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Old 04-04-2014, 23:07   #1
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Suggested makes and models

I am five years out from retiring and collecting my pension. It is my current plan to sell my home and move aboard to start cruising full time. My anticipated cruising grounds include but not limited to the east coast of USA/Canada, Bahamas and Caribbean, Central/ South America, West coast of North America up to Alaska, Europe and the Med, and the South Pacific and Australia. So it has to be trans Atlantic and trans Pacific capable. I have narrowed my search down to 3 types of boats. Catamaran, Pilothouse mono hull, and center cockpit monohull. The primary crew will be me and my girlfriend with occasional visitors for a week or 2. Therefore I would like to have at least 2 staterooms, with a relatively (for a boat) larger master. I have budgeted $130,000 US for the purchase and initial outfitting/repair of a boat. This amount might increase to around $150,000US closer to retirement. After my retirement I will have a guaranteed monthly net income of at least $2,500US. I consider my self mechanically inclined and have extensive experience, 30+ years, working on boats. However I am not interested in the upkeep of a wood boat.

From reading these threads it seems that from a financial stand point I should be able to live and cruise comfortably. I am not looking for a rehash of the mono vs. multi argument (there plenty of that on here). What I am looking for is make/model recommendations to look at and consider. Any help would be appreciated. If you have any question feel free to post them. Also I will be posting this on the mono hull section too. Thanks in advance. Lyman Man
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Old 04-04-2014, 23:14   #2
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Re: Suggested makes and models

What have you liked or not liked about the boats that you and your girl friend have chartered or been a guest/crew aboard? What sort of expectations do you have for comfort vs. roughing it and how do these compare to your current life style?
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Old 05-04-2014, 02:36   #3
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Re: Suggested makes and models

Anybody who makes a specific recommendation based on the criteria that you've provided is doing you a disservice.

You've asked the equivalent of: "I have $40,000. I want to drive all over North America. What kind of car should I buy?" Though you listed a few criteria, they don't really rule out many boats in any meaningful way other than size.

A lot will depend on your own preferences. There are many, MANY boats that meet your criteria. People could suggest what they like, but it might lead to you overlooking the one that is perfect for YOU.

Some things to consider would be your current level of sailing experience, and where you intend to sail in the next 5 years. It may turn out that after that, you know a lot more about what you really want in a cruising boat. 5 years is a long time to own the wrong kind of boat, so you should figure out if you want a boat so you can get some experience in the mean time.

Everybody starts out wanting a boat that will go anywhere, and do anything, but there are tradeoffs in boat buying decisions. The tradeoffs that someone else would make will likely be different than yours. Use the 80/20 rule. What will you be doing MOST of the time? What will you be doing the FIRST two years you own the boat?

Why not charter a monohull in the size you like and try it out? Do the same with a catamaran and a pilothouse. Take a look at Yachtworld and other sailboat sale sites for boats in your price range to get an idea of what's out there. Walk some docks.
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Old 05-04-2014, 10:18   #4
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Re: Suggested makes and models

Mostly older boats like Prouts, Catalacs, and Solaris. You may be able to find a PDQ 36 for that. Many more one offs and customs tho......
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Old 05-04-2014, 14:06   #5
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Re: Suggested makes and models

Hi Lyman Man!

Welcome to the forum! You will find lots of great help here. The folks are sooo nice, and incredibly knowledgeable.

You and I are in the same boat.. (pun intended.. ) My husband and I are about 6 years out to retirement, and we have very similar plans. We want to be full time live-aboard cruisers. We aren't quite as ambitius as you.. we are mainly going to focus on the Carribean. If we get really good at sailing, and feel confidant.. then it's always been a dream of mine to go to the Gallapagos.. that will be a stretch for us.. but not unattainable, by any means.

We are also looking at boats. Right now, we are looking at what is new on the market, as these will be the boats we most likely will be purchasing from used, 6 years down the line. Our biggest shock has come from the price tags. When we first started thinking about this lifestyle.. we didn't even know that Catamarans existed. So.. I was shopping for used monohull sailboats. There are a LOT of great monohulls out there.. reasonably cheap. We saw some that we would consider between $50,000 and $120,00. Then we discovered catamarans and completely changed our focus. With that.. comes the sticker shock!

Being that we are in the same boat.. I would suggest doing what we have done, which is "go shopping". There are tons of websites out there that list used catamarans and monohulls. Many of them allow you to search by price. So.. go out and look and see what is out there.

I haven't looked at Monohulls for a while.. but the catamarans in your price range will be in pretty rough shape. That does NOT mean they aren't good boats. Just a lot of work.. ergo.. $$$$$$

I know you have said you have a lot of time working on boats. I'm jealous. You are already well ahead of the game. You can do almost ALL of the labor yourself. But, do not under-estimate the cost of "goods".

You may want to talk to Brad.. (Southern Star). He bought a cat pretty close to your price range, and is in the process of getting it seaworthy, and rigged/outfitted the way he wants it. He does most everything himself, and he does GOREGOUS work (based on photos of his mono hull he shared with me). I bet he will pop in here. He may be able to give you some good hard numbers as to what is really involved when it comes to getting a "fixer upper" into tip top shape.

I know I haven't given you exactly what you were looking for.. which was model numbers. But, my intent was to get you window shopping. Look and see what is in your price range.. Talk to some folks who have bought a "fixer upper". after a while you will start to see a trend of what you like and can manage in that price range. THEN you can start focusing on THOSE boats. But, like I said.. be prepared for sticker shock...
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Old 05-04-2014, 14:24   #6
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Re: Suggested makes and models

I think with your budget you should go with one of the monos. Get something that will take a beating with confidence (up the west coast etc) and has a good size motor rather than marginal in HP. Pilot house for your aspirations is a good idea.
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Old 05-04-2014, 17:26   #7
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Re: Suggested makes and models

Hi im a newbie here as well and im looking to buy a boat as well and i have started to make a list on what i wanted and needed and made a budget for it .. which im aware is higher than the budget you are looking but perhaps you can use some of the things i have done research off cant say if it helps you

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Old 05-04-2014, 20:09   #8
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Re: Suggested makes and models

Thanks to all who have replied so far.

RGSCPAT, unfortunately the aren't many cats up here on the Great Lakes so I haven't had a chance to walk through many. The flatter sailing angle and decreased rolling are positives, as is the amount of room in the salon and cockpit. Draw backs are the smaller cabins down in the hulls and apparently higher buy in cost. Advantages for the center cockpit is the usually larger master aft cabin, the security of a central cockpit, seakeeping of a single hull, a larger selection to shop from, and it seems the a quality boat can be had for a lower price. Draw backs are more heeling and rolling, sometimes the cabins can feel like a cave, and sometimes unprotected helms. Pilothouses have the sometimes benefit of a aft cabin and also some seem to be set up with setees or dinettes in the house giving a more light and open feeling, an all weather helm position, and the other benefits of a mono hull. Their draw backs seem to be again less of a selection, higher prices, and more heeling and rolling than a cat. I am looking for something more towards comfort than roughing it. Gallery with stove, hot and cold running water (additional sea water pump would be a pluse), refrigeration, basic entertainment, at least 1 head with shower. Nothing extravagant. My current lifestyle is that I live with Miguel's friend, 2 kids, and one cat in a 1300sqr foot house on 2 acres in the count ry. The kids and critters will be moved on in 5 years. My current boat is 28ft and 31 years old and paid cash. I drive an 11 year old jeep. I do most of the work on my boat.

Sailing, you're a couple of steps ahead of me. I am asking for a specific recommendations from people, but not to eliminate boats from consideration. I am looking more for boats that have worked for others so that I can look at those and see if they would work for me. I know what works for you might not work for me, but then again it might and I might over look one if you or anybody else didn't mention it. I made my criteria vague so that it could be inclusive and folks could offer suggestions that might not be exactly what I'm thinking of. Then after reviewing suggestions and other research start narrowing the list down. My next 5 years will be spent cruising on my powerboat as my job doesn't allow enough time away at one time to cruise in a sailboat. My sailing experience has been on Lasers, Hobie's and a 41 Morgan. Most of my boating has been done on a large variety of powerboat. A formal sailing school is in my plans as are the charters you suggested. My plan for the first 2 years will most likely be the easy coast, Bahamas, and Caribbean.

Scarlet, The cats definitely come at a premium no doubt. I set the $130k limit to allow for a substantial reserve for those little idiolect things that always pop up. The buy in cost is why I'm looking at both mono and multi hulls. No use dropping god coin on a very rough cat when it could buy a good shape mono. Just one of those trade offs Sailing mentioned above.

Sand crab, thanks for the suggestions.

Cheechako, thanks for the advice there is dedicatedly a better selection in monos. Feel free to suggest any you think might be good to consider.

Everybody thanks for the advice and info and feel free to keep it coming.

Lyman
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Old 05-04-2014, 20:45   #9
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Re: Suggested makes and models

Start with this ubiqiotous list (bottom of page). Anything catch your eye?

Mahina Expedition - Selecting A Boat for Offshore Cruising

Then look @ the beneteaus and jeanneus.
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Old 05-04-2014, 23:34   #10
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Re: Suggested makes and models

Still generic in response and let folks know if any of this appeals to you... or is already stuff you've done.

Now we have much more info about your situation, that should help with the quality and focus of the advice. One thought would be finding lots of ways to get on boats, even if only for very short periods, just to start honing in on likes and dislikes and the feel of different kinds of cruising sailboats.

With luck, you could do the occasional charter, either on the Great Lakes or a winter escape to sw Florida, the Caribbean, etc... down south might be the place to get a cat experience. Flotilla cruises are one option for those with limited sailing or cat sailing experience, or another might be hiring a captain for a day or two.

Back closer to home, options might include finding a sailing co-op/sailing club, community sailing association that happens to have larger boats as well as small, or some sort of commercial sailing club that still gets you a good deal on sailing time; some of these bundle their memberships with basic sailing lessons or beyond.

There's also the fine art of dock walking, especially on regatta days at clubs and marinas, getting onto crew lists, helping with race committee, etc.. Even if you don't have the least interest whatsoever in sailboat racing, that would be time on the water, and networking with boat owners. And sometimes clubs have cruising boat owners who'd be happy to take people out for sails; just hanging around sailors and being a good listener (and, on board, follower of directions) might give you some nice opportunities and experiences. And even just looking at boats for sale might develop your ability to zero in on good and bad stuff more quickly.

Even if boat shows don't have a lot of the kinds of boats you might be interested in, you might find some nice, knowledgeable cruisers in various corners, and there might well be useful seminars about cruising and cruising life. Or, worst-case, you might get occasional practice in fine-tuning the BS meter.

And once you have more sailing experience, and as you get closer to your cruising time, maybe your schedule will free up a bit and you might be able to get in on crewing for people on cruises, helping with shorter-term yacht deliveries, etc.

All this time-on-the-water/living with boats stuff is sort of a form of risk management; reducing the chance of getting something you won't like so much versus improving the chance you'll get a boat that really fits you and what you want to do. And, who knows, maybe with a lot of this networking stuff, the right boat might even seem to find you.

(And as always, free opinions may be worth more or less than you paid for them, and YSMMV -- your sea miles may vary.)
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Old 06-04-2014, 00:20   #11
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Re: Suggested makes and models

Quote:
Originally Posted by Lyman man View Post
I am five years out from retiring and collecting my pension. It is my current plan to sell my home and move aboard to start cruising full time. My anticipated cruising grounds include but not limited to the east coast of USA/Canada, Bahamas and Caribbean, Central/ South America, West coast of North America up to Alaska, Europe and the Med, and the South Pacific and Australia. So it has to be trans Atlantic and trans Pacific capable. I have narrowed my search down to 3 types of boats. Catamaran, Pilothouse mono hull, and center cockpit monohull. The primary crew will be me and my girlfriend with occasional visitors for a week or 2. Therefore I would like to have at least 2 staterooms, with a relatively (for a boat) larger master. I have budgeted $130,000 US for the purchase and initial outfitting/repair of a boat. This amount might increase to around $150,000US closer to retirement. After my retirement I will have a guaranteed monthly net income of at least $2,500US. I consider my self mechanically inclined and have extensive experience, 30+ years, working on boats. However I am not interested in the upkeep of a wood boat.

From reading these threads it seems that from a financial stand point I should be able to live and cruise comfortably. I am not looking for a rehash of the mono vs. multi argument (there plenty of that on here). What I am looking for is make/model recommendations to look at and consider. Any help would be appreciated. If you have any question feel free to post them. Also I will be posting this on the mono hull section too. Thanks in advance. Lyman Man
You will have to buy a boat based on your expectations, not mine or others on this forum. I suggest you do some chartering on mono hulls and cats to determine which you like. I have an older Columbia C-45 which I like and would trust to go anywhere, some people will tell you my boat should be a coastal cruiser. Jeanneau and Beneteau boats sail all over the world but yet some will tell you to stay away from them. Personally I had a 92 Jeanneau Sun Odyssey I would have sailed anywhere and felt safe in it.

I'd recommend chartering several different models to determine what you like and do not like, wants versus needs, and then move forward on a decision. It can take year of looking to find the boat you think fits your needs. I would also recommend making your purchase at least a year prior to your retirement to give you time to become acquainted with the boat and it unique handling. I hope this helps a little.
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