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Old 26-07-2008, 19:10   #91
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Can you post a link to that blog? I had it at one time but lost track of it.
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Old 27-07-2008, 14:27   #92
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Stuff'

I just posted a couple shots of my rigging changeover to the guy asking about carbon spars in the multihull section. Looks like I may get out of Alaska work sooner than I thought...:-) Gotta get back to Oregon and get the shopping list started before going to Mexico in early Oct.


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Old 27-07-2008, 15:42   #93
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So, where can we see them?????? Yum, yum!
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Old 27-07-2008, 18:42   #94
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Is this what you were asking?

http://www.cruisersforum.com/forums/...lls-17655.html
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Old 27-07-2008, 20:52   #95
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Mo' Stuff

Here are a few shots that maybe you can enjoy. The 44' Cat is a very special boat that hauled out and spent last summer in San Carlos. Designed and built by Bob Smith in 3 years in BC Canada. It is all honeycomb and carbon and has a 58' 3 wire wing mast. It will do 1.5x the wind speed up to "about 15kts" then he backs off a bit...:-) Bob has singlehanded the boat from Mexico to BC every summer 3 times before this. It is a sailors sailboat. Shown here on another friends trailer. 3 axle that usually hauls a 42 Cross design. All the trailers are local built with mobile home axles. My trailer was built originally for the 32' Cross boat named "Crossfire". It was Norm Cross's personal boat and is still going strong after 25-30 years. not bad for a disposable boat!
In one shot you can see our 15' Hobie skiff we used to manuver Pantera into the haulout. Bob has a 9.9 H.P. Yamaha but it was down and had been for a month or more before coming to our town.
The birds eye view is of San Carlos, all the Multi's are on moorings. We keep ours around the corner at the house in a protected bay. 10 minutes from launching the skiff and rowing out to saing off the bouy...:-)
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Old 27-07-2008, 22:12   #96
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Jmolan, Thanks! This is precisely what I'm interested in doing. Do you use the synthetic for the headstay? Using conventional jibhanks? Roller furler?
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Old 29-07-2008, 10:11   #97
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Thumbs up welcome message

Al everybody. I am new in the group but I believe that I will really enjoy it. However I have to apologize for my bad English witch is not my home language. To speak and read is ok but write !!!! I try hard. Any way thank you for the welcome - Luis
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Old 31-07-2008, 08:55   #98
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Hello everybody.
As I said before I am new in this forum, not only on the forum but as well as a trimaran sailor. My previous sailing experience although extensive, has always been in monos and cats, never a trimaran. With a little bit of luck I might became a proud and happy owner of a CC44 trimaran. I did not see the boat yet, I will probably see her next week, but according to the emails the boat was built in 1986 (22 years old) and need some small repair in the hull and decks. I don’t know what he means by “small repairs”. I would like asking to this forum companions a few questions. I believe that the constant camber construction is a kind of cold mold process. My first question is – Is it difficult to repair cold molded panels. Is there a book where I can learn about it ? I forgot to say that I am in Brazil – Rio de Janeiro, where this type of information is not easy to find. Brazilians in general don’t like epoxy/wood boats. - 90% of them only accept fiberglass. Also can I have tips of what should I be looking for in terms of dry rot or other type of damages. The second question is the standing rig. I would like to have opinions about how reliable a 22 years old classic SS rigging is? What should I look for to find out weak points? Probably I will have a lot o more questions, but for the moment I will be very grateful if some body can help. Thank you all - Luis
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Old 31-07-2008, 09:23   #99
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Luis, If you decide to purchase the wood/epoxy boat, do you have access to epoxy resin systems like System 3 or WEST System? You can use other epoxies, but the further you get from formulations that are simple to apply, don't need special curing techniques, and are relatively safe to work with, well, things get more complicated.

First, get a copy of the Gougeon Brothers book (Gougeon Brothers, Inc.) to learn about the techniques of working with epoxies, in general. You will probably discover that it is far easier than you had imagined.

Second, and this should be easy for you, locate a good source of local plywood. It should have as many thin ply pieces per thickness as possible. It would really help if the glue holding the laminates together is waterproof (to prevent delamination in case of damage to the outside skin). A marine ply or exterior, premium grade (usually a marine ply reject) is the target product. I don't know how plywood is classified in Brazil, but I'm sure there is a good system.

Generally, you can simply cut out any rot, back to solid wood, prepare a filler piece, with adequate bonding between the two pieces of wood, and glue it in. If you need additional structural strength, you can use backing blocks or other techniques. These technical terms are all explained in well-illustrated detail in the Gougeon book.

The rigging is another story, particularly in the tropics. As many folks in Cruiser's Forum have observed previously, the issue is rust on so-called "stainless steel". It can occur, most destructively, inside the swaged terminals at the bottom of the rigging, where it attaches to the turnbuckles and chainplates. You can purchase a two-part chemical dye that helps identify a crack in the metal swage cylinder. Another potential area of concern is how the shrouds (the standing rigging) connect at the top of the mast, and how the spreaders are fastened. If there is a bolt passing through the mast, it will have an unseen, interior tube surrounding it to prevent the sides of the mast tube from squeezing together when the fastener nuts are tightened. After twenty years (sometimes sooner), corrosion can occur at the intersection of the nut and the threaded portion of the bolt. The result is a sudden loss of the end of the bolt, which can lead to the mast folding at the spreader. It would be an excellent idea to remove the mast, replace all the compression bolts, soon after purchase. It is also a great time to remove all the hardware, repaint the mast, and replace any needed fasteners, VHF cable, electrical wiring, etc. Then, you can more easily add new gear (radar, instruments, L.E.D. masthead lighting, etc.) and some new rigging wire. You might consider using mechanical (Norseman, for example) terminals at the lower ends of the rigging, rather than swaged. I hope this helps.
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Old 31-07-2008, 11:37   #100
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Roy. - It was very kind of you to give me a so prompt answer as well as the good advice.
Unfortunately the Gougeon Brother products are not available here in Brazil. I am going to order the book but to import the products is not feasible due to the import taxes. This means that to have the WEST system is out of question, however we do have epoxy resins and I am aware of how to work with them. My doubt was how to fill a space – I mean, should I fill it with layers of tiny wood (cold molded style) or with only one piece of marine ply with adequate thickness, but I believe that the Gougeon book mentioned by you, will show me how to do it. Your advise about the rigging have also a lot of good sense. Of course that the very first thing that I intend to do (if I buy the boat) is to unstep the mast. However I do not believe that the present owner will allow me to do it before the final stage of the deal, even because it is not cheap to do so. If the general condition of the rigging is reasonable, that’s ok, but if I have to replace all the cables etc, what could be considered a good deal might became a BAD one. That’s why I asked what are the chances of 22 years old rigging to be in reasonable status. I know that the rigging of catamaran suffers much more than of the monohull, but what about a trimaran ? Well Roy, thank you again for your advise. I will keep you informed of the out come. Regards, Luis
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Old 31-07-2008, 15:39   #101
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rigging

luis,
if you're going to do any serious sailing/cruising, at 22 years old it's probably time to change the rigging. Stainless steel wire fatigues over time and that fatigue isn't always visible to the eye. If you're serious about the boat I'd be factoring in the cost of re-rigging, if not now, at some stage in the near future.

Ply and epoxy make good boats. [get yourself plenty of disposable gloves]
Good luck.
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Old 31-07-2008, 15:42   #102
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Luis, can you take a couple of photos of the damage? One closeup of the damaged area, and one picture showing its location relative to its position on the boat? A simple way to determine the extent of rotted material is to gently tap on the perimeter of the damaged area with the wooden handle of a hammer, or the handle end of a screw driver. Try it first on an area you are sure is solid, just to establish an idea of the "sound" of the tap. It will have a higher frequency, sharper rap sound, like two drumsticks clicked together. You're Brazilian, it should be natural, right? The "dead" or muffled tone would indicate less dense and probably rotted material. Put a couple pieces of colored tape or make a mark with an eraseable marker showing the extent of the damage. Include that in your photo(s).
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Old 31-07-2008, 23:40   #103
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The tapping method Roy describes is an easy method to find wet or rotted sections. Likely places to check are around any fittings, cleats, stanchion bases, etc. Many times these will be localized small areas and not to difficult to repair. Check the deck edges around hatches in the wing. Depending on how they are built this can be a problem area but again this can be repaired. Earlier in this thread there was some discussion on this. The inside of the boat in the amas, bilges, and underside of the deck is hopefully just coated with epoxy. Any water intrusion of the laminate will show up as a dark discoloration. If painted it is a little harder to spot. I think the centerboard trunk is a critical area to check. The four bilge compartments(2 per side) are commonly used for fuel and water tanks. The engine may also be located in one of these but not always. Hopefully the tanks are empty and removable so you can check this area. In my boat I can have these tanks out it 15 minutes. Check out the ends of the centerboard trunk as best you can on the inside and outside for any failure of the glue joint. A small mirror taped to a stick may come in handy.
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Old 01-08-2008, 07:27   #104
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Thank you all
I have took notes of everything and I will act accordingly. The visit to this boat is booked for Saturday August 9th. Until there I cross my fingers. It is pity that California is so far away. The Marples 44 that is there for sale sounds a good deal. Thank’s once again.
Luis.
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Old 01-08-2008, 13:31   #105
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center of weight, searunner 37

searunner 37'

I am trying to estimate the center of weight for placement on homebuilt trailer. Working with a 42' mobile home frame. Have to get it right the first time as I won't be able to do a test run on the trailer or anything like that...

my best guess is based upon where the "center" of the centerboard sits when in the down position. I have measured this to be between 66" and 76" from the back end of my mini keel. Pretty close to the center of the trunk opening.
Does this sound about right?

~8000 -8500 lb boat (engine out, mostly stripped) estimate 2500+ lb trailer so far. Only have to go ~1/2 mile...

Also, I would like to shoot for a tongue weight on the "higher" end of the acceptable range given the steep grade of a hill that we have to go up. I would therefore like to shoot for 15% of the weight on the tongue

how many inches forward would you position the boat's center of weight from the center of the axles to get this 15%?

Also, to throw in yet another variable, the trailer currently has 2 axles (rated 6,000 lb each), they are a little far back for my tastes. It is probably doable as-is, but more of the back of the boat would be overhanging than I would like to see, especially going up a the hill...
I have the option of welding a third axle in front of the other 2. I wouldn't do this for weight, just to be able to move the boat forward on the trailer another 5 feet or so. This seems to me that it would also add greater flexibility when positioning the center of weight on the trailer... I am aware of the issues of "skidding" wheels when turning a triple axle trailer. This is a non issue because it is for a one time use, 2 short trips. Anything else to consider with a 3 axle trailer?

Would you add the third axle?

Any HELP would be very greatly appreciated to make the whole process go as smoothly as possible

thank you!
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