qld, Australia
Boat: Fastback 43 catamaran
Posts: 179
Re: Budget for Engine Removal

Hardest part of engine removal is normally the actual removal from boat. It took me 30mins to disconnect motor and 2hrs with 4 mates and a forklift to remove a freinds engine.
I would love to know your reasons and expectations for going from a diesel to an electric. I would love to go electric but am keeping my diesel and am going to experiment with an auxiliary electric like a minnkota for when no wind or current.

Sent from my D6653 using Cruisers Sailing Forum mobile app
__________________
Sardean is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 18-09-2015, 15:46   #6
Registered User
 
boat_alexandra's Avatar

Join Date: Aug 2009
Location: chesapeake bay
Boat: bristol 27
Posts: 2,813
Re: Budget for Engine Removal

I could lift the engine with just one hand and I threw it out not to replace it with anything.
__________________
boat_alexandra is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 18-09-2015, 16:03   #7
Registered User
 
Kokanee's Avatar

Join Date: Jan 2013
Location: Adelaide Australia
Boat: Cuddles 30ft Motor Sailer
Posts: 216
Re: Budget for Engine Removal

Quote:
Originally Posted by zengirl View Post
I need an approx figure for someone to hoist my atomic4 out and replace with Elco electric engine.
Having just recently re-powered my boat with another diesel (after seriously considering going electric), I would suggest the following time estimates.

1. Disconnect engine - 4hours
2. Remove engine - 4 hours
3. Prepare boat for electric motor - 100 hours
4. Install electric motor - 4 hours

Step #3 is the big one. It involves removing old fuel tanks, lines, filters, engine mounts; setting up new mounts for electric motor, installing new battery boxes, rewiring, cleaning and repainting bilge, plus lots of other surprises all the way.
__________________
Kokanee is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 18-09-2015, 16:10   #8
Registered User

Join Date: Dec 2014
Location: Brisbane, Qld, Australia
Boat: Fastback 43 catamaran
Posts: 179
Re: Budget for Engine Removal

Quote:
Originally Posted by boat_alexandra View Post
I could lift the engine with just one hand and I threw it out not to replace it with anything.
You sound like my brother, he bought a yacht in Papua New Guineau, sold the motor ( to pay for provisions ect) and lived aboard for next 2 years finally selling boat in Brisbane still with no motor ( BTW been on water all his life and has skippers tickets so extremely experienced and lives like he was in last century has no electronics. Yes he is nuts) lol

Sent from my D6653 using Cruisers Sailing Forum mobile app
__________________
Sardean is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 19-09-2015, 09:33   #9
Registered User

Join Date: Jun 2015
Posts: 1,172
Re: Budget for Engine Removal

In the "Salish Sea" (pre-PC days: the Straits of Georgia and sundry adjacent waters) electric drive wouldn't work very well given the number of dead calm days we have in the summer. I would think that before Zengirl goes ahead with the conversion, she needs to do the math on the "horsepower hours" required to operate conveniently in her chosen cruising grounds. 1 hph = 1.5 x kWh, (approx). The calculation will tell her the minimum battery capacity required for her purposes. The battery capacity required to cross the Salish Sea the 26 seamiles from Vancouver to Nanaimo in a thirty footer would — off the top of my head — be more than a thirty-footer can reasonably carry.

Given the weight of batteries required, their installation will have repercussions for stability and trim. The calculations required to derive satisfactory results in these respects are most likely not in the ken of someone requiring "professional" assistance for so simple a job as removing a lightweight combustion engine.

"Fueling" would require checking in at a marina with 50 amp service, and even then would be a bit dodgy. Fitting the Atomic with a generator to do the job of charging the batteries reduces the whole concept to an oozly-woozly bird!

If Zengirl's desire to scupper the Atomic is prompted by "gassophobia", from which I myself suffer, I would suggest that converting to diesel is a far better bet. A good "runner" can be had for less that five grand and while coupling the shaft to the tranny of a retrofit diesel may require a different flange on the tranny, that is far from an insurmountable problem.

TrentePieds
__________________
TrentePieds is online now   Reply With Quote
Old 19-09-2015, 09:53   #10
Senior Cruiser
 
zengirl's Avatar

Cruisers Forum Supporter

Join Date: Jun 2014
Location: Florida
Boat: 1985 Freedom Mach1 32'
Posts: 292
Re: Budget for Engine Removal

Quote:
Originally Posted by boat_alexandra View Post
I could lift the engine with just one hand and I threw it out not to replace it with anything.
Now that's an idea!!!
__________________
"I'm an idealist. I don't know where I'm going, but I'm on my way." Carl Sandberg
zengirl is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 19-09-2015, 10:04   #11
Senior Cruiser
 
zengirl's Avatar

Cruisers Forum Supporter

Join Date: Jun 2014
Location: Florida
Boat: 1985 Freedom Mach1 32'
Posts: 292
Re: Budget for Engine Removal

Quote:
Originally Posted by Kokanee View Post
Having just recently re-powered my boat with another diesel (after seriously considering going electric), I would suggest the following time estimates.

1. Disconnect engine - 4hours
2. Remove engine - 4 hours
3. Prepare boat for electric motor - 100 hours
4. Install electric motor - 4 hours

Step #3 is the big one. It involves removing old fuel tanks, lines, filters, engine mounts; setting up new mounts for electric motor, installing new battery boxes, rewiring, cleaning and repainting bilge, plus lots of other surprises all the way.
Yes, #3 seems to be the biggest obstacle. The rewiring etc, I'm having second thoughts. God, it would be so nice not to have to fix engine, change this, change that, carry gas, quite. I have other things I can pay attention to and leave this for when all else is done. Thanks for input
__________________
"I'm an idealist. I don't know where I'm going, but I'm on my way." Carl Sandberg
zengirl is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 19-09-2015, 11:04   #12
֍֎֍֎֍֎֍֎֍֎

Cruisers Forum Supporter

Join Date: Apr 2006
Posts: 13,055
Re: Budget for Engine Removal

Put an ad on Craigslist:
"$400! ATOMIC4 BOAT ENGINE, fuel tank, cooling, spares. Must remove from boat within 48 hours after purchase."

Removing an engine is something any shadetree mechanic can do, cheap. INSTALLING a new custom configuration, with no idea of the mounting and bedding that has to be fabricated custom? Or the skill of the new installer at prop alignment, etc?

You don't go looking for prices on that, you try to find someone competent to do the job, and then negotiate their price. Even in the Keys, that should be a good trick.
__________________
hellosailor is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 19-09-2015, 11:24   #13
Moderator
 
Don C L's Avatar

Join Date: Sep 2014
Location: Channel Islands, CA
Boat: 1962 Columbia 29 MK 1 #37
Posts: 4,396
Images: 34
Re: Budget for Engine Removal

The Atomic 4 is not a diesel of course. I just did this with a friend on his Cheoy Lee 30. The disconnection might take a mechanic an hour. I'd like to see some photos of your engine. We took the boat over to the local hoist and it was out and in the back of a pick-up in 20 minutes. That was a diesel, Volvo MD7A, which is a little heavier than yours. If the engine is running well it is tempting to just say "free" and have someone take it out themselves, but smarter to ask a local mechanic to lift it out at the local hoist before offering it up. In my neighborhood I am guessing that would cost about $200. Ask around. As far as putting in an electric motor for your boat, adapting the mount would take a little work but the company selling the motor will likely help you with a mount that fits to replace an Atomic 4 since they are so common. But to me, the bigger problem is the batteries. Do you have a good fairly large and low place to mount them? I am guessing you only need the engine to get in and out of anchorage/harbor, not long distance motoring, right?
__________________
DL
Pythagoras
1962 Columbia 29 MKI #37
Don C L is online now   Reply With Quote
Old 19-09-2015, 11:25   #14
Registered User

Join Date: Jan 2014
Location: New Jersey
Posts: 464
Re: Budget for Engine Removal

Quote:
Originally Posted by zengirl View Post
I know it will differ and I will shop around, but I need an approx figure for someone to hoist my atomic4 out and replace with Elco electric engine. No-Rewind is a 30' 1972 Bristol. I know all you handy men can do it yourself, but I don't have a prayer of doing that way. Thanks for all input.
What's the reasons for deep sixing the Atomic 4?
Had one on my Ericson 27 and used it for years, the fellow I sold the boat
To used it another 3 years then we lost contact. Most likely still out there.
Parts, rebuild kits, upgrade kits, rebuilt engines, rebuild service and tons
of info
are all available from Moyer Marine.
People say there not so safe but your boat is still with us after 43 years.
I also believe BetaMarine makes a diesel that is just a drop in
Replacement for the Atomic 4
Cheers
__________________
Time2Go is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 19-09-2015, 11:28   #15
Moderator
 
a64pilot's Avatar

Cruisers Forum Supporter

Join Date: Oct 2013
Location: Albany Ga.
Boat: Island Packet 38
Posts: 17,062
Re: Budget for Engine Removal

Does it run? If so why remove it? If it doesn't unless it's seized, I'd consider fixing it, and probably even then.
Conversions are for experts, DIY'ers, they almost never work well right out of the box, usually always require significant tinkering. For the person that designed it and installed it, the tinkering is nothing, they know exactly where to go to look for that lose wire etc., but a person who didn't and doesn't have those skills will soon go broke paying for everything.
Lot of people badmouth a gas motor, and while I love my Diesel, a gas motor is probably a better motor if used for just short periods, they run much quieter and smoother, and are safe as long as they are maintained and risks understood, they are no more dangerous than a propane stove can be.

I understand the allure of an electric motor, but I think you would be better off with an outboard and have someone design an electric lift of something to lift it up if your not physically capable


Sent from my iPad using Cruisers Sailing Forum
__________________

__________________
a64pilot is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply

Tags
budget, engine, engine removal, removal

Thread Tools
Display Modes Rate This Thread
Rate This Thread:

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are Off
Pingbacks are Off
Refbacks are Off


Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
Budget for engine replacement pwillems Multihull Sailboats 30 19-02-2016 07:30
O'Day 30 table removal and settee removal biker6977 Construction, Maintenance & Refit 2 25-09-2014 09:40
Engine Bay Makeover - Rewiring - Including Engine Removal! blahman Electrical: Batteries, Generators & Solar 52 02-12-2009 10:01
Engine Blew Up! Possible Removal? riptide Engines and Propulsion Systems 11 11-11-2009 16:08
Engine removal?? kingfish Engines and Propulsion Systems 8 17-08-2005 03:11



Copyright 2002- Social Knowledge, LLC All Rights Reserved.

All times are GMT -7. The time now is 18:17.


Google+
Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.8 Beta 1
Copyright ©2000 - 2017, vBulletin Solutions, Inc.
Social Knowledge Networks
Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.8 Beta 1
Copyright ©2000 - 2017, vBulletin Solutions, Inc.

ShowCase vBulletin Plugins by Drive Thru Online, Inc.