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Old 10-11-2009, 00:46   #16
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I don't understand why you are constraining your search by boat length...wouldn't it make more sense to search by the interior space you need? for example Outremer, Atlantic, etc are known to not try to pack too much living space on short hulls, thus not compromising performance. The Atlantic 48 is on my list of dream boats, but I'd suspect it has similar and maybe less interior room than a Lagoon 420, but is much much faster. You might also think about the Maine Cat 41, I really like the open bridge deck concept.
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Old 10-11-2009, 03:50   #17
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Thought about a Lightwave 45?
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Old 10-11-2009, 07:20   #18
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Beautiful pics. Looks like you had a great time there.
Why not stick with the boat you have ? More space ?
Yeah, I can see where a cat is attractive.
But I'll stick to the monohull.

Also I apologize... didn't see that it was on the multihull forum...
My bad.
But good luck on your search.
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Old 10-11-2009, 10:47   #19
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Thought about a Lightwave 45?
The Lightwave 45 is very high on my list. Pity about the AUD/USD exchange rate now though, it's really expensive!! I'll be visiting my folks in Brisbane in January so I'm planning on stopping by the LW factory to talk to the manufacturers and get a look at one up close. I'll report back on this board and post pics.
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Old 10-11-2009, 11:14   #20
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We have found that an adaptable helm station is the one thing that makes a rough crossing significantly better. Ours in in the form of wrap around vinyl screens. When it is nice out they are rolled up out of the way and when it gets rough they come down. We have been in seas that had waves clearing the bimini and we were 99% dry, makes a huge psychological difference for me to be dry.

It also makes using the BBQ on breezy days much easier.

I would not consider a cat with exposed helm(s) for a long term cruiser, for racing or just fast day trips sure. If I got a crew job on a maxi cat/tri I'd deal with it
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Old 10-11-2009, 11:47   #21
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Bobfnby, try to stay positive man! I agree with you that Cats are not as sleek looking, but for a comparable cost we got a catamaran and loved it! In fact, our Lagoon 380 had the same interior space and cruising speed as a 45 or 50 foot monohull, so when I compare costs that way I figure it is pretty even (and you don't use marinas very often if you are blue-water cruising). And my wife DID do yoga almost every day on our bow and having that room was important to her (see picture). And speaking from experience, in over 14,000 miles of off-shore sailing I was always happy to have that big, wide bow area to go forward on rather than a small, narrow one that I could fall off of more easily. And with proper gear like jacklines and harnesses, it shouldn't really matter.

To each his own, but for me, bluewater cruising is much nicer, more comfortable, faster and similarly priced on a catamaran...[/QUOTE]

Hi,you say that the laggon 38 have the same cruising speed that a 40 o 50 monohull, not true, what kind of mono, light, racer , heavy cruiser??
The 38 is a slow cata, sailing upwind have a very poor perfomance, in a reach is ok, downwind is fast.
And for interior space versus mono, wrong again! the lagoon 38 have a nice open interior and exterior, good for walking and jumping, but very limited storage area , and if i remember small diesel tanks, 30 gallons??
I think the future catamaran market is going to be better and better, better quality construction, and i hope better price. cheers.
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Old 10-11-2009, 13:10   #22
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I really like the Catana's, but the 1980's to early 90's Catanas the true Crowther designs. I've heard the newer Catana's, late 90's on have had quite a few structual issues and bad customer service. Just what I've heard from some Catana owners. If I had the money I would go for a Outremer or Freydis, I believe top quality performance cruisers.
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Old 10-11-2009, 13:50   #23
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FYI, we have been unimpressed with production quality of the FP, Seawind, Leopard and others, thus the omission. Outreamer is another good thought, but living conditions seemed sparce and do not fit the blend we are looking for. We also like the Dolphin Cats, which we forgot to include. Thoughts?
I am surprised that a Lagoon owner would find the R&C boats and the seawinds to not be of at least as good quality as the lagoon range. I tend to agree on the FPs.

Where did you find the issues with the R&C and Seawind range
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Old 10-11-2009, 15:29   #24
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Mark424: I have to agree with you. I LOVE the Atlantic 48, but it is way out of my price range. In fact, the Antares 44i and the Privilege 44 (and outreamer) are probably not even close to affordable, but I threw them in there for comparison purposes given their build quality image. However, WOW, do I love the Atlantic 48. I had the opportunity to spend a lot of time on this boat (click here to see "Zen"), and truly believe that this is the best cruising cat I have ever seen. The interior space wasn't all that small and the construction looked very rigid with one mold throughout the boat that includes the bulkheads as an integrated design. There was very little wood to creak and weigh it down. I even liked the unique helm station design and there was plenty of room in the cockpit, but this would only be possible in something as large as a 48. Any comparable 48/50 footer would be massive inside. If I win the lottery I will be calling Chris White...

Fareweather: I have to disagree with you. During a passage we always left the helm station during rainy weather and let the auto pilot do the dirty work. From inside at the nav table I had duplicate instruments, could control the autohelm with a remote and could see 380 degrees around the boat with the Lagoon window design. Only in extreme conditions when the auto pilot was not keeping up did I need to sit at the helm () or when adjusting lines. So the exposed helm is debatable for me. On the positive side you have more room in the cockpit for entertaining, good sail trim view and good docking view. On the negative side you are exposed to the elements (when not inside) and you get close to the rail in the open ocean, where it is dangerous to leave the cockpit. Overall I guess I prefer that design, but that's my personal view, I suppose...

Neilpride: As a open ocean cruiser on the traditional circ route, 90% of our sailing is downwind and we regularly smoke comparably sized monohulls. In fact, we have been cruising for months with the following larger monohulls (Halberg Rassy 46, Catalina 44, Moody 46, Stephens 45), and have found our speed almost identical, arriving in port within minutes of one another despite days of sailing. Regarding interior space, our L380 has more than the boats listed above, although ours is an Owner's Version. Except for freezer space, our buddy boats have all been impressed with the Cat design and two are now looking to switch! I'm trying not to be biased here, but cats really are faster and have more space, which makes them nice cruisers. Our twin 29hp engines are more than adequate for our smaller cat, we can hit 8 knots and cruise with one engine at 2,200 rpm at 6 knots. The fuel tanks ARE small, but we carry jerry cans on the rear steps and refuel when needed (admitably a pain). I hope you are right and that the designs just get better and better...

Factor: With Lagoon, Leopard, FP and Seawind I have not been impressed with the longevity that these boats display. I met the owner of this FP (click here and I won't need to say more) and the owners of this Seawind (click here for Seawind). Over time they seem to show their age, weaken and fall apart, which makes me wonder if they deserve to be out in the open ocean in the first place. We like our Lagoon and have included the 420 in our thoughts, but we wonder if there is an even sturdier, more bullet proof design out there that we can afford as we move up in size to our next boat. Thus the reason for the forum topic...

SMJ: Hmmmm....
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Old 10-11-2009, 15:51   #25
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3Eagles, have you had a chance to go onboard all the boats you have listed as options?
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Old 10-11-2009, 17:46   #26
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3Eagles great video. Do you have a parachute anchor? I've heard that it's essential equipment on a catamaran for seas like that. We're ordering ours before we go in 3 months. We own a Catana 431 and in about a year I'll have some advise about bluewater cruising on it. For now all I can say is that it's been fantastic for our family of 4 coastal cruising on the weekends.
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Old 10-11-2009, 17:55   #27
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With Lagoon, Leopard, FP and Seawind I have not been impressed with the longevity that these boats display. I met the owner of this FP (click here and I won't need to say more)
I don't understand your point about the FP Venezia. It was hit by a whale, rudder drove through the hull, saildrive drove through the hull, T-boned by a freighter and was still floating high and dry (a bit low in the back with flooded compartments). I say that is great engineering and build quality. I don't think you will find a catamaran with saildrives and spade rudders that would not have had those components driven through the hull in the same situation. You will find many that would not be floating high and dry afterwards.

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Old 10-11-2009, 18:46   #28
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3Eagles - ignmore my previous post. Just realized this is Seth. Duh. I didn't read the s/v honeymoon.

Regarding the Antares, there is a galley up version. It is a configuration option. I prefer the galley down in the Antares IMWO (In My Wife's Opinion).
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Old 10-11-2009, 21:27   #29
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Nice video, but its leaving me a bit confused--it mentions the passage from Curacao to the San Blas as taking 5 days, hitting speeds over 15 knots, and a best day's run of over 190 miles. The trip is 605 miles on my chart, which means a 121 mile per day average for a 5 day passage. With all that wind and current from behind, I would be planning for arrival in well under 4 days....
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Old 11-11-2009, 00:49   #30
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Donradcliffe: It was four nights and we went into a fifth day, so don't my comment too literal. Also, we had light winds the first two days and then sailed dead down wind during the storm, so it was not a consistent or straight line passage. I can give you waypoints if you like.

ReadyToGoSoon: We do have a parachute anchor, but this was not the place to use one. Since the coast of Columbia is known for these types of conditions (as the sea floor elevates and the current gets trapped), the last thing you want to do is stay there. You need to sail through it, so a chute would be the wrong thing to deploy. However, we really should have had a way to slow down the surfing, so a series drogue was needed. Unfortunately we did not have one and lines overboard did nothing to slow us up. We got lucky in this case, but I would advise all Cat owner's to get a drogue first - and get a chute second as a last resort. And good luck on your trip!!!

Mdsilvers: Sorry, your name isn't listed. Have we met?! Thanks for joining our discussion.

Colemj: Good point on the FP. The FP did okay and did not sink, although the owner told me that he had doubts about his boat prior to the collision. But yes, hitting the whale was a chance encounter and has nothing to do with build. Although I just looked at the FP Venezia next to me in the marina and I am still unimpressed. The doors look like they were purchased at home depot for a house, but fitted on a boat instead. The stainless is leaching rust and even the dingy hoists look dinky compared to my 38. And the nonskid is not aging well and looks a mess. These are little things, but they make me concerned about the greater design and materials used by FP. Just an opinion...
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