Trimaran - Especially Searunner - Owners

[dale d]

Sounds like you have a too hard to beat deal going with the Chula Vista yard. Shows that years and years of being a community leader pays off.
San Carlos is a great spot for a guy like me that hasn't spent any time among people my own age in years. Everyone in my fishing village is much younger than I am. Here in San Carlos it seems everyone is my age of older.
I hear the Sea of Cortez is amazing cruising.
I hope to one day report to the list on that. I do hope you head this way, I would love to crawl around Wilderness and learn something.
I've been researching the weather and finding there are only a few months that are comfortable to my tropical bones. May and June in the summer and October, November in the winter. Too hot or too cold in the other months. I was here in February and was just too uncomfortable with the cold. I hear August and September are like a Pizza oven.
That's the cool thing about having a cruising boat, you can dial in the weather. These months also bracket the Hurricane season. If i choose to be here for theses months I could do two major haul-outs a year. Oh the joy!

I've attached photos of the three Sea Runners, Corazon, Molly Brown and Tie Fighter and a shot of my two classics from the '70's my CT Honda 90 and Corazon.

dale.

[Mark Johnson]

Dale:
On the 34, to remove the centerboard, you first remove the steering pedestal. Then you loosen the rig and remove the aft runners & lowers. Next, unbolt the mast base across the trunk, and push it all the way forward with a jack. Now you can use a come-along or block & tackle to lift the board out. The top hook goes to the boom, and the bottom attaches to the CB control line's pad eye. (After removing the pin), it will lift out at a slight angle, about 30 degrees off of vertical. Then you manhandle the > 300# beast from there. Mariam & I did it alone, but it was NOT easy.

ON THE 34... There is NO way to get it out through the bottom, as the slot there is heavily glassed to be way narrower than the upper part of the board.

The other Searunner's requirements vary, so their owners should speak up on that. Obviously Roys 40'er is different from the 34.

On the 34, you definitely DO need an up line, at least on ours. The 34s board is not crescent shaped at all, it is a rectangle that is hinged in the middle at the top. It has no natural tendency to come up from buoyancy at all, "until" it is raised just a bit to a slight angle further away from vertical. This "up line" is pulled solely by hand, to get her started, and then it wants to fly up! NOW you have to keep the down line semi taught, with a turn on a cleat or something, to pay it out slowly and keep the board from coming up too fast. Once you get the knack, it works perfectly!

OUR CB may be a bit tighter than some 34s, because of the split hose cushions at the top, and rubber fairing flap at the bottom slot. It is a 0 tolerance snug fit ONLY at the fully down position, so it never rattles... This additional friction further creates the need for the up line, just to get her started. The block on this line can be a small one.

Mark

[Mark Johnson]

Dale,
I forgot to point out that on the SR 34, the 3/8" control lines are attached to the board in as strong a way as possible! After using a mast winch to lower and hold the board a bit past where I want it, I attach a 3' long X 1/8" parachute chord to the down line with a rolling hitch, (before the winch), as a fuse. Then I run the other end of this chord to a cam cleat on the mast. Next I take all of the turns OFF of the winch, and just lay the loose control line's end over the winches drum. The rest of the control line is now held tight by this little 1/8" "fuse" chord, which will pop if I ever hit something.

This fuse attachment procedure only takes me 15 seconds each time, and has saved the board & blocks from damage a couple of times. It is a step that is not to be omitted.

The advantage of firmly attaching the business end of the control lines, is that you can lift the board out by them, and if you hit something and your fuse pops, you can immediately lower it again and re-fuse it from above, without painstakingly removing coverplates to re-attach control lines to the pad eye.

Another thought is that on the 34, the lines could theoretically jamb in the space next to the board, if it flys up and either control line is just hanging loose in the trunk. You want these lines controlled and a bit taught when it goes up OR down.

Mark

[dale d]

Good advice. Thanks Mark
I hate to ask how you learned these tips. <grin>

about CB adjustment, do you ever sail with the board in any position other than down?
can you adjust trim with the board ?

I'm painting floorboards on the Avon today and finial inspection of the mast and rigging. I will sail one day I just know it.

[Roy M]

Wow! There is a difference, indeed. Mine is completely different. With the pedestal mounted on the starboard side of the trunk, I merely pull off the wheel, remove the control line from the block aft and attach it to the halyard, pull the axle pin out and raise the board in the slot aft of the mast. It takes a little pull aft to get the board vertical in the first emerging foot, then it comes right out. I never seem to get pics of this event because I usually do the remove and replace with one other person.

Here are a bunch of pics:
The old board which split from hitting stuff and swelled, jamming in the trunk slightly.
The prop, folded, with PropSpeed on the prop and shaft (not under the zinc).
The steering tiller arm and its associated bellows, a Hurst transmission boot and included stainless finishing ring. The old one shows signs of dullness, but no cracks from ultraviolet light.
The refaired lower gudgeon, ready for installation.
Installed.
View down the centerboard trunk, during launch. Note that the aft (and forward) end is u-shaped and split down the middle. I built it this way to get a super fair surface. Everything was coated with graphite epoxy at that time. You can also see the u-bolt passing through the aft end of the trunk. This is super strong and normally holds a block attached with a high strength snap shackle. The white throughhull fitting is the aft electric bilge pump exhaust.

[dale d]

Roy
would you run the reasoning for fairing the gudgeons by me again? Is that Splash Zone?
Graphite Epoxy, I've seen the additive at West Marine, what is it's uses?

How was the motor back to Shelter Island? You know I spent my youth in San Diego Bay, getting all misty eyed thinking about it. Ahhh yes but the Harbor Police and the anchoring restrictions kinda moved me along.
Love the Mexican attitude. You want a cruising permit? Here's one for ten years. Want another one sure here's another ten years.

[Roy M]

Dale, I started using the fairings over the gudgeon and pintle of the rudder when I realized what a drag it was trying to clean the marine growth off them. Now, it is an absolute dream to wipe down this area. It's just Splash Zone epoxy putty, faired into shape like clay, then sanded, primed and painted with antifouling. The black paint is Sherwin Williams Seavoyage zinc bottom paint with echinacea, it has been used by the Navy for the past five years. I was asked to try it out by San Diego Marine Exchange who will be offering it for sale. I liked it, though, next time I'll thin it with more naptha than they recommended and I may spray it with an airless to get a less-stippled finish. For the time being, it will be good enough for my immediate needs.

The graphite powder is a different thing. You mix the dry powder into fresh epoxy resin to achieve a jet black material that has amazing resistance to abrasion. When I built my hulls, I used it on all the surfaces below the water line to prevent abrading the fiberglass if I had to do really rough sanding of barnacles, or to resist scratches when I beached the boat. It, too, worked out better than I imagined.

The motor back to Shelter Island was nice, even though I had 12-15 knot breezes on the nose. The engine ran smoothly, the boat was responsive, and there were no surprises to challenge my sore, tired body (something you apparently shared in your adventure). The medicinal alcohol I consumed at the end of the 1 1/2 hour trip was a perfect solution to the minor miseries. I'll send more pics tomorrow.

[Mark Johnson]

Hi Dale...
I never used to use the board at any position but fully down, until we ended up based here... 3 hours up the extreemly wide Neuse River. Now, if we are just going out for a quick daysail, we are often in very shallow water. In this case, rather than sailing with the CB fully down, which = about 7' draft, we have it half way down, which = about 5' draft. In this extremely swept back position, the board REALLY wants to kick up, so any touch of the bottom pops the fuse and it comes right up. So far, so good.

This fully OR 1/2 way down position is btw... far better for tricky docking in tight quarters, than fully raised, as it really improves steering, and cuts down on our boat's turning radius. I just hope I never hit bottom hard like this, (lowered), IN REVERSE! It would drive the centerboard through the trunk, and into the front cabin!!! So, BE CAREFUL AND GO SLOW in reverse, with the board down in shallow water. The same is true of coarse, of our forward hinged skeg rudders. You don't want them to hit bottom in reverse either.

Sloping the board aft a bit for trimming reduces weatherhelm, but unless you have a lot of it, you are better off with it fully down at the angle on the plans sheet, or a bit less.

For windward points of sail...
The boat balances and sails best with the board fully down, just "adequately" in the half way down position, and rather poorly if it is fully raised. Then she resembles my old Wharram... The motion suffers too. Our centerboards make Searunners what they are!

A word of warning: Your control blocks "may" be to wimpy! Mine were... I blew up the first THREE identical versions of the aft block. They were 1,700 # WL, all SS Ronstans, with bolted on bases, that had 3/8" RIVETED on axle pins. This was their weak point, NOT corrosion . It was the RIVETS to their SS base.

I never broke one from collision, it was from the stress of cranking the CB down. The buoyancy of the board is magnified by the long lever arm to it's pin, and the considerable load is then doubled by this being a 180 degree "turning" block situation.
The lever arm to pull the CB down is minimal, and my previously described additional friction didn't help, (although it is minor)...

The last time this happened, I finally coughed up the bucks to fix the problem permanently! It is this Harken all SS block, with a 3/8" 316 grade through bolt for an axle. This pair of blocks have 2,500# WLs, and 5,000# BLs! With their 1/2" thick fiberglass backing blocks, this should never repeat itself. Still, I now crank the board down gently, and if underway, I let the rocking of the boat nurse it down, while I just apply gentile pressure with the winch. Remember, if there is 1,000#s of force on the down line, there is 1,500#s on the front turning block, and 2,000#s on the aft turning block, (because the line's lead "reverses" 180 degrees, thereby doubling the load on the block).

Here it is, for you guys with a SR 34 that have the old specified blocks, like I did. NOW I see that the plans sheet has been changed, and a 3/8" THROUGH BOLTED axle is called for... It has been years later now, and these new Harken ESP blocks hold up great!

Harken 57 mm Single Footblock: Mauri Pro Sailing



A NOTE FOR ALL ABOUT BOTTOM PAINT: IF you want a VERY smooth bottom job, there is easily a free 1/2 a knot of boat speed in it! To achieve this... I use WEST system foam rollers, and apply 1 or 2 more, but "thinner" coats with them. The mills work out the same. Then, after it is dry, I go over it quickly by hand, with 220 grit Stickit disks on a soft hand pad.
It always makes guys in the yard laugh, but is almost like sprayed!



Roy,
Yep, when you told me how easily you could remove your board, I knew that they were very different in a lot of ways. I have not removed my CB since the mast went on, but estimate it would take 2 hard days of work to get it out.

Your CB trunk end wall "u" bolt, is a VERY strong way to have the beefy size block that you need here. Good idea! Just a thought... With the new foam board, a block with > 3,500# WL here, might give you peace of mind? I think that the down haul load might double.

I like the "graphite" bottom & CB trunk idea. I used the old CopperPoxy stuff on my bottom and the board, as well as up a foot into the trunk too. I did remove 10% of it later where it caused electrolysis issues, and it was useless as an antifouling, (like the similar products were too), but it IS rock hard. Now covered with bottom paint, it gives me something to sand on, when needs be.

That PropSpeed is indeed great stuff, just EXPENSIVE. I tried a poor mans alternative last year, "PropGlop". It was an underwater applied wax sort of stuff. I give it a "thumb's down".

Your rudder hardware fairings are definitely easier to keep clean than my "just bottom painted" hardware. In my case, however, the rudder hardware is just 304 SS, so I would be too concerned about hidden corrosion. With bottom paint, when a bit of paint looses adhesion from the metal, and water gets in, the piece of paint promptly falls off, so there is no crevice to corrode in. But... that's just my fear. The green bottom paint shot below, was after 5.5 years, since my last haul.

I understand that you remove the fairings and inspect the hardware at each haul out, and this has always worked for you, so stick with what works. After 30 years, you surely have your routine all sussed out!

Good that you are afloat again, without incident. Thanks for the photos!

Mark

[Roy M]

Okay, here are the rest of the pics I took in the yard:

The status of the fairing after 6 years, immediately taken when hauled out.
The rudder pintle after the rudder was removed. Still had grease and no appreciable wear on Delrin washers.
Haulout condition of cutlass bearing strut fairing and prop.
Lower gudgeon fitting with fairing removed (all 316 stainless material). Minor staining of leading edge where no fairing was installed.
Bow view after primer applied. Note how the deck protrudes beyond hull for attaching pulpit hardware, etc.
The paint, and its thinner, Seavoyage by Sherwin Williams.
View forward with primer applied. Note pintle at waterline, and FessTool vacuum tool near the bow. I couldn't have done the grinding of the bottom in this yard without that tool.
First coat of antifouling paint at bow. Next time, after fairing the existing paint, I'll use Mark's suggestion of the low nap foam rollers. The one I used left too much stipple for my taste. The paint, itself, is very nice to apply, dries fast, and leaves a very shiny, durable coat.

[Mark Johnson]

She's beautiful Roy!

I know how good it feels to be off the boatyard hook for a few years. My bottom paint is nearing the end of it's first year, and I have not yet started my usual summer bi-weekly scrub regimen. I can feel 1/8" - 1/4" of fur and a few small barnacles on there. It will probably take an entire SCUBA tank to get her "right" for the season, and then all of the others will be a quick wipe down with a gloved hand... Then I need to resume my refurbishing, with a refresher coat or two on my deck's nonskid. Seems like the work never ends. At least we can take Delphys out to the Cape once in a while, to remember why we do it.

Your fairings do indeed seem to be working well for you. WOW! That lower gudgeon & pintle is about 4X the size of mine! Being of 316 grade SS, rather than 304, makes a LOT of difference. (The underwater 316 SS block in my CB trunk, is holding up fine).

When I cleaned up my lower hardware for more primer & paint, there was a dime sized piece of the metal eaten away since the last haul, 5.5 years earlier. It was in an insignificant spot, but I DO have to keep an eye on it.


A note to all about... UNDERWATER METAL:
What we all do (= what works with our underwater metal), will vary from boat to boat, even within the same design. THERE IS NO ONE CORRECT WAY TO DO IT.

I started out with bare SS rudder hardware that was protected by zincs on the lower hardware, and bonded to other zincs on the uppers. This was per ABYC, the plans, and John's advice. It worked for years as far as protecting the metal, but the barnacle growth on my rudder hardware was TERRIBLE! It was not only the lack of bottom paint on these VERY difficult to clean parts, but the electrical buzz created by the little zincs. The "juice" created from dissimilar metals is like pot & doughnuts to barnacles! The same was true of my shaft/prop and solid copper grounding plate, they loved it. Who says barnacles don't like copper?

Part of my problem was that the internally bonded underwater metal, (per ABYC), with numerous zincs, was all mounted to a hull covered with CopperPoxy (copper loaded epoxy), as a permanent bottom job. The "new" owners of the product had just switched from a copper powder to a copper flake. It now turned out to be ELECTRICALLY CONDUCTIVE! My underwater metal had now created one big battery.

The CopperPoxy failed on the bronze strut and peeled off. Also, I had to change my numerous zincs WEEKLY! This was btw, in a totally screwed up "hot" marina, with lots of wires (some bare), in the water, or in contact with the concrete floating docks, The DOCK itself would shock you. The now "hot" CopperPoxy coating REALLY attracted barnacles, and I had to scrub thick hard growth off EVERY week! Yes, I got shocked when I got out of the water!

After I left that terrible marina, I unbonded all but the prop/shaft, and the strut, which is still connected internally, and all 3 are now protected by one shaft zinc, which I would NOT omit. (Thank you Stan Honey for your help).

Then I removed the zincs from my copper plate and totally isolated the mast and my lightning ground from the boat's common AC & DC "common ground", (contrary to ABYC). I even isolated my antennae's base from the mast, as it is DC-.

Then I removed all zincs from my rudder hardware, (contrary to ABYC), and bottom painted over it, after a multi stage 2 part epoxy primer kit.

Finally, to solve the problem that neither bottom paint NOR epoxy would stick to the "proven not to be antifouling", CopperPoxy, I carefully ground it off in all of the offending areas. Then, after a new barrier coat and bottom painting, it was all perfect!

This consumed much of my first two years in the water. The time was spent spinning my wheels, including lots of experimentation and numerous haul outs, sometimes just weeks apart. Now I haul out every 5 years or so, and my single shaft zinc is changed just twice a year. The painted rudder hardware sticks fine for the most part, and a light brushing "often" while they are small, keeps the critters out.

The entire "bottom paint and underwater metal family" on Delphys have made peace, but it was not easy getting there. What I have come up with works for me, as has what Roy does. His "hardware fairings" have worked for him, and I bet he experimented with other possibilities, before he got his rig all figured out. You may have to do the same.

IF you can, use Titanium or at least 316 grade SS on your hardware. You can try leaving it bare but zinc protected (if SS), if however, that doesn't suit you, bottom paint over it. If so, use the primer kit mentioned, and strip it every couple of years, to inspect the metal. This is more true if it is 304 SS hardware.

I "personally" wouldn't build fairings over 304 SS, but if it is 316 SS, and you break/grind it off for inspection once in a while, then that is an option too. They would be easier to keep clean, and it certainly works for Roy. He has given the instructions already...

Bottom line is, experiment until YOUR bottom paint and underwater metal family is happy. If you are already there, consider yourself lucky.


Roy:
Bravo on that rounded CB trunk end wall! I have made fillets that large on my hull to keel or hull to strut joint, and on my underwings. I even put really small ones inside the CB trunk. Your huge fillets there are impressive.

For the uninitiated... you can't reach the middle of the CB trunk for this tedious multistage process, not even close... and it requires a lot of boatbuilding finesse.

Did you have the fillet stick on a handle extender? Putty knife on a stick? How?

Good work mate,
Mark

PS: The bottom two photos are what worked... taken last year.

[Roy M]

Mark, when I built the CB trunk, I started by cutting the 3" wide mahogany end pieces down the middle, and built the two halves of the trunk opened up. It made creating the fillets easy, but it required changing the beer cans regularly to achieve the perfect "beer can fillet" that we all hope to achieve. I was able to go overboard in making the trunk interior perfect, with full graphite powder surfaces. The centerboard axle gland was easy to build flush with the surface. From time to time I bolted the trunk together to confirm the alignment of everything. When ready to final assemble, I used a flexible epoxy equal to today's 3M 5200. Last, I drilled the two holes, one on each side of the two mating trunk ends for the u-fitting that holds the centerboard block. I made it JUST within reach of my arm and hand, and used a snap shackle with a lanyard to attach the block. I later added two 2X6 timbers, each on either side of the trunk, immediately beneath the mast step and above the keel timber to stiffen the trunk where the centerboard bears against it. There had been reports in other Browns of problems with the sealing between the hull plank and the centerboard trunk, and I wanted no problems whatsoever in this critical area. It has been a dream for thirty-five years now.

[Boatguy30]

Roy, just out of curiosity. How many miles would you sail you have on your SR 40. San Diego is quite a mild climate and perhaps not the best guide longevity wise.


Cheers,
Jeff

[Roy M]

Sorry, Boatguy30, I'm not entirely clear what you are asking. If it is how many miles I have sailed WILDERNESS in 35 years, that would be about 4 or 5,000 miles, principally between Point Conception and Cabo San Lucas. On my body, between Puget Sound and Cabo, and out to Hawaii, a few more. I've held my 100 ton Masters license for approaching 30 years, now, doing deliveries and whatever. And yes, San Diego is very nice. Though, I've spent a fair amount of time on the coast and in the interior of Mexico, and sailing and rowing traditional craft in Sweden. Now, I'm gearing up for adventures further afield. WILDERNESS is ideally suited to my dreams.

[Mark Johnson]

Originally Posted by Roy M

Mark, when I built the CB trunk, I started by cutting the 3" wide mahogany end pieces down the middle, and built the two halves of the trunk opened up. It made creating the fillets easy, but it required changing the beer cans regularly to achieve the perfect "beer can fillet" that we all hope to achieve. I was able to go overboard in making the trunk interior perfect, with full graphite powder surfaces. The centerboard axle gland was easy to build flush with the surface. From time to time I bolted the trunk together to confirm the alignment of everything. When ready to final assemble, I used a flexible epoxy equal to today's 3M 5200. Last, I drilled the two holes, one on each side of the two mating trunk ends for the u-fitting that holds the centerboard block. I made it JUST within reach of my arm and hand, and used a snap shackle with a lanyard to attach the block. I later added two 2X6 timbers, each on either side of the trunk, immediately beneath the mast step and above the keel timber to stiffen the trunk where the centerboard bears against it. There had been reports in other Browns of problems with the sealing between the hull plank and the centerboard trunk, and I wanted no problems whatsoever in this critical area. It has been a dream for thirty-five years now.

BRILLIANT ROY!
I suppose that after you bolted the two halves together, you glassed over the end wall seam down the middle?

These CBs and their trunks are actually not that hard to get perfect during construction, but MAN, the price one pays to fix a bad one after the fact! This is why I too went the extra mile here. Still, it took years to get the flap and aft turning block all sussed out.

I think that with any custom "CB" multihull, especially Searunners, the minikeel, rudder/skeg, CB, and CB trunk, need to be built like tanks. This is NO place to save time, money, or weight!

ABOUT MY PREVIOUSLY RELATED TURNING BLOCK STORY:
The previous 3 turning blocks that blew up, were all under water and out of reach, so this repair required a haul out... (Luckily, the block's bases had remained, so there was never a leak). To mount the new block, I had to tape it to a stick, all gooped up with the machine screws sticking out. Then I would carefully wiggle the screws into their holes, and press it home. Mariam, on the inside of the boat, would start the nuts and screw them home.
Then we'd change places, and she would use a 90 degree screwdriver, (also taped to a stick), to hold the heads of the machine screws, while I tightened the nuts from down below. All of this... within my caulk's 10 minute working time.

On my last and hopefully final STRONGER turning block replacement, (after consulting John Marples), I raised the aft block in the trunk about 2.5 ". This raised it to where I JUST could reach the block's level in the trunk, (with my finger tips). It made the install MUCH easier, with no taping it to sticks.

PRIOR TO THE CHANGE OUT:
I dove over the side, and inflated a tractor/trailer's inner tube under the stern of the boat. Then I took every fender, life jacket, boat cushion, etc, under there too. This temporarily raised the stern of Delphys about 8", with the center about 4" higher... and along with my raising the aft CB control block's location, I was able to change the block IN the water, without hauling... (unlike the previous 3).

Unfortunately, my need to dive over the side TWICE, coincided with one of our occasional 2 month long fish kills here. It was both dangerous and quite DISGUSTING! You can imagine the taste of the water, and the smell. The dead fish on the bottom were literally 6" thick!

Anyway... It worked perfectly, and these new blocks are now mounted like a tank!
The only real change from moving this block up 2.5", is that now my fully down CB position is not as fully down. I have lost about 5% of my CB's area. I can't tell a difference when sailing at all, and she balances BETTER.

John Marples, btw, ALSO had his aft turning block blow up on him, and felt that they should be very robust blocks, and mounted high enough in the trunk, to be just within reach.

The things we go through!

Mark

PS The "fish kill shot" is with 2,000 lbs of flotation nestled under the back half of the boat, to raise her up.

The new block shown, is with Delphys floating normally now. To change it out with the boat in the water, was when I raised the block's "new" mounting spot totally out of the water with extra buoyancy. It took about a week for the raising of the boat and to complete the repair. You can also see here, the very small fillets that I have where the side walls meet the end walls. Afterward, there were glass tapes put OVER these fillets as well, as an extra measure. This is, indeed, a very vulnerable spot!

[Roy M]

Mark, I just epoxied the mating faces of the centerboard dividers so that they would be encapsulated and protected. I can't remember the name of the flexible goop I used, but it was suggested in the building manual. It was a two-part, very sticky material, and it did the job. I just cleaned the excess off with a chisel on a broomstick. I went with the u-fitting because I didn't trust the cheek blocks, and I wanted to make that attachment bomb proof. I did blow up a smaller block once, before going with the fuses. It was pretty dramatic, but didn't cause any problems with the snap shackle or the u-fitting. A very big douche of water came up the trunk while I was straddling it.