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Old 31-12-2009, 15:29   #91
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snip

You appear to accuse me of "buying a boat to make a close copy or near exact copy". Nothing is further from the truth, so I suggest you research your accusations more completely prior to accusing me of this.

snip.
I was using the general "you", and could have used the words "one buys" instead of "you buy" without changing my intended meaning. I don't know how close your copy was, or if you thought of using the design after you bought it, but does that matter? You wrote that the Quorning boat was the starting point or basis for your work. I hope that clarification helps. In my opinion they look very much alike.
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Old 31-12-2009, 15:48   #92
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Hi Steve. Taking a look at how this thread is going you might get a kick out of the fact its a Piver 30. It has some problems with the deck having soft spots but it has newer rigging and has wheel stearing and a good outboard with new bimmini and dodger. I will need to do a bottom scrape and paint as well and some inside wireing but nothing very hard. Since I am currently in a wheelchair doing the bottom will not be a problem. It is good shape overall and I am hopping to get it this month and get it done by spring to go sailing. I am really excited about this boat.
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Old 02-01-2010, 17:52   #93
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Hey Gunslinger, your tri sounds good and like you'll be sailing her this summer rather than 2011! Are you adapting her to suit your restricted mobility? If so, how? Best of good luck with the project.

Here's another candidate for ultimate trimaran cruising chariot. Built in strip plank and some nice woodwork inside, inboard engine.Her specs are at the 'description' link at the bottom of the web page.
Fotopresentatie Polynesie 45 occasion
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Old 02-01-2010, 20:35   #94
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Originally Posted by SailFastTri View Post
You wrote that the Quorning boat was the starting point or basis for your work. I hope that clarification helps. In my opinion they look very much alike.
You are correct sir, Quorning Boats (the father) was the starting point for my interest in these small tris, and I expended a GREAT deal of effort and money marketing that product to the US market. When it finally came down to the fact that neither myself, nor the Danish importer to Canada, would receive NO product (after promises we would) and after multiple talks between the 3 of us as to how this could be accomplished, it was only then I proceeded to build a similar product with modifications (and the blessings of the Danish importor). Quite naturally I did not wish to alter the outer appearance of the vessel that drastically as it was a very appealing design that had been accepted by a number of deposits in advance.

Let me say in my defense that even while this project eventually took me into bankruptcy, I left the boat business with all creditors paid off, and no customer without either a vessel, or their money back...a clean slate.

It's now been over 20 years, so I think I will lay it to rest again. I really did think this vessel could have been the J-24 of multihulls, And at the time I had a full-on beach catamaran 50 store dealer/distribution network to sell it into, unlike the F27 operation that was marketing dealer direct. Of course F27 had one of the Walmart sons as a new owner, so I was outgunned money wise, but I had hopes of tagging along on his coat tails, and the whole small multihull market might have grown even larger with that scenario. Plus the small cat owners were now getting in a family way, and in need of a small family trailerable boat to replace that beach cat. Ahhh dreams.

I'm sorry to burden this subject thread with these discussions, but I felt a need to defend myself against these accusations. I'll leave this subject now.
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Old 02-01-2010, 20:49   #95
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Hi Steve. I havent really woried yet about the mobility because the TX Tri has a rather narrow center hull so I wont have to use a chair just handholds because I still have one leg lol. I might have a problem with the V Berth but I am looking at grab rails on both sides of the bulkhead bolted to each other so I can hop over that. the rest of the center hull is very open so the only worry would be geting into the bunks over the wings and there is a short ladder built in that I can adapt I think that gives me access to a bed and the head. I will use the V Berth for guests as well as the other berth. both couches are right there so I dont have a problem with sitting. I can lean against the cabinits and counters to cook and wash dishes so I got that covered. This boat has only a couple of steps to the cockpit and i can sit on the edge of the hatch and wiggle out to the cockpit. With wheel steering and the winches near the sides I can work the sails. I am going to put roller furling for the foresail and I am thinking of installing trampolienes between the bow and the bow of the almas I think thats the term. That will make it very easy to work forward. As for getting my chair in and out on the dock I figured on using the boom as a hoist lol. There is plemty of deck space at least for storeing the chair on deck. I have a folding one. I am very happy with the inside and think it can be made into the perfict cruser for a person with my disability. Its not to big to be a boat that needs more people as a crew and its not to small to be unlivable. I really like the very pretty Tri you sent the link for it is apsoluitly beautiful. I would never be able to manuver through that boat but she is very pretty.
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Old 07-01-2010, 22:08   #96
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Farrier Command 10

This is the forgotten Farrier Trimaran. There were only 35 of them made, all homebuilt. She was Farriers first ocean going design. Plywood, West Epoxy system. 20 hp diesel. The amas fold up farrier style. Don't know why he did that because it is too wide to legally tow on the road.
As it turns out with the new environmental laws (unlawful to beach and antifoul) she comes into her own because with the floats folded she fits in a standard travel lift.
Mine has all the cruising gear, huge fridge, 4 burner stove oven etc.
I beefed up the swept back shrouds and took off the backstay, fitted a roachy main. So I get half windspeed + now with all cruising gear on board. With folding centreboard and rudder she draws about 30 inches. The brochure says she can do 30 knots.. Ithink ! Claw marks in the cabin roof at that speed. Realistically, the only way you would get close to that would be to drop her out of an aeroplane. But she is a great boat. In the 80's many did blue water cruising. If I was 20 years old and bullet proof I"d take this boat offshore. As it is my back has trouble with the stoopway into the aft cabin where I need my afternoon nap.

Here's one for sale. (It's not mine !) Can't seem to upload my pictures.
FARRIER COMMAND 10 TRIMARAN boat details - BoatPoint Australia

Jim
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Old 09-01-2010, 17:35   #97
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Jpemb7, Sorry to not get back to you. I have seen one of those boats and was very impressed. Looked like a solid well designed boat for cruising, I did not realise so few had been built.


well I have a new candidate for the "ultimate cruising Trimaran" that is not a Trimaran, and it is not very often that a cat will catch my eye. I really have always liked pod cats. With all the charted influence. I lost interest in most cats.....There is something about having a chair way up in the air, or you have to stand up to steer, and you cannot get out and really watch the boat sail like you can on a tri. You have to hike way up on a roof and your boom is even higher to clear things....naaahhhhh!

Bowdidge Marine Designs/ Oceansky 57 Specifications

I see a powerful boat, that is first of all designed to sail, and keep clear of the wave tops. And it does not have 4 heads and 4 dbl. bunks, yet it is 57' long! Man I would love to make a passage on a boat like this.
I was actually looking for a light weight dinghy I could build in plywood when the designers page came up. I was pretty impressed with this design.
What do you think Evan? Brilliant sailing and no fluff?
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Old 09-01-2010, 21:26   #98
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Conser again

Quote:
Originally Posted by Jmolan View Post
...well I have a new candidate for the "ultimate cruising Trimaran" that is not a Trimaran, and it is not very often that a cat will catch my eye. I really have always liked pod cats. With all the charted influence. I lost interest in most cats.....There is something about having a chair way up in the air, or you have to stand up to steer, and you cannot get out and really watch the boat sail like you can on a tri. You have to hike way up on a roof and your boom is even higher to clear things....naaahhhhh!

Bowdidge Marine Designs/ Oceansky 57 Specifications
The real problem here is there would be virtually NO market for this 57 footer. Without potential buyers what builder wants to risk building it. That is one reason I wondered how it came to win that Cruising World contest???

Now if you look a little closer to that 47 Conser I pointed out in posting #81, I think you will find a similar concept in a centralized living pod suspended in the center of the vessel, and in only a 44-47 footer. You could leave the hulls empty as with the Oceansky, as they simply permit access to the berths that are in the wings.

Here is a Conser for sale:
1995 Conser Catamaran Conser 47: Racer/Cruisers - Boats.com

..and an electric motor powered one:
Used conser 47 e catamaran for sale - Split Second


"A more recent creation, the Conser 47, blends the performance characteristics of MISTRAL with outstanding creature comforts. The Conser 47 is designed as a comfortable cruising/racing catamaran for a couple with children and/or a guest couple. Her easily controlled, powerful sail plan and a 12000 pound gross weight make the Conser 47 perform like a race boat, yet carry the amenities suitable for serious offshore voyaging."
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Old 09-01-2010, 21:33   #99
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Investigator by Crowther

Here is a cruising/ performance catamaran along a somewhat similar theme but a bit larger...

...Lock Crowther's Investigator 56
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Old 09-01-2010, 21:35   #100
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Lock Crowther tri's

Lock Crowther also did sime rather nice trimarans.

Are you familar with Bull Frog and Verbatium?
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Old 09-01-2010, 21:53   #101
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I see a powerful boat, that is first of all designed to sail, and keep clear of the wave tops. And it does not have 4 heads and 4 dbl. bunks, yet it is 57' long! Man I would love to make a passage on a boat like this.
I was actually looking for a light weight dinghy I could build in plywood when the designers page came up. I was pretty impressed with this design.
G'day Jmolan,
I'm glad you liked the Oceansky 57 which I designed a few years back. It was based on our experience's living aboard our 47 ft cat for 11 years, cruising overseas, particularly crossing the equator on a number of occasions and cruising the tropics.

Quote:
The real problem here is there would be virtually NO market for this 57 footer. Without potential buyers what builder wants to risk building it. That is one reason I wondered how it came to win that Cruising World contest???
Actually Beiland,
I've had around 50 enquires regarding that design, asking if I could finish the plans for it. Even asked by a few if it would be possible to design a smaller version around 40 ft long. Catamarans in general are now becoming nothing more than glorified houseboats unfortunatly. Because of their greater volume, people in general tend to load them up more which make them heavier and unless sailing downwind..useless. Even coconuts sail downwind. This in NOT the nature, nor purpose of a multihull. Speed is their nature.
Will I get arouind to finishing off the design. Yes. We're even planing on building a smaller version ourselves
regards
Mark (MRINA)
www.bowdidgemarinedesigns.com
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Old 10-01-2010, 00:42   #102
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Mark, High five on the Oceansky 57!! Funny I was going to shoot you an email about it. Mostly just to show my admiration for such a boat designed as this is....to tell you I have been going to sea for 35 years now, and owned sailboats most of that time. Started in Hobie cats and being a surfer, I have always liked Trimarans and cats. But Very few cats appeal to me.
I just do not like very many cats anymore. I am not sure what happened over the years, but I used to really like the Rudy Choy's and the Hawaiian cat's from early on. They have a purpose look to them, the house was such that you hardly give it a notice. It was low and sleek. It was the sweeping bows, and the high curved structure between the hulls that caught my attention! They just looked ready to sail!
I started this thread with the intention of talking about the "ultimate" It does not concern itself with resale, and is not built to a marketing plan. Never will be. It maybe 30' is all, but it will serve in exceptional sailing behavior. The crisp, up and running, fun to be out there kind of sailing. Something I know has been lost in the need to satisfy a bottom line.

Here is a boat you might enjoy. Self designed and self built 44' Cat "Pantera" By Bob Smith of Victoria BC. Bob has sailed it south to Mexico and back up the hill to BC many times. Always alone. He wins every race he enters in Mexico. It is a Pod cat. Carbon fiber and foam...Made first of all to SAIL. The boat is so effortless when it is cruised. He gets 1.5 x the wind speed "up to about 15kts of wind, then we throttle back" He has a 9.9 HP outboard, and 58' Carbon wing rotating mast.
He sailed with us alongside our Searunner one light air day. I had the full main and drifter, he only had his blade of a jib up. We were side by side for hours......
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Old 10-01-2010, 01:50   #103
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What a cracker of a boat JMolan. Love it
In regards to the 40 version we were looking at designing, it was also along these same lines. The great thing about it is, the beds are actually in the mid section, between the beams leading into the god pod. Access is via the hatch in the hulls.
Many years ago I came across a similiar design, although a little more old in it's looks, but the whole concept I thought was great.

The biggest problem I find, and we've built many catamarans over the past 21 years for various clients up to 60 ft in length, is that in the end they all look like gin palaces. Another huge problem is visibility when at the helm, as one has to "look" through the bridgedeck or have a hatch through the cabin roof to poke your head through. Hopeless.
Last year we delivered a cat for a client from Cairns to Brisbane (about 900 nm) Well, here we are cruising along and here comes this 34ft cruising monohull, eases his main, we have a chat, cranks his main back up and left us for dead. This boat was 28 year old

As I said perviously, the nature of a multi is speed. The problem is, now their becoming glorified houseboats that can weigh as much as a mono. Why bother. If we keep going down this line or attitude, I'd build a mono any day of the week. That's why I came up with the Oceansky 57.
As far as "Pantera" is concerned, MAGIC. He's gone back to the grass roots of multihull design. Good on ya Bob.
regards
Mark
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Old 10-01-2010, 06:09   #104
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Absolutely agree about the bloated cats with all that luxury kit packed into the bridgedeck high above the waterline. Okay so you can make the dining table from high tech materials so it weighs less than a solid chunk of wood, but now up go the $$$$. I find the complex systems and peer through the superstructure to keep a watch/navigate design fundamentally unseamanlike.
I came to multihulls through sailing on a Wharram Oro in 1975 and then fell for his Tane design. Totally the other end of the rainbow from the floating apartment stylee - safe, quick, inexpensive, inoffensive and Low Carbon. One of the things I loved about living aboard was that I didn't feel I was taking too much from the planet. So my ultimate cruising tri would ideally be liveaboard capable, too. And for me that means weighting the compromises in design toward sailing efficiency, seamanlike handling, freedom from complex systems and less clobber/ less of my life actually loaded onto the boat i.e. put Gran's mahogany table and all the family hard copy photo albums and the 10" table saw in a lock up ashore.
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Old 10-01-2010, 08:14   #105
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Two Key Ingredents

If you make it Lt-lightweight, and you give serious considerations to the aerodynamic drags of the shapes you can make them fast.

That carbon fiber cat is a beauty and it is fast as it is light. But how many people will spring for the cost of carbon fiber hulls and decks....particularly at the prices nowadays (remember there are a lot of other items being built these days with carbon, so it drives prices up).

And don't think you can get along with just sparse reinforcement using carbon fiber. In most cases you will have under-designed the structure to act alone, and the carbon fiber will fail, with the underlining material to follow very quickly.

So I'm just talking Practicality
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