Small Catamarans

[smj]

We owned one of these for about 9 years. http://www.sailboatlistings.com/view/54675 Great boats if you can find one in good shape.


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[Davy J]

I'll throw in my 2 cents........ As an owner of a Gemini 105Mc I think your budget is way too low, at least for the 105Mc model. My purchase price was considerably more than your budget, and I immediately spent about another $10,000 in upgrades before I even took it on a weekend cruise.

My guess is that I will spend at least another $10,000 before I would consider her ready for extended cruising. YMMV.

[Boatguy30]

Depending on you time frame and skill level; it is still quite viable to build your own cat. There are a few designs that are largely superior to any production cats in the mid 30' range.

[barnakiel]

Investigate toys like Edel Cats, Benneteau, Sunstar Solaris, etc.

Plenty of small cats around. We met people in the West Indies who sailed in from Europe on an Iroquis or Heavenly Twins (or something looking alike).

b.

[brandonv]

Originally Posted by Dulcesuenos

What do you mean by offshore ,12 miles or several hundred? Where are you cruising to? Ec 30 tough as nails and a great bargain. Prout snowgoose 37or Event 34., Dean 36, solaris 36, you can find a pdq 32 for 80 or less, we liked the Ami renaissance 320 better than the pdq. we find rougher choppier water near shore that effects small cats more than we did offshore. We had a Ec30 they are well laid out, cheap to maintain, easy to beach, sail well, they have a central nacelle like a prout, that "thumps" more often, but it breaks up wave energy so its not so violent. The berths are near the under bridgedeck so if your a light sleeper it might be noisey. Both Ami and Ec30 were great florida, bahamas boat and most bang for the buck in a cat. I loved our Ami and was happy living aboard it but the wife wanted bigger. Gems are much noisier except the older models, theres a great price on an older gemini in key west.

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I like the Ami renaissance 320 but looks like they might be hard to find.

[brandonv]

Originally Posted by Davy J

I'll throw in my 2 cents........ As an owner of a Gemini 105Mc I think your budget is way too low, at least for the 105Mc model. My purchase price was considerably more than your budget, and I immediately spent about another $10,000 in upgrades before I even took it on a weekend cruise.

My guess is that I will spend at least another $10,000 before I would consider her ready for extended cruising. YMMV.

There's a few 105mc listed for $79,000 right now but that wont leave me much for upgrades. Thanks

[tomfl]

As a couple of folks have noted some common circumnavigation routes are mostly downwind. I have posted many times the biggest mistake many folks make in selecting a boat is buying one for what they think they will do on a boat, not what they will actually do.

The boat needed to circumnavigate around the three great capes would be much different than a boat going through the two canals most commercial traffic uses. The direction of circumnavigation is also a consideration. Until you have a basic idea of which route you plan on taking you may be better off waiting to select the boat to do it on.

[smj]

You could also check out the Fountaine Pajot Louisiane 37. They have centerboards and are tiller steered. As Boatguy said you could build your own or buy a home built or one off for a lot less than production.


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[Davy J]

There's a few 105mc listed for $79,000 right now but that wont leave me much for upgrades. Thanks

A quick check of Yachtworld only showed 1 105Mc model at 74,900. The rest are the 105M model which has slight differences than the 105Mc. The 105Mc model was produced in 2001 and after.

If that boat in Merritt Island is in good shape it's a steal at that price. You will notice that the next closest 105Mc is about 90,000. And I can tell you that Gemini's in that price range all need some type of attention. At least that's what I found when I went shopping for mine.

[Southern Star]

The PDQ is well-built (and I suspect structurally capable of a circumnavigation), performs well if not overloaded and has excellent bridgedeck clearance and a very well-protected cockpit. However, I am confident that it was not designed, built or rigged for a circumnavigation (perhaps Admiral Slater can weigh in on this). I would certainly want to reef very early and often and make sure that you never took any significant seas beam on. I seem to recall a PDQ32 that capsized a few years ago (off San Francisco) in boisterous conditions and know of one (Zero to Cruising) that lost her rig (although I cannot speak to the condition of the standing rigging at the time).

The Lagoon 35CC is also well-built, although I seem to recall that they were shipped overseas in pieces - clever, but I would want to make sure that this design does not compromise structural integrity in extremis. They also have good bridgdeck clearance (although I am unsure whether it is greater than on the PDQ32). We do know that they were not designed or intended for offshore sailing; indeed I seem to recall that 'CC' stands for 'Coastal Cruiser'.

The Gemini is quick if not overloaded, although is less solidly built than the PDQ and subject to the above proviso, the Lagoon 35CC. You can expect to see numerous stress cracks develop in time over the deck and cockpit enclosure. Yes, a new one circumnavigated and at least one other new one crossed the Atlantic, sailed by the then owner of Gemini (Tony Smith?). However, even he is purported to have said that he would never do it again. The low bridgdeck is an issue (they can even pound under anchor in a chop), which could make your voyage very uncomfortable. I also find the helm position, which requires the helmsperson to look through the main saloon, to be less than ideal (especially if the windows are even slightly hazed). It also provides less ventilation in hot weather. I prefer the set-up on the PDQ ( a wide, sliding companioway hatch) that allows an unobstructed view forward (and improved ventilation), and while when closed in bad conditions it reduces interior headroom in the saloon, it also reduces windage. Your take may vary.

You must keep in mind that over and above the purchase price (including any taxes and registration fees), you will need to budget for a significant refit. I, for one, would not contemplate a circumnavigation without new sails, running riggng, thru-hulls, seacocks, hoses below the waterline (in fact, on all of these boats, you may wish to go up a size in diameter for the wire.

Can I make a couple of suggestions? If you are sold on a cat, instead of buying and equippiing for a long-range goal, why not buy and equip for your short-term plans? Any of these boats would be well-suited for cruising Florida, the Bahamas and the Caribbean through the coast of South/Cental America. If after a few years living aboard and cruising, you still want to circumnavigate, sell your cat and buy a monohull that is equipped for the same.

Alternatively, if you are sold on a cat and are committed to a circumnavigation, at your budget you should focus on an older British cat that was built for offshore sailing and which can be purchased inexpensively enough to permit a proper refit. Yes, it will be slower and dated looking, but it will be safe, have a very solid rig and structure and, as many have been sailed offshore, is more likely to come equipped with some of the gear you will want for a circumnavigation.

Various Prouts and Catalacs, the Solaris 36 (there are two models), Solaris 32, Cherokee 35 and 40 etc., would all suit that purpose and your budget.

Brad

[Canibul]

Before getting TOO far into the naysayers who will sit there and tell you all the reasons it can't be done, you might contact John P. in the UK. He sailed a 36 ft. Woods catamaran across the Atlantic to the Caribbean, up here to visit us, and then back across the Atlantic in one season. Alone. His outboard packed up and he came from Luperon up here to Provo with no aux power whatsoever. Bought an outboard here. He anchored off the marina here and rowed ashore to meet us for a couple rum punches. Then rowed back and sailed to Bermuda, the Azores, and home. He does have some tales to tell.

Tell John a small cat is not blue water capable. Go ahead.

Journey on a Woods Sagitta catamaran

[Southern Star]

Canibul, I haven't read a single post in this thread suggesting that a small cat is incapable of offshore sailing (surprisingly, considering some of the anti-cat sentiments often expressed on this site). However, you have to admit that some are better suited than others and, in his budget range, the choices are somewhat limited. You are right, however, that a well-built Woods would also fit the bill (or even a well-built Wharram, although with them one loses the bridgedeck accomodation ).

Brad

[scarlet]

My 2 cents worth is, with your budget being so low, I wouldn't even look for a multihull. Especially since you may take it on ocean crossings. The Gemini is wonderful for coastal cruising, but, with the poor bridge deck clearance, you would be miserable crossing an ocean. And, other boats in that category would be either WAY out of your price range, or a major fixer upper that you would have to spend to get seaworthy.

If I was in your position, with your budget.. I would buy a mono-hull. You can get some truly AMAZING mono-hulls in your price range.

[smj]

Originally Posted by scarlet

My 2 cents worth is, with your budget being so low, I wouldn't even look for a multihull. Especially since you may take it on ocean crossings. The Gemini is wonderful for coastal cruising, but, with the poor bridge deck clearance, you would be miserable crossing an ocean. And, other boats in that category would be either WAY out of your price range, or a major fixer upper that you would have to spend to get seaworthy.

If I was in your position, with your budget.. I would buy a mono-hull. You can get some truly AMAZING mono-hulls in your price range.

I disagree. There are plenty of cats that could be seaworthy enough to cross oceans and below his price point, but they may not be the type of cat that everyone dreams of. As Brad says, check out the older British catamarans. Plenty of bluewater miles under their keels and prices which I believe are dropping. Also remember, the price is just the asking price, the owner may be willing to sell for much less.


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[Sos]

The Woods Sagitta is 30' !

Also look at the Heavenly Twins - they have circumnavigated.

As others have said the Prouts are a good bet.