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Peregrine1983 · 05-09-2018, 15:45

Hi all,

A cat is in our future in the next couple of years. I know next to nothing about cats and am trying to educate myself about what boats we should focus on. We currently cruise a 42' monohull in the Northeast US. We will be cruising the cat here in the Northeast and Caribbean.

These are what I believe my parameters are:
- 2000 or newer
- Located on the East Coast US or Caribbean
- Budget max $300k... so used, obviously
- Owner's version, probably not a former charter
- Stiff and fairly high performance - I am willing to sacrifice super amazing accommodations for a fast, better sailing boat - especially to windward. Daggerboards welcome. Most cat accommodations will likely be an improvement over our monohull.
- A proven reputation as an ocean cruiser
- 38' or larger
- I don't want the center of the boat to slap in steep chop

Tell me if I'm on the wrong track, but I've recently been looking at Fountaine Pajots from the mid-2000's and slightly older Outremers. I like the Outremers, but the ones we can afford look a bit rougher. The FP's are in nicer shape.

Something like this: https://www.yachtworld.com/boats/200...g#.W5BJ3YJG018

I'd like to hear some opinions on purchasing a 10 year old Lavezzi (or similar) like the one above? Rigging is aging obviously... engines... all the usual monohull stuff, but being new to cats what would we have to look out for?

Sorry for the rambling post.... Thanks in advance.

Factor · 05-09-2018, 16:09

Seawind 1160/1250
Pescott Whitehaven
Older Catana, the new ones are way to heavy
Mainecat

Privleoplag · 05-09-2018, 16:24

everyone is different and wants something different and will accept something different.
The one you posted a link to.. my cons were.. not an owners version, manual heads, no power dinghy davit, slanted saloon windows, have to run the sheets from two different sides of the cockpit, top loading fridge/freezer, no hardtop over the helm/cockpit, funky shaped bed.
But, like I said.. everyone's list is going to be different, and things I don't care for others will prefer.
oh, one other thing.. there isn't a single cat there that isn't going to slam.. point it into some flat faced waves or turn it slightly off.. it's going to slam.

jdazey · 05-09-2018, 18:28

Quote:

Originally Posted by Privleoplag

oh, one other thing.. there isn't a single cat there that isn't going to slam.. point it into some flat faced waves or turn it slightly off.. it's going to slam.

Yup. Every boat will run into conditions it doesn't like. Slamming will sound a bit daunting, but most boats will not disintegrate. Monos are not immune to getting pounded either.

The Lavezzi we charter-sailed left us disappointed. The Outremer 55L we were graciously given a ride on was a whole different critter that reinforced our desire to get another multihull. If you're really thinking an FP will meet your needs, I suggest you get a sail on one before spending your money.

Cheers,

LeeV · 06-09-2018, 04:16

Quote:

Originally Posted by Peregrine1983

Hi all,

A cat is in our future in the next couple of years. ...................snip...........

Something like this: https://www.yachtworld.com/boats/200...g#.W5BJ3YJG018

I'd like to hear some opinions on purchasing a 10 year old Lavezzi (or similar) like the one above? .................snip.............

There are a lot of nice cats out there, and if you're looking to cruise, you'll enjoy one. If you need real performance and have $$, then an Outremer (NOT spacious inside unless it's 50'+), Catana, etc....

I like the Leopard and F. Pajot cats for cruising, but would never buy a Lavezzi unless the owner had documentation that the factory had done the osmosis/blistering repair on the entire hull. Google it. Fountaine-Pajot Lavezzi court case - osmosis

Go look at lots of cats. Get on them and pretend you're sailing/anchoring. Move around. Then go charter one.

Enjoy!

rom · 06-09-2018, 04:19

You're talking about crossing oceans... I would go for the biggest cat taht fits your budget. FP Bahia 46 is a very fine boat, good reputation, not Outremer fast but much faster than late condo generation. You will find one close to you for less than 250kUSD and have enough money for a nice refit. I would rather cross oceans on a bahia 46 than on an outemer 42. The latter doesnt even fit in your budget I think. Be careful with other FP model like lavezzi which had lots osmosis issues. Apart from the Bahia 46, the Belize 43 also has very good reputation.

As for sailing to windward most mini keels cats from those years will give very good performance with a clean bottom, folding props, decent sails and a good new generation AP !

Peregrine1983 · 06-09-2018, 07:45

Quote:

Originally Posted by Factor

Seawind 1160/1250
Pescott Whitehaven
Older Catana, the new ones are way to heavy
Mainecat

Thank you. These are brands I hadn't considered.

Peregrine1983 · 06-09-2018, 07:49

Quote:

Originally Posted by Privleoplag

everyone is different and wants something different and will accept something different.
The one you posted a link to.. my cons were.. not an owners version, manual heads, no power dinghy davit, slanted saloon windows, have to run the sheets from two different sides of the cockpit, top loading fridge/freezer, no hardtop over the helm/cockpit, funky shaped bed.
But, like I said.. everyone's list is going to be different, and things I don't care for others will prefer.
oh, one other thing.. there isn't a single cat there that isn't going to slam.. point it into some flat faced waves or turn it slightly off.. it's going to slam.

Thanks for this. Good to know about the slamming. I guess it's something we'll have to live with. I don't mind manual toilets - as I know how to rebuild them

. Manual davits are fine. Top loading fridge not a problem. A covered helm is essential... good call... I figured I could just add a bimini, but a hard top would be nice. My IDEAL boat would have an interior helm like a Chris White Atlantic... but those are out of the budget sadly.

What don't you like about the slanted salon windows? Is it an aesthetic preference or a functional one?

Peregrine1983 · 06-09-2018, 07:51

Quote:

Originally Posted by jdazey

The Lavezzi we charter-sailed left us disappointed. The Outremer 55L we were graciously given a ride on was a whole different critter that reinforced our desire to get another multihull. If you're really thinking an FP will meet your needs, I suggest you get a sail on one before spending your money.

Cheers,

That's good to know. Thank you. The Outremers I'm looking at would be much shorter than 55. I'd be looking more at something like this: https://www.yachtworld.com/boats/200...g#.W5E-04JG018

Peregrine1983 · 06-09-2018, 07:52

Quote:

Originally Posted by LeeV

would never buy a Lavezzi unless the owner had documentation that the factory had done the osmosis/blistering repair on the entire hull. Google it. Fountaine-Pajot Lavezzi court case - osmosis

This is exactly the type of information I'm looking for. Thank you.

Sand crab · 06-09-2018, 08:13

Quote:

Originally Posted by Peregrine1983

My IDEAL boat would have an interior helm like a Chris White Atlantic... but those are out of the budget sadly.

Maine Cat has that on all their boats.

https://www.mecat.com/

travellerw · 06-09-2018, 08:29

Island Spirit is a brand that many miss. They are usually priced much better than the big brands and offer a lot. They were built to be cruisers from inception so they have a lot of features not found in other boats.

If you don't over load them, they sail like mad (true of most cats though). They are low to the water with a big rig that allows more sail in higher winds. The unfortunate downside is slamming in certain seas.

Unfortunatley finding one can be difficult as there was only 44 of them built and only like 38 of them left (hurricanes). I just thought I would add it to your list.

Peregrine1983 · 06-09-2018, 08:55

Quote:

Originally Posted by rom

You're talking about crossing oceans... I would go for the biggest cat taht fits your budget. FP Bahia 46 is a very fine boat, good reputation, not Outremer fast but much faster than late condo generation. You will find one close to you for less than 250kUSD and have enough money for a nice refit. I would rather cross oceans on a bahia 46 than on an outemer 42. The latter doesnt even fit in your budget I think. Be careful with other FP model like lavezzi which had lots osmosis issues. Apart from the Bahia 46, the Belize 43 also has very good reputation.

As for sailing to windward most mini keels cats from those years will give very good performance with a clean bottom, folding props, decent sails and a good new generation AP !

Noted! Thank you. I've got a running list now of boats, which was part of my goal.

Peregrine1983 · 06-09-2018, 09:01

Quote:

Originally Posted by Sand crab

Maine Cat has that on all their boats.

https://www.mecat.com/

Thank you. Looks beautiful, but are the Mainecats really long distance cruising boats? The fresh water capacity is only 40 gallons. We'd want 150 at least... In my head I had put the Maine Cats in the same category in my head as some of the Geminis - more geared towards day sailing and short trips, but I may be wrong.

Also, looking at the Maine Cat 38 - it's only 12,500 lbs. My current monohull displaces 22,500 lbs. I'm worried a much lighter boat won't be comfortable for what I want to do with it. That said, I'll be the first to admit I know nothing about cats... EDIT: and I want something that performs.