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Old 03-12-2015, 13:46   #751
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Re: Why Do Catamarans Motor Nearly 100%

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Originally Posted by Factor View Post
And if you think an open transom is a good thing for a cruising boat, particularly one crewed by a couple rather than a team of 15 then you have little knowledge of what it is that blue water cruisers actually do



You may find not all multihull designers share your view.

Nice boat.

Many smaller designs have same open transom layout.
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Old 03-12-2015, 14:21   #752
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Re: Why Do Catamarans Motor Nearly 100%

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Originally Posted by Seaslug Caravan View Post



You may find not all multihull designers share your view.

Nice boat.

Many smaller designs have same open transom layout.
Yes - perhaps my fault for not being clear, I was responding to Polux when he was discussing monos. I was dealing with open transom cockpits on monos in that context.
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Old 03-12-2015, 15:29   #753
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Re: Why Do Catamarans Motor Nearly 100%

And that Schionning catamaran pictured can be blocked off so as not to be open at all. Not to mention that the hulls extend beyond the 1m high raised bridgedeck all the way to the end of those steps.

Not really a valid comparison against an open transom monohull.
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Old 03-12-2015, 15:52   #754
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Re: Why Do Catamarans Motor Nearly 100%

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And that Schionning catamaran pictured can be blocked off so as not to be open at all. Not to mention that the hulls extend beyond the 1m high raised bridgedeck all the way to the end of those steps.

Not really a valid comparison against an open transom monohull.
I am very interested in the "Blocking off " arrangement. Can you post some details, or pictures?



This is much safer, because......?
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Old 03-12-2015, 16:04   #755
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Re: Why Do Catamarans Motor Nearly 100%

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I am very interested in the "Blocking off " arrangement. Can you post some details, or pictures?
The designer talks about it in the study plans for the designs. I haven't seen any pictures about it but following seas and the possibility of being pooped are considered in the design. I would have zero problems taking a Schionning design on a world cruise. In fact, I'm planning on doing just that.

You can access the study plans on their site - Sailing Designs | Composite Multihull Designs & Kits

Quote:
Originally Posted by Seaslug Caravan


This is much safer, because......?
I can't speak to that design as I don't know it. It may be able to be blocked off, I don't know. What I can say is that yes, it's safer because the sailors in the cockpit are still more enclosed, on a higher platform and at less risk of being washed overboard in that catamaran than they are on a mono with a large, open, low and flat cockpit with an open transom. That's a definite.

The helmsman, on the other hand ... isn't as well protected as the sailors in the cockpit but still more protected by the raised sides and seat than anyone standing on the aforementioned mono.
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Old 03-12-2015, 16:14   #756
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Re: Why Do Catamarans Motor Nearly 100%

Also, think about taking a big greenie over the bow and it running aft ... on the mono you'd want to be tethered or you could be washed straight out the back of that open transom. On the cat, the bridgedeck cabin means you don't even get wet, maybe the helm gets a bit of spray.
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Old 03-12-2015, 16:32   #757
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Re: Why Do Catamarans Motor Nearly 100%

Quote:
Originally Posted by tp12 View Post
The designer talks about it in the study plans for the designs. I haven't seen any pictures about it but following seas and the possibility of being pooped are considered in the design. I would have zero problems taking a Schionning design on a world cruise. In fact, I'm planning on doing just that.

You can access the study plans on their site - Sailing Designs | Composite Multihull Designs & Kits



I can't speak to that design as I don't know it. It may be able to be blocked off, I don't know. What I can say is that yes, it's safer because the sailors in the cockpit are still more enclosed, on a higher platform and at less risk of being washed overboard in that catamaran than they are on a mono with a large, open, low and flat cockpit with an open transom. That's a definite.

The helmsman, on the other hand ... isn't as well protected as the sailors in the cockpit but still more protected by the raised sides and seat than anyone standing on the aforementioned mono.
Thread drift here and safe or not aside why would any one on a Cat or Mono for that matter want a boat that required you to stand or sit fully unprotected from the environment to helm the boat.I can not imagine how uncomfortable and unhealthy that would be for 10 to 15 hours a day let alone making a multi day/week passage.
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Old 03-12-2015, 16:42   #758
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Re: Why Do Catamarans Motor Nearly 100%

Thing is Polux I cannot totally agree. At 6'6" I need standing headroom.

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Yes, I like very much the Stiletto, a great design ahead of its time but i don't think that most that buy a cat, buy it for the performance, otherwise the most common type by far would not be heavy condo cats with huge free-board and without dagerboards. And I don't think the tendency is diminishing but increasing, now to motorcats also.

A bit like on monohulls, it is hard for me to understand why people buy fatter boats just to have a bit bigger interior space and a bit bigger headroom. It seems that the small advantage does not pay off in lesser sailing ability or beauty...but that is what most sailors want, no matter my opinion. Reality rules
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Old 03-12-2015, 17:02   #759
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Re: Why Do Catamarans Motor Nearly 100%

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Thread drift here and safe or not aside why would any one on a Cat or Mono for that matter want a boat that required you to stand or sit fully unprotected from the environment to helm the boat.I can not imagine how uncomfortable and unhealthy that would be for 10 to 15 hours a day let alone making a multi day/week passage.
From what I understand the reality is you don't. You're on autopilot a lot when cruising. On the cat pictured I don't think you're fully unprotected as you say as the seat, lifelines, and high freeboard offer protection to the helm. If you mean sun and rain then, fair enough, but I imagine you could put a bimini up the same as a lot of monos do for cruising.
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Old 03-12-2015, 18:03   #760
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Re: Why Do Catamarans Motor Nearly 100%

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Originally Posted by Mirage Gecko View Post
Thread drift here and safe or not aside why would any one on a Cat or Mono for that matter want a boat that required you to stand or sit fully unprotected from the environment to helm the boat.I can not imagine how uncomfortable and unhealthy that would be for 10 to 15 hours a day let alone making a multi day/week passage.
90% of the time on passage the boat is on autopilot. When you are at the wheel is because you are having fun sailing and then you want to be on a place where you can feel the boat, the sea, having a good visibility forward, to the waves and to the sails.

That's why Chris White puts the steering wheel forward in some models, for not having a big cabin in front.


Regarding cats with steering wheels to open transoms, there are lots of them. A recent model from Nautitech:

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Old 03-12-2015, 18:05   #761
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Re: Why Do Catamarans Motor Nearly 100%

Funny you should say that. I saw an open 40 parked next to us yesterday with a Bimini over the helm. It was laughable, about the size of the helm seat. 40x40 cm.
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Old 03-12-2015, 18:19   #762
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Re: Why Do Catamarans Motor Nearly 100%

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Funny you should say that. I saw an open 40 parked next to us yesterday with a Bimini over the helm. It was laughable, about the size of the helm seat. 40x40 cm.
I like the Nautitech 40, not properly a condo cat, not properly a performance cat and with a nice price. I have read several test sails and all the comments are very impressive, having in consideration the type of boat and the price.

Guess that the ones that buy a Nautitech 40 are not the same type of sailors that buy lagoons and the requirements in what regards comfort details and sailing pleasure are different: On those steering wheel the skipper have a very good forward visio, better than on most condo cats.


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Old 03-12-2015, 18:55   #763
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Re: Why Do Catamarans Motor Nearly 100%

Polux,

Is that your idea of good visibility forward? Really? What about that big log you are just about to drive over with your port bow?
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Old 03-12-2015, 19:04   #764
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Re: Why Do Catamarans Motor Nearly 100%

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....................................
.....................................
...................................

That's why Chris White puts the steering wheel forward in some models, for not having a big cabin in front.

Would that require additional crew to dock this craft?
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Old 03-12-2015, 19:35   #765
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Re: Why Do Catamarans Motor Nearly 100%

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...very good forward visio, better than on most condo cats.
From so many comments, typically derisive and almost always implying many inferior features and poor sailing ability (all of which we respectfully find wrong) we must assume our L440 is a "condo cat".

That said, we should now say that are yet to go on a sailing vessel with better visibility than the L440, from both anywhere around the vessel and (especially) from its flybridge. The flybridge also places the L440 amoung the best in our knowledge for ease of solo sail trimming, with all lines very handy to the single helm.

We spent ~4 years looking at vessels when we were buying...and we sailed a LOT of different cats. Mindful of the inherent compromises in the process, we developed a fairly thorough checklist. There were lots of great vessels and a few not-so-great, but in the 'visibility' category on our checklist, the L440 was a clear winner.

...and back to OP, we are working hard to try and figure out what those big white things are...
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