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Old 30-09-2016, 09:51   #1
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Tesla Powerwall- useful?

Would this be a useful product in marine environment? Couple of them in series? Advantages? Disadvantages? They state for home use so would this make sense for liveaboard cruiser?

I'm in no way an electrical expert. I'm simply putting out to those that are for healthy debate/analysis. :-)



Specs


Technology
Wall mounted, rechargeable lithium ion battery with liquid thermal control.
Model
6.4 kWh
For daily cycle applications
Warranty
Ten years
Efficiency
92.5% round-trip DC efficiency
Power
3.3 kW
Depth of Discharge
100%
Voltage
350 450 volts
Current
9.5 amperes
Compatibility
Single phase and three phase utility grid compatible.
Operating Temperature
-4F to 122F / -20C to 50C
Enclosure
Rated for indoor and outdoor installation.
Installation
Requires installation by a trained electrician. DC-AC inverter not included.
Weight
214 lbs / 97 kg
Dimensions
51.3 x 34 x 7.2
1302 mm x 862 mm x 183 mm
Certification
UL 9540, UL 1642, UL 1973
AC156 seismic certification
IEEE 693- 2005 seismic certification
FCC Part 15 Class B
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Old 30-09-2016, 09:55   #2
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Re: Tesla Powerwall- useful?

Once Tesla's factroy in Nevada goes online full production, lithium cell capacity will increase by quite a bit - the form factor is designed for home use, but there's no reason why Tesla or a customer of Tesla can't bulk purchase cells and repackage for marine applications.
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Old 30-09-2016, 13:31   #3
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Re: Tesla Powerwall- useful?

If you can use 350-450 volts DC....
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Old 30-09-2016, 17:37   #4
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Re: Tesla Powerwall- useful?

I checked into it, and it is not marinated design or materials, so that's a safety issue. Tesla have no plans for one either. Which is a pity.


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Old 30-09-2016, 17:39   #5
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Re: Tesla Powerwall- useful?

Marinised/marinized,.....not marinated.


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Old 30-09-2016, 19:38   #6
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Re: Tesla Powerwall- useful?

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Originally Posted by BigBeakie View Post
I checked into it, and it is not marinated design or materials, so that's a safety issue. Tesla have no plans for one either. Which is a pity.


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What aspect of the design or materials is the issue?

The specifications state "indoor or outdoor installation", so inside a boat may be kinder than outside a house?


I couldn't find any "marine lithium battery" equipment available recently. Most, or all of the LiFePO4 battery setups that are being installed in boats are composed of products that were designed for the electric car or home market. Some require additional protection for a marine installation eg. battery management system circuit boards being housed in a waterproof box.

Is there something about the Tesla product that is more vulnerable to a marine application?

I'm sure Tesla have chosen the high DC voltages for good reason, and the safety issue must have been considered. It may be more efficient to run an AC inverter using the high voltage. Boat DC circuits would require a stepdown transformer, of course.
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Old 30-09-2016, 20:38   #7
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Re: Tesla Powerwall- useful?

Is there something that I am missing. Does anybody make economic sense out of paying $3,000 for a device to store $1 worth of electricity.

LION batteries are a different beast from some of the other Li technologies often discussed. I think this unit is water cooled, that ought to raise some caution.

Look up Navy Seals and ASDS for "when LION behaves badly"
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Old 30-09-2016, 22:07   #8
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Re: Tesla Powerwall- useful?

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economic sense
Economic sense?

This is a boating forum.
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Old 01-10-2016, 05:23   #9
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Re: Tesla Powerwall- useful?

Good Point .
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Old 01-10-2016, 13:29   #10
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Re: Tesla Powerwall- useful?

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I checked into it, and it is not marinated

What would you suggest? Soy sauce and wasabi?
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Old 01-10-2016, 15:48   #11
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Re: Tesla Powerwall- useful?

Not a fan of wasabi, lithium batteries should be kept as cool as possible. You should know that.


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Old 01-10-2016, 15:58   #12
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Re: Tesla Powerwall- useful?

What are you trying to accomplish?

It's a lot of wall space for most boats for not a lot of KWH at a high cost, so you need a purpose for selecting it over traditional options.
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Old 01-10-2016, 23:30   #13
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Re: Tesla Powerwall- useful?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Frankly View Post
Is there something that I am missing. Does anybody make economic sense out of paying $3,000 for a device to store $1 worth of electricity.

LION batteries are a different beast from some of the other Li technologies often discussed. I think this unit is water cooled, that ought to raise some caution.

Look up Navy Seals and ASDS for "when LION behaves badly"
Yep, those expensive batteries store a quantity of electricity that could be purchased very cheaply on land. Expensive watermakers make water that could be sourced on land for free. Its about being on a boat, away from land.

It's just that there's nowhere to plug in my boat at the moment to get that $1 worth of electricity. Now, if my electricity shore lead was another 25 miles longer, I could use that cheap electricity and not worry about expensive batteries.

Not sure what you mean by "LION" and "other Li technologies often discussed ". You've completely lost me when discussing seals and lions. It did however, take me a while to catch on to the joke about marinating batteries.

I believe that the Tesla wall utilises LiFePO4 technology. Are you aware of the difference between this and the more dangerous Lithium Cobalt ion batteries?

If you have a spare few days and wish to understand the safety, advantages and correct installation of Lithium Iron Phosphate batteries, on BOATS, please read this thread:

http://www.cruisersforum.com/forums/...nks-65069.html
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Old 02-10-2016, 04:49   #14
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Re: Tesla Powerwall- useful?

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Marinised/marinized,.....not marinated.


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Old 02-10-2016, 05:47   #15
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Re: Tesla Powerwall- useful?

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I believe that the Tesla wall utilises LiFePO4 technology. Are you aware of the difference between this and the more dangerous Lithium Cobalt ion batteries?
The Tesla Powerwall reportedly uses lithium nickel manganese cobalt oxide (NMC) chemistry. Maybe not as stable as LiFePO4, and thus the Powewall includes internal cooling capability.

Don't Believe Elon Musk on the Powerwall -- The Motley Fool
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