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Old 06-09-2013, 09:10   #2386
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Re: Trimaran - Especially Searunner - Owners

No biggie, I like Searunners fine and have done a lot to support and rehab several.

My point is that the Transpacifc yacht club has no record of a race in 1972. So I don't feel it was an official Transpacifc race, at least it is not recorded as such in the online PDF of Transpacifc history. Not saying it didn't happen or they were wicked stoned and wicked fast the entire race......
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Old 06-09-2013, 09:24   #2387
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Re: Trimaran - Especially Searunner - Owners

It's ok MJ, sensible saiors don't listen to you either. I love Searunners but some of their sailors shuldn't be posting. While I laugh about people advocating 6 inch immersion overloads as safe I have to wonder if there is any particular newbie targeted or just sailors in general? The designers specified the maximum loads so people wouldn't get killed, if people want to carry the loads of a monohull they should just get one. Jim Brown designed these boats without math basing the scantlings and loads on the trial and error of rugged sailing. For people considering exceeding those limits the engineering should be done to determine the limits. The xenophobic attitudes towards other multihull designs presented by some on this thread do nothing to further the cause of trimarans.

The Multihull Transpac was a split from the original race starting in the 60s and those actors really did sail in it. By the 70s Rudy Choy was in Hawai pursuing business interests and the clients of CSK were moving on to other designs or interests. I'd have to look it up but the "Official" Transpac probably started a multihull class eventually.
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Old 06-09-2013, 09:41   #2388
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Re: Trimaran - Especially Searunner - Owners

Mark, troll alert. Initiate subject change. We know the individual and agenda. It and he don't subscribe to our views of improving the Searunners. Don't feed him the attention he needs.

On another note, I still haven't hooked up the reefer yet, as I'm waiting on a Carel digital thermostat. I have the two cold plates, now, for the freezer, and a balance remaining in my account with Nanopore for the Vacuum Insulated Panels. There's not too much remaining before I have some cold beer. I still have to install the water cooling parts. Sigh, so many details......

The other projects status: THE AMAZING HOTROD STOVE - I'm going to have to go to Los Angeles for the insulation material. They want as much for shipping as the material costs. I'm just starting to play with it again, since once the reefer is in, I will get back to the galley cabinetwork, installing the new stove and the sink.

THE ONGOING OVERHAUL OF THE MAST - I just finished a customer's mast and I'm feeling particularly ashamed at not getting mine done. I'm still waiting for a bit more $$ so I can install the 4G radar while I'm doing it.

THE CATCH-UP-WITH MARK'S-BRILLIANCE HARD DODGER - This one is the most intimidating, given how much time goes into it. I wake at three AM with ideas and questions. And I only want to do it once, as I'm sure Mark understands.

THE CARBON FIBER STEALTH SWIMSTEP - This one is the easiest to think about, and the costliest to produce, thus making the decision to put it off so much easier.

and lastly, THE CENTERBOARD OF DREAMS is still sitting in the shop waiting for me to power plane a fat spot off at the top.......

The summer monsoons don't help. I just want to find a cool spot and drink ice cold beer, while watching the thunderheads build up over Mexico and Arizona. This is always the hardest part of the year to work on the boat, and the busiest to work on other people's boats. Where did I put that lottery ticket?
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Old 06-09-2013, 10:40   #2389
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Re: Trimaran - Especially Searunner - Owners

LOL...."where are them blinders honey? Lets serve up another ton....those secret slimming agenda people are telling us these here buggies can't carry as much as a Tahiti Ketch!"
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Old 06-09-2013, 11:32   #2390
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Re: Trimaran - Especially Searunner - Owners

Ok, one last point. We are debating a totally useless claim anyway. The "victory" was a CORRECTED time "record". You could enter a bath tub with a junk rig the next year and claim that victory yourself if you had a good enough rating.

I think the justifiable importance is they sailed to Hawaii in 10 odd days which is quite fast. I have no idea whether they were racing under a mathematical measurement rating or a pefronormance assigned rating, I can imagine a home built plywood trimaran getting a pretty cozy performance rating. In which case they would never have been allowed to race again under that rating! I'm hoping for just the same thing for my boat when I attempt a repeat of my 2003 Biscayne Bay Columbus regatta overall win next year.

On a related side note. A Santa Cruz 70 (Bill Lee) has a lot in common underwater shape wise with a Searunner 37 main hull.
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Old 06-09-2013, 21:13   #2391
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Re: Trimaran - Especially Searunner - Owners

I dont think there would be another goody woody trimaran out there that could match that 37ft Searunner of John Marples. I did hear that there where over 2000 plans sold for building the Searunner. And with its safety record cruising oceans of the world second to no boat ever. Infact the Searunner is not only a genious inside layout but they can be quick. Proof is now history. This thread is titled Trimaran especially Searunners. Possible the reason for that is they are superior Trimarans. Even today there design is clever. there wouldn't be a Searunner owner that was unhappy if used for correct intentions that is go Seafaring. Those people who like to knock other boats do so in their cheap seats... literally.... nothing else to do i suppose.. they should go sailing.
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Old 07-09-2013, 18:17   #2392
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Re: Trimaran - Especially Searunner - Owners

AMEN TO THAT ROSS, all of it!


Roy, agreed...
Man, you're REALLY rebuilding your back cabin aren't you! When you get your reefer done, it will be impressive I'm sure. If we were on the same side of the country, when the time comes, I would stop by and see if it keeps your beer at the proper level of chill... all in the name of science of course.

That must be some "hard" stove insulation, not just spun alumina, for the shipping to be so high?

A suggestion about your upcoming RADAR install. Your radome is larger than mine, so this may not apply, but... I like to have the radome positioned just under the baby stay. This is a protected position from sails and sheets by the stay, and having this considerable amount of weight down low, will pay dividends on the motion of the boat. (Even on the 40) At this lower height than some would prefer, there is actually no loss of range when tracking storms due to the storms height, and in my view, the difference between 15 miles vs 25 miles in tracking ships, is academic... At least compared to putting that much weight near the top of the mast, it seems like a good trade off to me. Just a thought...

We all will be interested in the results of your light weight CB mod. This will I suppose, knock 150 or 200 lbs off of the boat? More payload for fun stuff, right? I'm not so brave, but may rebuild our sterncastle dinette table out of foam, to trim a bit or weight off. I am finding lately, that the least labor intensive route, is reducing the volume or seize/weight of "stuff" onboard. I just swapped out my 80 cu/ft SCUBA tank for a 63, for example, and Mariam now has a Kindle for reading. Books add up to a LOT of weight! The 40'er of coarse, has so much more payload, that you don't need to be so vigilant.

In your case, Roy, I know you needed to rebuild the CB anyway... I suppose you will have to power plane that hump deeper than necessary, to leave room for building the glass back up? Keep us posted.

When it comes to summer monsoons... I feel your pain man! We're in the same boat/puddle here...
I am tentatively finishing up painting my decks (with topcoat only), having done the cabin top last year. The AwlGrip nonskid here, like the rest, is not quite 10 years old. I expect several more years of service everywhere else, but my nonskid needed a spiff up. I had done it SO nonskid back then, like a solid sheet of 80 grit sandpaper, (for our 2 year Eastern Caribbean cruise), that I can't easily keep it clean any more. Our slip is almost in fresh water in winter, and we get green mildew growing in the grit on the north side. We never had this problem when the boat was salty.
Anyway, 3 thin rolled on topcoats (sans grit) over the nonskid, will make it 30% less nonskid, especially barefoot, BUT, we will be able to clean her up without a power washer! We will just have to wear boat sandals and be more careful when the decks are wet.

Point I was getting to: We broke the decks up into 4 segments, starting with the 4 corners. For EACH of these segments, I need 3 CONSECUTIVE days with NO RAIN. If I skip a day, I loose the chemical bond window! BIG bummer... Yesterday's paint, coat #1, did get rained on, but 4 hours later. I had used accelerator in the mix, so it was OK, but just barely! Today's coat went fine too, and hopefully tomorrow's will as well.
Then we just need 3 more sessions of 3 consecutive "guaranteed rain free days", in the next two months, before it gets cold.
With our "new" Summer norm being rain daily or every other day, that is a VERY tall order! At least when it comes to doing the hatches, I can remove them if necessary.

This and the UV issue, is why I encourage those with really big outside projects, to put her under a structure, temporary or otherwise...

YOUR DODGER:
Roy... You definitely want to draw the dodger to scale to get it all sussed out in your mind, before switching to doorskin and duct tape full size models. In my case I had been a draftsman, so had the table, tools, etc. As evening entertainment, I'd draw it one way, and then the other, each time with scale sized stick figures, to get the ergos right.
I tried various hard tops as well, but just couldn't shake remembering that I keep having to ride out hurricanes! (>12) I like Ross's combination hard top set up, however. Perhaps he could post more close up photos?

The SR 31 lends itself to a LIGHT Strataglass curtained front, hardtop, due to NOT having the mast in the cockpit. Not so with ours boats... Between the bimini & dodger, I decided that I needed one "hard" version or the other, but not to burden the boat with the weight of both, AND there was the hurricane issue.

What I settled on was to appease the artiest in me, and to hell with the hours of labor involved, (>1,000). I wanted it to accentuate the lines of the boat and not ruin them.

Being a composite structure, the empty frame was < 35 lbs, but that almost doubled with the installation of the 1/4" lexan. I might use 3/16 Lexan next time to save weight, and when not under way, cover the lenses with double layered OPAQUE Sunbrella from the get go... (which we NOW use). This way it will remain clear for decades!

REGARDING THE WEIGHT... It is replacing the windshield drawn, so I figured I was just 40 lbs over design weight for including this addition, that TWO crew can stand on. With the light weight bimini attached to the hard dodger with either the Sunbrella connecting piece, OR the "openable smile" clear front curtains, it becomes a full cockpit windshield. I did have to design the entire set up and enclosure sections FIRST, and then draw sheet winches aft and mast winches up high, in locations that would accommodate the enclosure, not the other way around. Tricky stuff!

In your case, Roy, the opposite is true, so you have more of a challenge! As much as I LOVE the aesthetics of our dodger, I would not advocate folks spending 1,000 hours+ on theirs. In our case, it sat in the corner for years as a filler project, to fill down time. It was entertainment! In hindsight, however, it IS my nicest piece...

A much faster shape to build would be a bit of a power boat look. Maybe an aft sloping 3 faceted but flat windshield with at least the middle facet including a down swinging openable hatch, like a Lewmar "Ocean Series" (custom glazed with safety glass). Weight is less of an issue on the 40... I know folks who did this glass glazing in a hatch, and it is no big deal. Next... mount a rounded corner, curved, foam core top, that extends beyond the windshield's front facets & its sides, about 5 or 6" more than the inward sloping sides.

This makes vacuum bagging the front unnecessary, and the time consuming top to side radii as well. I think it would look OK, and the opening front hatch would reduce the need for top hatches, like our's has. A top curtain "attachment strip" and aft edge drip dam, as well as a drip dam on the underside aft edge, would finish her up, ready for curtains to the bimini!

With your propensity for excellence, I'm sure it will be a trip!

I'm looking for MY lottery ticket too!
Mark


Photos...
Just for inspiration! Again, please excuse the repetition...
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Old 07-09-2013, 18:36   #2393
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Re: Trimaran - Especially Searunner - Owners

Hey, just got back from sailing optis with my 6 y/o son. Who on here needs to go sailing more?
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Old 08-09-2013, 09:30   #2394
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Re: Trimaran - Especially Searunner - Owners

Just WOW! And thanks for all the Searunner talk! I got to admit - the talent and time some of you put into your boats (not to mention the money) is impressive and a little intimidating!

Nevertheless I agree wholeheartedly. Jim Brown really had a stroke of genius when he designed these boats. My 31 A-frame is no exception. Yeah, the 34 has a little more room but the 31 has plenty of space for 2 or 3 people extended cruising (if they are organized).

I was out in the sound yesterday with 15 knots and making 8-9 off the wind with my old lucky sails (my hank on genny came from a chopped up 31er from the mid 70's!) The rest of my sail inventory are only 20 years old.

And you may not believe this but there was a "USA" monohull out there (looked like a training crew). I guess it was a 32. I don't know what it was but it came up behind me and couldn't catch me close-hauled. I just about stayed as tight as she did the whole while. Good performance for a cruiser! She killed me on the tack though.

I had some peeling on the hulls 9 years ago and finished her with Interlux Toplac. Since then I have just washed her and put a coat of Sherwin-Williams latex and for fun a few years later put some B&G concrete and wood sealer on the hulls just to see how it held up. So far so good. After the Toplac I have since used Ben Moore Porch and Deck on the topside. Yeah, she peels in spots and I got to touch her up. My real objection with the topside is that the house paint doesn't clean up real well. Of course she never sees fresh water until the end of the year. Salt water cleaning seems to be all right.

I sure would like to have her all gussied up but I just don't have the time, patience or inclination. Keeping the interior clean and livable has top priority for me.

In terms of room the downfall of the 31er is the center cockpit Adding a complete enclosure which can be removed and deployed quickly for use while sailing and at anchor really increases the usability of the entire front and aft cabins. As usual, Jim Brown's design on Scrimshaw makes things real cozy. Right now I am in the process of building the biimini part and would like to do a dodger too. I would consider a hard dodger if it was low profile enough. It will probably take me a year to figure this out! I mock up one piece of plastic or metal tube at a time to see how I like it. So far I have two pieces in stainless and ideas for the rest.
***** *************************
I wanted to ask about this 6" clearance of the floats. Dumb question maybe but you measuring from the waterline? No. Must be from the center line, right? Here is a pic from yesterday. Not quite level but the port float stern is out of the water too. I estimate I have about 500lbs of stuff on her now including anchor, rode and sails. According to the construction manual the cruising payload is 1400 pounds. So are we thinking that adding 3 more people at 200 each allows for only 300 more pounds? OR . . . is the payload already taking anchor, sails and persons in to consideration? OR . . . just keep on weighing it down until you get to where? Shouldn't it just get down to waterline and no further?
*********************************

Thanks for all the discussions on Searunners!

J
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Old 08-09-2013, 09:34   #2395
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Re: Trimaran - Especially Searunner - Owners

Oh - note my nets. I have been meaning to tie that one up a little better. Tennis court nets! They are free since most get replaced every year and hold up real well!
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Old 08-09-2013, 09:53   #2396
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Re: Trimaran - Especially Searunner - Owners

Ok, NO ONE GET PISSED

But it seems to me the guys using the latex paint and other "inferior" methods and products are the ones out sailing!

The other group is chained to the dock or boatyard trying to come up with the time or money to get those last projects "perfect"

I'm still trying to figure out how Mark Hellsall built a SR 37 alone in about 15 months, no Internet I guess!
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Old 08-09-2013, 09:55   #2397
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Re: Trimaran - Especially Searunner - Owners

Jim

I think you said your boat is French made okoume ply. That stuff is about 30% lighter than fir; that makes your boat a lot lighter than most.
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Old 08-09-2013, 10:25   #2398
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Re: Trimaran - Especially Searunner - Owners

And you've done the math right. 300 is what would be left. If it is built with lighter wood you can add more. You can carry more weight but have to realize it is using up the safety margins for rough weather. Chris White damaged his A-frames and the ones on my 31 developed problems but the boat was built heavy....using up those margins.

We put over 1000 miles on the Nicol again sailing North this summer and like everyone else are scrambling with the weather to get more things done before winter. I'm even going to try to touch up the latex here and there from the usual wear and odd patches. Right now the table is getting made as we finish up the inside then out rebuild.
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Old 08-09-2013, 11:09   #2399
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Re: Trimaran - Especially Searunner - Owners

I checked my 31 notes and the cruising payload was listed to 1400 pounds. Your normal weekend sailing gear such as sails and anchor wouldn't be counted but stores, extra fuel, water and crew + their gear would be payload. To carry more switching to open bins with netting and skipping things like drawers (the kind you pull out, not your skivvies) and cupboard doors is the easy fix. These payload guidelines don't take into account the guys that have huge amounts of gear and equipment, batteries etc....they consider normal weekend boat stuff.
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Old 08-09-2013, 15:50   #2400
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Re: Trimaran - Especially Searunner - Owners

Cav, you're just the jerk I had in mine with that sloppy seamanship and latex paint. glad toy had a great summer; 1000 miles in one summer is a decades worth of sailing for most of these arm chair types. I did a 300 mile delivery in July to add to my weekly day sails for the year.
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