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Old 24-02-2010, 00:46   #136
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2000 Litres of water and and a bit more than 2200 litres of fuel - or any combination of the two - wow no wonder your boat is 65 foot.

Serious question - when you load that much on board - how many people for how long? What range under motor does that fuel loading give you.
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Old 24-02-2010, 08:34   #137
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sinking Cats

Southern Star I agree with you, a number of boats I had looked at had holes cut into the bulkhead (not sure why, maybe easier engine part access) and then just a normal not waterproof cover put on. They have basically taken a perfect bulkhead and made it not watertight.
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Old 24-02-2010, 08:45   #138
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You guys need to realize, cats just don't sink.

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Old 24-02-2010, 08:51   #139
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We have tanks for 400 gallons of diesel and 600 gallons of water so I was exaggerating a bit but not so much ;-)

The reason for taking so much isn't sailing somewhere; it is staying somewhere outside modern civilization for a long period. When we leave the marina here and sail into the San Blas and Colombian islands, the diesel fuel lasts us a year (making water, hot water, charging, some propulsion, A/C etc.) and a lot of the water is used for washing the salt off the boat after the passage to paradise and a thousand other cleaning jobs that we tend to do. It's not a long passage but it is against the trades so lots of salt spray.

When we sail far, we still take 400 gallons of diesel. We just always take 400 gallons except when it's expensive and we go where it's cheap. This just means we rarely visit a fuel dock. We could cross the Atlantic with 400 gallons. But we only take 200-300 gallons of water in that case, using it as ballast (mono hull thing).

But my main point is that when you have a cat the size we're talking about and are full time liveaboard and your total weight is 8 tons, there isn't much stuff you can bring along.

cheers,
Nick.
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Old 24-02-2010, 13:07   #140
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Thanks Canibul, great shot, great caption - and a great name for a catamaran, albeit only for non-Christians.

Brad
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Old 24-02-2010, 16:42   #141
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What is an unchecked through hull inside a water tight compartment?
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Old 24-02-2010, 16:48   #142
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sailing is all about safety, first we have a bow that can be damaged with out worry and is replaceable that is put in front of the safety bow, we standard build 2 crash bulkheads in to both bows, 1 is 500 mm from the front bow from top to bottom, the second compartment is a 1500 liter from the first crash bulkhead horizontal to the main bulkhead.
In the stern's we have a crash bulkhead 800 mm from the stern sealed and below the rear bunk we have a closed flotation chamber of 1800 liters of air each side.
Besides that we have several foamed areas in the boat to increase buoyancy and we use Divinycell foam true out that has over 5.5 tons of buoyancy. with a total loaded boat weight of 8 tons and more than 16 tons of buoyancy it will never go down.
We use no more inboard engines so no hull penetrations there just outboard Green Motion electric drives.
It has been quite some time.
Where is the data on that boat?
Many are waiting for the reality.
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Old 24-02-2010, 19:08   #143
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Forward on our boat are two forelockers with an aft bulkhead coming up well above the water line and an inspection hatch above the waterline.

Unfortunately someone decided to put a watermaker in one of them. The through hull that was an exhaust port for the watermaker now became an intake when we had a few tons of snow fall on the boat. The water maker itself had been removed a long time ago, so this intake was simply a through hull with a bit of hose hanging from it. As I'd mentioned, normally (such as now) the through hull is a foot above the waterline. It's stopped off now of course.

What I should do is make the inspection door watertight the way they do on Prout 45s. Also I have yet to make a crash compartment in that forelocker to contain any flooding. Before we go cruising I certainly will. It's on the to do list (along with a few hundred other things). I agree with Gideon, the fewer through hulls the better. Our last catamaran had retractible engines (outboards) and the beautiful simplicity that this allows is incredible.

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What is an unchecked through hull inside a water tight compartment?
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Old 24-02-2010, 22:18   #144
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Next haul-out you should simply remove the thru-hull fitting and glass the hole. After the fitting is off, it's a 2 hour job plus some finishing but that can be done in between the other projects.

Also, when you put nothing in that space, fill it up with sturdy empty PET bottles (tightly closed of course), all the way up to the deck.

cheers,
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Old 24-02-2010, 22:27   #145
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S/V Jedi,

I agree with your principle of carrying enough fuel crusing to be independant of chasing fuel for up to 12 months. I am planning for a crusing cat to cover Coral Sea, PNG, and Pacific and need load around 1200-1500 litres fuel capacity watermaker, all chain rode and generator for dive compressor etc.

Of the Australian cats that reguirement rules out many such as Schonnings & Seawinds. However there are designs available with capacity built in to do it by going to a minimum of 45-46 ft.

Reading through crusing blogs I don't want to be hamstrung chasing fuel and carting jerrycans.

Mate of mine who collects aquarium fish north of cairns on GBR towards Cape york tells me there are vessels always pestering them for fuel or food on there way to Torres Straights or Darwin. Simply unprepared for the trip.

Sorry if off topic.

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Old 24-02-2010, 23:11   #146
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Many boat builders look purely at how the design will perform while under way. For most boats sold, that is good enough. But for the few owners who decide to make the boat their home, much more design work is needed. For series production, Dashew and Amel are the only ones I can come up with now who take that extra step, and both are mono-hulls. I do know multi's that are designed for it but they are all custom one-offs. I think the market is too small.

Hmmm.. reading that back it isn't very clear what I mean, so some examples: less bunks (our original design has 3 cabins for sleeping 6; we have two cabins now for sleeping 4), big galley, huge freezer/fridges, big navstation, like a small office, rain-catching system integrated in the hull, more ventilation, more windows, no engine's and stuff in living quarters, room for washing machine and method to get one in & out of the boat without dismantling it, more tankage etc. etc.

100 liters of diesel for each month is enough so 1,200 liters is good for a year. But don't forget propane, it's what we run out of first.

Now, where do you end up with a cat with all that when you want to keep it unsinkable? My guess is a 50' or bigger one.

ciao!
Nick.
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Old 24-02-2010, 23:47   #147
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Freeflow 46 is one

New design , 1st currently under construction by one of original lightwave catamaran owner/builders. Will be a big 46 equilivant to many 50 ft cats. Flat panel/infusion. all weight central so should have good stability.

8000kg - up to 11900kg design.

Freeflow Catamarans

Atached photos of a hull shoe out still in mold. All tanks/motor(shaft drive 2 degree shaft angle/ under hull sole.
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Old 24-02-2010, 23:55   #148
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Freeflow 46 is one

New design , 1st currently under construction by one of original lightwave catamaran owner/builders. Will be a big 46 equilivant to many 50 ft cats. Flat panel/infusion. all weight central so should have good stability.

8000kg - up to 11900kg design.

Freeflow Catamarans
.
Any idea how the engines will be accessed under that owners cabin?

Freeflow Catamarans
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Old 25-02-2010, 00:07   #149
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Centrally located in hull well out of aft cabins. Similar to Antares 44 in location but much larger.

As you can see will be plenty of room around and in front of engine. worker is in engine bay. Will need steps to climb in. I could lift one end of the hull shoe (212kg using infusion)

The hull cabin soles will be placed over the bulkheads.

Nick, you have it sorted with your comments.
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Old 26-02-2010, 00:14   #150
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Freeflow 46................

Atached photos of a hull shoe out still in mold. All tanks/motor(shaft drive 2 degree shaft angle/ under hull sole.
Love the shaft drive. Owning a cat with the head located forward, I swore the next boat would have the head located aft.... in a more....stable.... location.
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