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Old 14-03-2015, 23:00   #346
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Re: Why doesn't this beautiful catamaran sell?

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Originally Posted by TacomaSailor View Post
What is it?

Where is it?

How do I find out details?

I detest, hate, despise, and refuse to have anything to do with Facebook. I think it one of the most evil inventions of the last 100-years.


I find it quite amusing that in one breath the Op states that he does not want a Grainger or a Schionning, but in the next breath he wants to know all about the Schionning Sea Level posted above, perhaps he dosent even know what a Grainger or Schionning are. Perhaps some further education on cats is needed.
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Old 14-03-2015, 23:17   #347
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Re: Why doesn't this beautiful catamaran sell?

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I find it quite amusing that in one breath the Op states that he does not want a Grainger or a Schionning, but in the next breath he wants to know all about the Schionning Sea Level posted above, perhaps he dosent even know what a Grainger or Schionning are. Perhaps some further education on cats is needed.
Maybe he just found out his WIFE likes the Schionning.
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Old 15-03-2015, 07:03   #348
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Re: Why doesn't this beautiful catamaran sell?

Perhaps he has now only considered looking around at other vessels since his 'dream boat' has been sold?
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Old 15-03-2015, 09:35   #349
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Re: Why doesn't this beautiful catamaran sell?

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Originally Posted by thorcat View Post
I find it quite amusing that in one breath the Op states that he does not want a Grainger or a Schionning, but in the next breath he wants to know all about the Schionning Sea Level posted above, perhaps he dosent even know what a Grainger or Schionning are. Perhaps some further education on cats is needed.
I find it quite amusing that I had earlier said I was not interested in the Shionning in PV. Then someone posts Facebook pictures of a cat that I did not recognize so I asked 'what is it' - once identified I again said I was not interested.

Just came back from a 25-mile sail on a catamaran at 14-knots. Blew by a trio of 45'+ monohulls trying to beat round Pt Loma in 18-knots gusting to 30. We were pointing higher and sailing 2x faster, flat, dry, and laughing with no jib and double reefed main.

Previous day sailed a different catamaran 7-miles west of Pt Loma and back.

In the last four months we've been aboard:

- Hughes 58
- Brazzapi 51
- Helia
- Leopard 46
- Lagoon 440
- Lagoon 450
- Seawind 1160
- Leopard 39
- Maine Cat 31
- Reynolds 33
- Gemini 35
- Corsair F28 (?? it is a multi-hull)

Education enough?
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Old 15-03-2015, 13:06   #350
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Re: Why doesn't this beautiful catamaran sell?

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Originally Posted by TacomaSailor View Post
I find it quite amusing that I had earlier said I was not interested in the Shionning in PV. Then someone posts Facebook pictures of a cat that I did not recognize so I asked 'what is it' - once identified I again said I was not interested.

Just came back from a 25-mile sail on a catamaran at 14-knots. Blew by a trio of 45'+ monohulls trying to beat round Pt Loma in 18-knots gusting to 30. We were pointing higher and sailing 2x faster, flat, dry, and laughing with no jib and double reefed main.

Previous day sailed a different catamaran 7-miles west of Pt Loma and back.

In the last four months we've been aboard:

- Hughes 58
- Brazzapi 51
- Helia
- Leopard 46
- Lagoon 440
- Lagoon 450
- Seawind 1160
- Leopard 39
- Maine Cat 31
- Reynolds 33
- Gemini 35
- Corsair F28 (?? it is a multi-hull)

Education enough?
Strange I always thought that a headsail was very important to the pointing ability. What cat were you sailing in? I am impressed with that cat that can point better with a reefed main than big monohulls, I assume, correctly trimmed. The majority of the ones you have visited on the last months would not be a match to a good monohull in what regards pointing ability, not even with an head sail.
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Old 15-03-2015, 13:26   #351
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Re: Why doesn't this beautiful catamaran sell?

Plenty of monohulls don't point as well as claimed or supposed, as well! Or so I have found when going head to head. But, let's not hijack the thread.
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Old 15-03-2015, 13:33   #352
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Re: Why doesn't this beautiful catamaran sell?

Reynolds 33 with 7-foot dagger boards. The monohulls were all carrying too much sail and were alternately rounding up and getting knocked over. When I sail thru there in that kind of wind I have a reef in my main (40-foot monohull) and the genoa is rolled to 90%. The boats we were passing had full mains and 135% or bigger gennys. The reasoning, I guess, is that the wind around the point only lasts about a mile or mile and a half so why not sail thru overpowered?

The Reynolds sails like a dream with just a main - the jib is only 7/8 height and a 6-foot long foot so it is mainly used to direct air over the main. The boat has a 14-foot beam and is fast and delicate. So, in gusty conditions the owner gives up a knot or so of speed by furling the jib and leaving the 2nd reef in.

We still did 14-knots a lot of the time and surfed a bit in the swell coming around Pt Loma.
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Old 15-03-2015, 15:08   #353
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Re: Why doesn't this beautiful catamaran sell?

Quote:
Originally Posted by TacomaSailor View Post
I find it quite amusing that I had earlier said I was not interested in the Shionning in PV. Then someone posts Facebook pictures of a cat that I did not recognize so I asked 'what is it' - once identified I again said I was not interested.

Just came back from a 25-mile sail on a catamaran at 14-knots. Blew by a trio of 45'+ monohulls trying to beat round Pt Loma in 18-knots gusting to 30. We were pointing higher and sailing 2x faster, flat, dry, and laughing with no jib and double reefed main.

Previous day sailed a different catamaran 7-miles west of Pt Loma and back.

In the last four months we've been aboard:

- Hughes 58
- Brazzapi 51
- Helia
- Leopard 46
- Lagoon 440
- Lagoon 450
- Seawind 1160
- Leopard 39
- Maine Cat 31
- Reynolds 33
- Gemini 35
- Corsair F28 (?? it is a multi-hull)

Education enough?
Sorry, I posted the link to a Schionning. Didn't know you weren't interested. (Didn't read the whole thread.) Didn't know you were so anti - facebook.

Just out of curiosity, why the dislike for Schionning and Grainger? They seem similar in concept to the boat you were interested in.
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Old 15-03-2015, 16:06   #354
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Re: Why doesn't this beautiful catamaran sell?

I don't get the bias against Grainger at all. Tony Grainger would have to be one of the most successful multi designers of all time. And Schoinnings come in various sizes and philosophies, I don't particularly like G Forces but I do think the Wilderness is a great boat. Very interested to understand why the rejection of designers - as distinct from designs
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Old 15-03-2015, 20:35   #355
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Re: Why doesn't this beautiful catamaran sell?

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I don't get the bias against Grainger at all. Tony Grainger would have to be one of the most successful multi designers of all time. And Schoinnings come in various sizes and philosophies, I don't particularly like G Forces but I do think the Wilderness is a great boat. Very interested to understand why the rejection of designers - as distinct from designs
I said I did not like the Grainger - that particular boat!
I said I did not like the Schoinning - that particular boat!

I am not sure how this rush to advice has increased to a near crescendo - BUT - we've been sailing for over 40-years, we've been cruising off and on for 15-years, we've lived aboard off and on for 6-years.

We know what we want- we have visited hundreds of boats of different designs, we've cruised for months at a time with a wide variety of monohulls and catamarans. We've been on those boats for lunch, for drinks, for dinner, for parties, for maintenance, and to sail. We've spent many thousands of nights at anchor and have sailed more than 10,000 miles in the Pacific Ocean and 2,000 in the Atlantic. We've made five trips from Seattle to San Diego on four different boats. I've skippered at least 60 different boats over the years. We do know what we want.

We have personal prejudices, rational or not, they are ours! We will stick with those biases, pre-conceptions, and judgements based on a lot of experience.

The Grainger recommended to us did not ring a bell for us and we dismissed it as we dismissed the Schoinning in PV.

Why don't we just drop the suggestions and call this thread done?
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Old 15-03-2015, 20:41   #356
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Re: Why doesn't this beautiful catamaran sell?

TS,

Hope you can find a cat that ticks your boxes. Clearly you will know if you find one.

cheers
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Old 15-03-2015, 22:20   #357
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Re: Why doesn't this beautiful catamaran sell?

Guess I was just trying to help TS. I won't make that mistake again.
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Old 15-03-2015, 22:38   #358
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Re: Why doesn't this beautiful catamaran sell?

I am having trouble finding Reply's, how does this site work, cheers
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Old 15-03-2015, 22:45   #359
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Re: Why doesn't this beautiful catamaran sell?

Hi not sure how this site works seems like a lot of messages are doubled up etc and when I get a message saying I have a reply I can not find it cheers
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Old 16-03-2015, 06:47   #360
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Re: Why doesn't this beautiful catamaran sell?

Quote:
Originally Posted by TacomaSailor View Post

Just came back from a 25-mile sail on a catamaran at 14-knots. Blew by a trio of 45'+ monohulls trying to beat round Pt Loma in 18-knots gusting to 30. We were pointing higher and sailing 2x faster, flat, dry, and laughing with no jib and double reefed main.
It does help to not be 'overpowered',...and one of the reasons I have favored an all-furling sail arrangement. Reefing and then unreefing the mainsail, particularly single-handed, has never been one of my favorites.



Quote:
In the last four months we've been aboard:

- Hughes 58
- Brazzapi 51
- Helia
- Leopard 46
- Lagoon 440
- Lagoon 450
- Seawind 1160
- Leopard 39
- Maine Cat 31
- Reynolds 33
- Gemini 35
- Corsair F28 (?? it is a multi-hull)

Education enough?
Quote:
We know what we want- we have visited hundreds of boats of different designs, we've cruised for months at a time with a wide variety of monohulls and catamarans. We've been on those boats for lunch, for drinks, for dinner, for parties, for maintenance, and to sail. We've spent many thousands of nights at anchor and have sailed more than 10,000 miles in the Pacific Ocean and 2,000 in the Atlantic. We've made five trips from Seattle to San Diego on four different boats. I've skippered at least 60 different boats over the years. We do know what we want.
That is impressive.
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