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Old 11-05-2008, 22:17   #31
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Originally Posted by Therapy View Post
That is the conclusion I have come to........and am not sure they slow the boat down or make it less seakindly.

Still learning.
Lighter is better for speed!!

As to seakindly, it's simply that with nets you don't get as much wave slap at the front of the boat. Shorter bridgedeck = less wave slap. But to be honest, you get wave slap with every multi. I think the bridgedeck clearance and a nice clean profile near the waterline is of equal importance.
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Old 12-05-2008, 08:06   #32
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Lighter is better for speed!!

As to seakindly, it's simply that with nets you don't get as much wave slap at the front of the boat. Shorter bridgedeck = less wave slap. But to be honest, you get wave slap with every multi. I think the bridgedeck clearance and a nice clean profile near the waterline is of equal importance.
I agree it is all a compromise.

I think a full water tank weighs a lot more but it is not as far forward either.

Some how I like the feel of a flat (and level on a cat) solid deck. The different level from tramp to beam to deck I don't like. feels "unstable" to me even though I have good balance. Maybe from the mono hull sailing I have done?

Plus I have this (unjustified?) fear (nightmare) of going forward in rough conditions (stresses everybody and thing) and falling through a failed tramp. Unjustified I know, but emotions are emotions. The Manta is one of my favorite. It is a compromise with small tramps and more "deck". BroadBlue is awesome too. 1 and 2 - back and forth for me.

Dreaming along gathering information.
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Old 13-05-2008, 13:11   #33
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Red face Tramps

"Plus I have this (unjustified?) fear (nightmare) of going forward in rough conditions (stresses everybody and thing) and falling through a failed tramp. Unjustified I know, but emotions are emotions. "

A failed tramp has killed and injured people before. Your best bet in a tramp is a tramp made out of 3 layers of seat belt material, with the outer belts in black, sewn with teflon thread. UV eats tramps, that's why both thick and black material.
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Old 13-05-2008, 13:45   #34
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Another good thing about the tramps. I don't have a/c, so every once in a while when the air is very still. The tramps will get a wee bit of a breeze, and it's a great place to sleep under the stars!!!!!!!
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Old 13-05-2008, 15:19   #35
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I don't think major designer has designed a larger catamaran (36+ ft) in the last 10 years that has a solid foredeck. I'd consider privilege not really a solid foredeck, kind of a hybrid. I think the designers have all moved away from it. Smaller boats it makes sense as they need every sq inch. Dean still sells mostly solid foredecks, but his design is from the early 90s. As to solid decks giving more bouyancy, bouyancy only occurs when they are under water and you really don't want that. As many of the new catamaran owners can attest, netted bows have absolutely no problem lifting up to go over waves.
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Old 13-05-2008, 19:13   #36
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Lighter is better for speed!!

As to seakindly, it's simply that with nets you don't get as much wave slap at the front of the boat. Shorter bridgedeck = less wave slap. But to be honest, you get wave slap with every multi. I think the bridgedeck clearance and a nice clean profile near the waterline is of equal importance.
With a solid foredeck, I've never experienced slapping forward. When it occurs the slap appears to come from a point about 1/2 way down my LWL. My foredeck clearance is about a meter, maybe a little more above the water. I see to remember that bouyancy also plays an important part in how fast bows rise. I'm very buoyant forward due to a very small foredeck and almost no other weight foreward to speak of.
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Old 14-05-2008, 02:39   #37
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"Plus I have this (unjustified?) fear (nightmare) of going forward in rough conditions (stresses everybody and thing) and falling through a failed tramp. Unjustified I know, but emotions are emotions. "

A failed tramp has killed and injured people before. Your best bet in a tramp is a tramp made out of 3 layers of seat belt material, with the outer belts in black, sewn with teflon thread. UV eats tramps, that's why both thick and black material.
We only use Dyneema trampoline webbing that is 100 % UV stable and warranteed for 8 years , I have used it well over 80000 nm and still like new
the weight is almost neglect able , only 330 grams per squire meter and 80 % open , the only way to go.

Greetings

Gideon
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Old 14-05-2008, 03:30   #38
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We only use Dyneema trampoline webbing that is 100 % UV stable and warranteed for 8 years , I have used it well over 80000 nm and still like new
the weight is almost neglect able , only 330 grams per squire meter and 80 % open , the only way to go.

Greetings

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What is the mesh size of your material.
Is it comfortable to sit on.

Mike
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Old 14-05-2008, 08:59   #39
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Dyneema

Hi, Gideon

Good stuff, that Dyneema, but probably not strong enough to carry 500 kilos per square meter, 8 hours a day, every day, under the blazing tropical sun. That's my requirement.
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Old 14-05-2008, 19:24   #40
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Big Cat - even in a boat intended for charters, why would you need to carry 5oo kilos per meter sq. - I mean, that is an awful lot of fat people in a space that would be pretty small for them to occupy.

Brad
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Old 14-05-2008, 20:03   #41
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Safety first!

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Big Cat - even in a boat intended for charters, why would you need to carry 5oo kilos per meter sq. - I mean, that is an awful lot of fat people in a space that would be pretty small for them to occupy.

Brad
Safety margin-it wouldn't normally happen, but it might happen, so design for it. Read: Southwinds - December 2000
for some choice thoughts on trampolines.
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Old 19-05-2008, 14:16   #42
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So, who can I contact to purchase less than 100 square feet of Dyneema netting? I worked on a Catana 431 last week and found the netting adequate for my needs, and the installation is quite simple. But I need to find a supplier that will sell me straight netting, nothing else.
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Old 19-05-2008, 14:53   #43
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The difference matters most in extremis. The concern is what the boat will do after running down a steep following wave and burying the bow in the back of the next one.
This is the more accepted cause of the loss of the Edmund Fitzgerald. The load of water that piles up on the bow could be back-breaking.

You can find stories on the web of solid foredecks burying so deep that stuff (and people) FALL in the forward ends. There was one account of a Gemini going north on the West Coast of Florida in a tropical storm. The first hand account claimed the boat boat buried to something like 35 degrees nose down, but came back up eventually, with shredded sails.
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Old 19-05-2008, 21:13   #44
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There was one account of a Gemini going north on the West Coast of Florida in a tropical storm. The first hand account claimed the boat boat buried to something like 35 degrees nose down, but came back up eventually, with shredded sails.
I would be interested in the details of that one.
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Old 20-05-2008, 00:10   #45
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So, who can I contact to purchase less than 100 square feet of Dyneema netting? I worked on a Catana 431 last week and found the netting adequate for my needs, and the installation is quite simple. But I need to find a supplier that will sell me straight netting, nothing else.
Hallo Roy

we produce and sell dyneema netting in any squire size you want , we have 2 mesh sizes 10 mm and 17 mm in stock and we are waiting for 25 mm to be made.
you can reach us on
info@africancats.com

Greetings
Gideon
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