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Old 15-02-2010, 20:05   #76
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This argument is so old. Buy what you want and respect the other mans decision however misguided. Well sailed, well built boats of any type will be reasonably safe and badly sailed or badly built won't be.

It is clear that multis are safe if built and sailed right - same goes for monos.

I have a view that I am the weak link, the boat will last longer than me, the Pacific rescue info above would indcate that that is true for people other than me.

I will never own another mono, but that is just me.

One last thing - Ramtha - one of the multis referred to above did not call a mayday.
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Old 15-02-2010, 20:06   #77
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What on Earth are you talking about? Cruising gear on Americas cup boats?

Is this a natural talent or do you have to work at it?
Now now 44c, no need to start down that path.

Obviously the manner of my post was a little too subtle even though I included a quizzical smiley. My apologies.

What on earth has the windward ability of a solid wing, super-light cat got to do with the windward performance of modern cruising yachts. I know you think it has, because you post this example at every opportunity. Sorry , I don't get it.

Isn't it a bit like watching a race between a formulae 1 race car and a grand prix motor cycle and concluding after the bike has been beaten (mainly due to the car having more rubber in contact with the road) that this will hold true for Joe commuter on our suburban streets.

Yes 44c, I watch Top Gear, and no, a lot of other factors come into play in the real world. Joli summed up the situation well in his previous post.

Warm regards.

Ps. the war is over. It finished about 10 years ago. Most of us now recognize all types of boats have their good and bad points.
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Old 15-02-2010, 21:52   #78
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Bayview: Most of us now recognize all types of boats have their good and bad points.
I can see that. I came to this thread pretty much decided on a mono - basically doing due diligence on multis, and instead have decided I'd prefer a multi. The availability of more and lower-priced monos will probably drive me that direction, but there aren't any wrong answers here.
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Old 15-02-2010, 22:03   #79
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The GG Yacht Club AC33 boat was a trimaran and a much better way to design a boat. Cats are abominations - too many hulls yet too few.
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Old 15-02-2010, 22:08   #80
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I can see that. I came to this thread pretty much decided on a mono - basically doing due diligence on multis, and instead have decided I'd prefer a multi. The availability of more and lower-priced monos will probably drive me that direction, but there aren't any wrong answers here.
Last night I watched the America's Cup Videos, and the thing that struck me about the race was the fact that although the racing yachts had either two or three hulls, the majority of the time they sailed with only one hull in the water. The other hull/hulls and superstructure were like a giant lever arm that kept the sailing hull upright. Most of the time it was like two giant monohulls were racing with weird hull extensions going out to windward to keep the leeward hull upright. Mind boggling stuff. I'm not saying that these were monohull yachts, but most of the time there was only one hull in the water.
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Old 15-02-2010, 22:19   #81
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...but most of the time there was only one hull in the water.
Hmmm. Multihulls don't perform well unless they heel over - presumably spilling the cocktails and annoying the cook. Yet flying a hull in any cruising cat is regarded as a near-death experience. Hmmm.
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Old 15-02-2010, 22:45   #82
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Hmmm. Multihulls don't perform well unless they heel over - presumably spilling the cocktails and annoying the cook. Yet flying a hull in any cruising cat is regarded as a near-death experience. Hmmm.
I'm not a racer, and it seemed weird for these multihulls to be sailing with only one hull in the water the majority of the time. I wonder how close they were to capsize when they were flying hulls. It didn't look like the crew was scurrying around frantically trying to prevent a capsize. But I suppose the sail trimmers were hard at work trying to make it look easy.

I think that sailing in only 7 to 8 knot breezes must make the job easier.

I would like to have seen the same races with the wind pumping back and forth from 15 to 25 knots. That would have made the situation much more challenging and interesting. I didn't find the race to be boring, but it wasn't particularly exciting. The word that comes to mind is "interesting", but not exciting. If the wind was pumping 15 to 25 knots, the word coming to mind might have been "exciting."
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Old 15-02-2010, 22:54   #83
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Now now 44c, no need to start down that path.

Obviously the manner of my post was a little too subtle even though I included a quizzical smiley. My apologies.

What on earth has the windward ability of a solid wing, super-light cat got to do with the windward performance of modern cruising yachts. I know you think it has, because you post this example at every opportunity. Sorry , I don't get it.
The point is, some people constantly like to compare racing/high performance monohulls with cruising/charter multihulls, and point out that those monohulls will outsail those multi's to windward.

The 1988 AC is at least comparing apples to apples - racing mono vs racing multi.

Also the suggestion was made that a mono would have done better to windward than Allinghi or Oracle, due to being able to point higher.
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Old 16-02-2010, 03:20   #84
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Bayview/catty - whoever he is exists to go trolling - really is best to ignore him.
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Old 16-02-2010, 05:24   #85
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This argument is so old. Buy what you want and respect the other mans decision however misguided. Well sailed, well built boats of any type will be reasonably safe and badly sailed or badly built won't be.

It is clear that multis are safe if built and sailed right - same goes for monos.

I have a view that I am the weak link, the boat will last longer than me, the Pacific rescue info above would indcate that that is true for people other than me.

I will never own another mono, but that is just me.

One last thing - Ramtha - one of the multis referred to above did not call a mayday.
And I'm not being facetious or patronizing when I say I may one day own a cruising multi. I plan to find myself more or less permanently in Thai waters upon retirement and a cat might well be ideal there.

But, I see drawbacks to multis too. For that, I am frequently labeled a blasphemer.
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Old 16-02-2010, 05:28   #86
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I'm not a racer, and it seemed weird for these multihulls to be sailing with only one hull in the water the majority of the time. I wonder how close they were to capsize when they were flying hulls. It didn't look like the crew was scurrying around frantically trying to prevent a capsize. But I suppose the sail trimmers were hard at work trying to make it look easy.

I think that sailing in only 7 to 8 knot breezes must make the job easier.

I would like to have seen the same races with the wind pumping back and forth from 15 to 25 knots. That would have made the situation much more challenging and interesting. I didn't find the race to be boring, but it wasn't particularly exciting. The word that comes to mind is "interesting", but not exciting. If the wind was pumping 15 to 25 knots, the word coming to mind might have been "exciting."
I was surprised they were flying so high. My experience with beach cats is that you want the windward hull just kissing the water, to keep as much sail area upright as possible. It seems BMW/O in particular was flying that windward hull too high. But, hey, these guys are the experts.
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Old 16-02-2010, 15:31   #87
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Even with a 4.5 draft monohull, I just lost a day waiting to get into a harbour that a 3 foot draft cat would have gone right into. I prefer sailing flat. I prefer the more spread out accomodations cats have. I prefer the view cats offer. I prefer not having to scramble up and down steps. I prefer having the dinghy hang between the hulls so I can walk out the transom(s) to swim.

I prefer the price of my monohull.
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Old 16-02-2010, 16:29   #88
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Mythbuster...

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OK, since you asked, no they don't go to windward. LOL

Actually the only time I've ever seen a cat go to windward is on a race course when they had to sail the course. Other wise it seems to painfull so they just motor.
...OK, explain this then.

BVIs to St. Martin is approx. 80 miles to windward. In December 2008 we sailed every bit of it on our MC41. After arriving in the lagoon we attended numerous cruiser happy hours with folks cruising monos and multis alike. We did not speak with anyone who sailed.

Now do we point as high as a mono, NO! But as cchesley pointed out, we crack off a few degrees and the boat moves better and she tells you that you are doing the right thing.

Bottom line (again!). They are different boats just as an Island Packet is different from a Wally is different than a Gunboat is different than a Chris White tri. Enjoy what you have.

Fair Winds,
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Old 16-02-2010, 18:27   #89
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Jaywalker... Because you want to sail with your wife/girlfriend? I'm currently sailing arond the world on an organised event. There are 6 cats in the 28 strong fleet. Every one of the cats has the wife/girlfriend aboard for the trip. the vast majority of the monos are crewed solely by men.

Says it all for me.
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Old 16-02-2010, 19:54   #90
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.. Every one of the cats has the wife/girlfriend aboard for the trip. the vast majority of the monos are crewed solely by men.

Says it all for me.
Cats are for Girls ?
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