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Old 28-07-2015, 22:12   #361
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Re: Why Do Catamarans Motor Nearly 100%

Guys, have you tried ginger snap cookies or ginger root diced up and steeped for awhile? Ginger is the Chinese magic...I swear by it. Also very healthy and no dry cotton mouth and pee every hour symptoms. When I used to use Scopolamine I felt altered for days. Do not like that chemical "ick" feeling.

We all know the three axis to motion in boats being pitch, yaw, and roll. When I was racing mode it was the yaw and roll in downwind kite wars that always got my green thing going. That spinnaker oscillation would just be too much. That is one of the things I fell in love with on multis is that the yaw and roll are almost absent or insignificant. The pitching is more pronounced in steep seas but it doesn't seem to upset my equilibrium.

I remember I used to get sea sick pretty easy on my buddies sail boat when we would go on the backside of Catalina for diving. By the time I got geared up and in the water I was puking through my regulator. You have to really be good to puke through a regulator and not drown at 60 foot. Smile.

Then when I started doing enough races I was afraid I would become useless to the skipper by chumming. I really fought hard to overcome it. Then one day my buddy Dave said the speedo had quit and he was going below to fix it. I do not have a clue why I followed him below. But before I knew it we were in the center of the bilge with covers removed and pulling the speedo. My job was too hold the t shirt in the hole while he took the brush to it. The boat was doing it's usual gyrations. I never even got a hint of green. After that I was fine.

Except when my grandchildren were here a couple of weeks ago and I went backwards on the roller coaster as it did loops and twisting contortions. I was queasy for hours....smile..

Can we just let this thread die now?
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Old 28-07-2015, 22:16   #362
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Re: Why Do Catamarans Motor Nearly 100%

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Originally Posted by Jerry Woodward View Post
This may have been mentioned already, I haven't read the entire thread. One reason bare boat charterers of cats may motor more is that charter cats generally have inadequate solar and we (I am a bareboat charterer) are told to run the engine at least 2 hours a day to keep the batteries charged. This is my biggest complaint about bareboating. I hate getting up in the morning and starting the engine to let it idle, knowing that it is bad on the engines, not to mention disrupting the morning peace and quiet. So, I motor sail for at least two hours during the day. The other issue is that many cats that should have electric winches for the main sail don't. Put those two together and you might as well motor if you are only going 10 miles or so.
Very good point missed by the manufacturers.

Virtually all cat owners thesedays are aftermarket fitting approx 1kw solar.
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Old 28-07-2015, 22:40   #363
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Re: Why Do Catamarans Motor Nearly 100%

The most effective seasickness cure for me was to switch to a catamaran.


I still sometime get queasy if I read while sailing, but generally I'm far better than on our old mono.
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Old 28-07-2015, 23:30   #364
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Re: Why Do Catamarans Motor Nearly 100%

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Originally Posted by Jerry Woodward View Post
This may have been mentioned already, I haven't read the entire thread. One reason bare boat charterers of cats may motor more is that charter cats generally have inadequate solar and we (I am a bareboat charterer) are told to run the engine at least 2 hours a day to keep the batteries charged. This is my biggest complaint about bareboating. I hate getting up in the morning and starting the engine to let it idle, knowing that it is bad on the engines, not to mention disrupting the morning peace and quiet. So, I motor sail for at least two hours during the day. The other issue is that many cats that should have electric winches for the main sail don't. Put those two together and you might as well motor if you are only going 10 miles or so.
A very good point, which makes a lot of sense and hasn't been brought up yet.

Thanks
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Old 29-07-2015, 00:56   #365
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Re: Why Do Catamarans Motor Nearly 100%

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Originally Posted by Kenomac View Post
A very good point, which makes a lot of sense and hasn't been brought up yet.



Thanks
Not really, monos also have batteries that need charging and privately owned monos are more likely to be lacking solar due to the lack of space to put them.

Where I am now I can only see one other mono anchored with solar, none have wind. One Tri has wind. I cannot tell if the Lagoon 450 or the Sunreef 74 have solar or not. Given that the Sunreef lit up the water around it last night with UW lighting I suspect they don't need to motor to recharge.

The Sunreef is now motoring off in 12 knots of wind in the direction that would put it on a beam reach. After a mile there is still no sign of a sail.

Time to up anchor myself and have a sail in the same direction 😃


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Old 29-07-2015, 02:25   #366
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Re: Why Do Catamarans Motor Nearly 100%

Its easy to run a boat on solar alone, for five years I didnt plug at all and never ran the motors to charge the batteries. And I never turned the fridge and freezer off.
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Old 29-07-2015, 03:41   #367
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Re: Why Do Catamarans Motor Nearly 100%

A huge advantage multihulls have over mono hulls is acreage to mount solar without the need to add an unsightly jungle gym across the stern (arch). We're presently just about to place an order for some Solbian flexible solar panels, but I keep hesitating because the only place we have for mounting is the top of the Bimini. I'd actually planned on ordering yesterday or today, but we were subjected to higher winds in excess of 40 mph this morning... (My anchorage neighbor a beautiful 90 ft Swan washed up onto the rocks), and I'm skeptical now on how they would work out. Lots of buffeting going on up on the Bimini. I don't want to have to remove the panels whenever the wind kicks up... It's not always possible.

I fear the extra weight of the solar panels along with the buffeting with tear the Bimini to shreds. Probably glad I waited.

We don't want an arch, so there really isn't anywhere else for mounting. Besides the appearance of the arch which we don't like, the cost to add one plus the cost of the solar panels...... Would instead buy plenty of diesel to run the generator for 7-10 seasons
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Old 29-07-2015, 05:07   #368
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Re: Why Do Catamarans Motor Nearly 100%

I struggled with Solar, and now have three 250W panels on top of my davits. They aren't the best looking thing on my boat and the plan is if needed another 500W on the Bimini, but I have sort of promised the Admiral unlimited water and power, and I don't see a better way than Solar. I have a generator, three stage external regulator and a 160W Alt., but I hope Solar will be the main source.
As far as the seasickness thing, for me a Beer just as I start to feel queasy seems to help, learned that long ago, but the ticket for the wife is one of those expensive battery powered watch looking things, the drugs just put her to sleep, she could / would sleep for three days on a three day passage when taking Dramamine.

A tremendous amount of seasickness is psychological, not that knowing that helps, but the people that worry about it are more likely to get sick, plus ever notice that if your really busy, you usually don't get sick?

One thing I have learned is that really seems nobody is truly immune, just that they haven't yet gotten sick, and that younger people seems to tolerate motion better than older people. Remember as a kid roller coasters were fun, not a bit of queasiness?
I don't know why, but the older I get, the more susceptible I seem to be.
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Old 29-07-2015, 07:29   #369
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Re: Why Do Catamarans Motor Nearly 100%

It might be time to re examine the over the davit option for solar. That was the original plan until I was distracted by the Bimini plan.

Thanks for reminding me.
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Old 29-07-2015, 08:39   #370
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Re: Why Do Catamarans Motor Nearly 100%

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Now let me ask again... Can you contribute any, and I mean any personal experiences on how a catamaran will handle Force 8? My inquiring, psychologically deficient mind wants to know.
I've sailed many times in winds between 30 and 40 knots. Last year we close reached into 50 knot winds with a triple reef and no jib off the coast of the Peloponnese. Palarran is a large cat and handles these winds fine. I think most cat's will handle 40 knot and below winds without excessive danger provided the sailor is competent. Large waves are not a problem unless there is a breaking contingent to them. Short steep waves cause a lot of slapping and slamming, which is not unusual.

So there you go. Any progress on the video of this sea state which caused you to motor yet?
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Old 29-07-2015, 09:19   #371
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Re: Why Do Catamarans Motor Nearly 100%

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I've sailed many times in winds between 30 and 40 knots. Last year we close reached into 50 knot winds with a triple reef and no jib off the coast of the Peloponnese. Palarran is a large cat and handles these winds fine. I think most cat's will handle 40 knot and below winds without excessive danger provided the sailor is competent. Large waves are not a problem unless there is a breaking contingent to them. Short steep waves cause a lot of slapping and slamming, which is not unusual.

So there you go. Any progress on the video of this sea state which caused you to motor yet?
When your cat heads upwind in the conditions you describe, do the hulls travel through the waves and the deckhouse sort of skims over the top? What I mean by that, are the hulls essentially providing the buoyancy to allow the upper portion of the boat to avoid the turbulence?

Regarding the video, I gave it a good try today. I live on our boat off the Italian coast in anchorages, so I need to rely on purchasing cellular data by the GB and sometime by the MB, so it's not like having the internet plugged into the wall... Downloading a 2 minute video eats up data. No luck today at the port free wifi, I kept getting timed out and loosing the connection.

My next try will most likely be next week when I visit the marina yard, they have an excellent connection unless I get very ambitious and ride my bike the 10 miles into town. If there's a festival, I'll try this weekend.

BTW... I have the video on my iPad, is it as easy as uploading the video just like when I upload a photo from the iPad onto the CF site. In the past I've only posted YouTube stuff onto CF which is easy. Any help will be appreciated.
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Old 29-07-2015, 12:14   #372
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Re: Why Do Catamarans Motor Nearly 100%

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When your cat heads upwind in the conditions you describe, do the hulls travel through the waves and the deckhouse sort of skims over the top? What I mean by that, are the hulls essentially providing the buoyancy to allow the upper portion of the boat to avoid the turbulence?
Of course the hulls travel through the waves but I wouldn't say the bridgedeck skims over the top. There is a lot of slop and wave refection that pounds the bottom of the bridgedeck. Most is slapping but I've had some periods of serious slamming where the boat basically hydraulically stops moving down in an instant. It is quite noisy and pretty unnerving after many hours of it. I have zero experience on a monohull but do believe they are not whisper quiet and without movement in such conditions.

But this still has little to do with why you perceive that catamarans motor nearly 100% of the time. They don't.
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Old 29-07-2015, 12:29   #373
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Re: Why Do Catamarans Motor Nearly 100%

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Of course the hulls travel through the waves but I wouldn't say the bridgedeck skims over the top. There is a lot of slop and wave refection that pounds the bottom of the bridgedeck. Most is slapping but I've had some periods of serious slamming where the boat basically hydraulically stops moving down in an instant. It is quite noisy and pretty unnerving after many hours of it. I have zero experience on a monohull but do believe they are not whisper quiet and without movement in such conditions.
Some monohulls slam more than others, it depends on the shape of the frontal portion of the hull. Deep V vs flat. I've been on our previous Hunter and a couple of the newer Beneteaus that slapped and slammed quite a bit heading into waves most likely due to the flatter underbody of the forward portion of the hull, and I've been on some older Jeanneaus, a Discovery, a few Oysters which have a deeper V entry which really don't bang or slam that much unless they get airborne. I suppose some of the older full keel boats, don't slam at all. Don't know, haven't been on one.

Thanks for the info... Would a catamaran like a Lagoon with a rather portly frontal area slap or slam more than a boat designed like yours? Or has the company designed a remedy into the hull or bridge deck design?
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Old 29-07-2015, 14:14   #374
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Re: Why Do Catamarans Motor Nearly 100%

I will just leave this here
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Old 29-07-2015, 14:44   #375
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Re: Why Do Catamarans Motor Nearly 100%

My IP will rarely slam, but she will dig her bow in rather deeply and take quite a bit of water over the bow in steep waves.
I assume this is largely due to the 10,000 lbs of ballast and simple inertia (first law I think) where a much lighter Cat might ride over the wave, me being heavier will plow through, but I pitch less. Surprisingly it seems winds and waves slow me less than some other mono's, but I don't know why.
Every now and again in steep waves it will slam, but it seems random, unlike another Mono that I have been in that slammed so bad, it alarmed me. Maybe the keel being so forward has something to do with it?


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