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Old 04-10-2015, 14:03   #1
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Shocking video from coast guard: abandoning a 40 ft. Tri because of damaged sails.

Maybe I am a fool, just too stupid to understand what I see in that video.

Following is the the officially video document during a rescue mission by helicopter Coast guard in Febr 2015. The comment:

Quote:
"A survivor jumps from a sailboat into the water Saturday, Feb. 14, 2015, moments before being hoisted by the Coast Guard to an MH-60 Jayhawk helicopter. The Coast Guard hoisted four people from the trimaran after the sailboat's sails sustained heavy damage in high winds off the North Carolina coast. U.S. Coast Guard video by Coast Guard Air Station Elizabeth City, North Carolina"


Watch the video here on your own: https://www.dvidshub.net/video/39134...t#.VhGAwtdSiOw

I cant embedd the video link directly:
https://www.dvidshub.net/video/embed/391343

Can't believe it what I just have seen. Even with completly destroyed sails there is the option that the helicopter crew delivers a "storm sail" package just throw it onto the trimaran. And the journey can keep going safely.

Abandoning a boat of 40 foot size, which seems completly intact (no damaged amas, no water in the boat) looks for me like the skipper begs the insurance for money. - Do we see here an "insurance fraud" ?

Every boat must have a storm jib at least on board... regularly not only a jib. Even a "storm main sail". Thats the rule for good seamanship and basic lesson in every sail academy.


Or what do you see what I dont see ?
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Old 04-10-2015, 15:10   #2
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Re: Shocking video from coast guard: abandoning a 40 ft. Tri because of damaged sails

I don't know, it looks like a disabled boat in some pretty ugly seas. I've never heard of the Coast Guard giving out storm sail packages, they don't even like to give out gasoline, too much liability.

If the people made a distress call, the CG would be obliged to rescue the people, not the boat.

If the crew felt they were in danger, its up to them to make the call. It seems like a tough way to make an insurance claim. Jumping into confused ocean seas to be hoisted out by a helicopter? It seems like a pretty risky way to make a fraudulent insurance claim.

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Old 04-10-2015, 15:36   #3
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Re: Shocking video from coast guard: abandoning a 40 ft. Tri because of damaged sails

Looks to me like someone jumping off of a perfectly good boat. If there is damage, it sure isn't obvious. The jib and main look furled, the rudder appears to be intact and functioning. There appears to be enough cloth there to rig some kind of a sail. The seas aren't overwhelming the boat or even breaking over the swimmer. I don't really want to second-guess a call for help, but it does seem to appear here the boat was not the problem.
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Old 04-10-2015, 15:42   #4
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Re: Shocking video from coast guard: abandoning a 40 ft. Tri because of damaged sails

Seas do not look that bad nor the winds. Donor see breaking seas and virtually no white caps. Looks like another case of calling the CG and abandoning a boat cause things aren't going perfectly.
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Old 04-10-2015, 16:00   #5
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Re: Shocking video from coast guard: abandoning a 40 ft. Tri because of damaged sails

Well, there's the possibility that they're not very good sailors, lots of people buy more boat than they can handle. You see it all the time on this forum, and its encouraged by the cruising community, buy the biggest boat you can afford because its a symbol of success.

To them it might have truly been an overwhelming situation.

Or maybe there was a medical emergency, or maybe they were great sailors and their weather fax showed Joaquin barreling down on them and they new the game was over.

I have no idea why they bailed, but 4 people conspiring for insurance fraud by jumping into the ocean to be helivacced?

It seems kind of unlikely to me.

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Old 04-10-2015, 16:29   #6
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Re: Shocking video from coast guard: abandoning a 40 ft. Tri because of damaged sails

Me thinks you are not a fool - just too stupid to understand.

They probably failed to take their seasick pills and would rather die than keep vomiting for another couple of days.
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Old 04-10-2015, 16:31   #7
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Re: Shocking video from coast guard: abandoning a 40 ft. Tri because of damaged sails

Ahoy!

That video is old. It was recorded in February 2015 and has been discussed on the forum back then, when it was recent news.

Condor 40 trimaran

As I recall, it had been recently purchased and the crew was attempting to travel when a storm was predicted then, and the skipper and crew were seasick and tired, fatigued, exhausted. Something like that.

As to the question of why the USCG would not drop them a new sail?

First, I don't see that as the job of the rescue helo and crew. Secondly, I don't think the boat required a new sail. And thirdly, even if the boat needed a new sail, there is a great chance that a boats crew could not use it properly, given the state of the crew.
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Old 04-10-2015, 16:36   #8
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Re: Shocking video from coast guard: abandoning a 40 ft. Tri because of damaged sails

A quick Google Custom search of the forum found the original thread discussing this boats loss, the boat, the crew, the storm, and the mention of other boats abandoned then, including a Gunboat cat.

Another rescue in USA-Trio
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Old 04-10-2015, 16:38   #9
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Re: Shocking video from coast guard: abandoning a 40 ft. Tri because of damaged sails

Quote:
Originally Posted by DumnMad View Post
Me thinks you are not a fool - just too stupid to understand.

They probably failed to take their seasick pills and would rather die than keep vomiting for another couple of days.
Constant vomiting, due to seasickness, has been called
Life -threatening before.
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Old 04-10-2015, 16:42   #10
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Re: Shocking video from coast guard: abandoning a 40 ft. Tri because of damaged sails

They got in over their head and bailed.

You should definitely send a letter to the CG suggesting the helicopters carry a compliment of various storm sails with different track slides and sizes and stuff.
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Old 04-10-2015, 16:43   #11
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Distance to coast....

Quote:
Originally Posted by FamilyVan View Post
I don't know, it looks like a disabled boat in some pretty ugly seas. I've never heard of the Coast Guard giving out storm sail packages, they don't even like to give out gasoline, too much liability.
To be understood right way about this post: of course I dont complain about the Coast guard. When they get a distress call, they have to come into action. I dont complain about them.

Quote:
Originally Posted by FamilyVan View Post
If the people made a distress call, the CG would be obliged to rescue the people, not the boat.
Sure.... what else they can do. The only consequence by Coast guard.

Quote:
Originally Posted by FamilyVan View Post
If the crew felt they were in danger, its up to them to make the call.
Thats exactly the question ! What danger ??

I'd feel more scared to jump into cold sea with the hope, that the helicopter pics me up.... and own body doesnt have a circulatory collapes, cardiac arrest or muscle craps becaue of the coldness.

I'd better stay even on a "flipped over/capsized trimaran" using it as a "life raft" than swimming around in cold water. It was February.

The video is little bit blury... so I do not clearly recognize, if the guy who jumps off board at least had connected the rescue buoy with a flotable sheet or kind of swim pad he is using. So eventually he can pull himself back to the boat if something goes wrong with the helicopter.

Quote:
Originally Posted by FamilyVan View Post
It seems like a tough way to make an insurance claim. Jumping into confused ocean seas to be hoisted out by a helicopter? It seems like a pretty risky way to make a fraudulent insurance claim.
Oh, here it seems you have no idea what people can do if they are affected in their psyche under difficult circumstances. We have seen suicide now during Greek financial crisis because people fell into poorness. Some people do suizide because of shame being bankrupcy or kill each other because of "little money".

I could speculate lots more around about tragedies of life who can have an impact onto such an action driven by desperation. Maybe this person has an abuse, e.g. wastes all his money steadily in the casino behind the roulet table, and just has lost all.... house, all the money.
In his desperation he only has his boat, and sees it as last chance to come to money as no bank, no friends anymore will lend him money.

Yes, its little bit "theory". But I am old enough by living, that I know its not theory or just a script from a bad "B move" produced in Hollywood. So is life. Sadly to say.

If people are desperated they can act in their behaviour and decisions very, very strangely.... against any ratio.

The point is, we never can ask this skipper himself. At least we can learn from this video and think about what might have been a better way to keep safely for crew + boat.

Thats why I show this clip. Its painfully to see this and the technical reasons behind that a damaged sail wardrobe leads to abandon a ship cannot just be accepted.

Personally I wont have left this boat after all my sails had been torn in the storm. Instead: Calling PanPan... (not Mayday). And asking for an air delivery, e.g. a package of storm sails. At least this might have been a try.

If the boat had been close to shore, the skipper could have asked for a Tug boat to be pulled into the harbour.

I just measured the distance of the helicopter position as it is shown real time in the display. Latitude and longitude had been:
33 40.202' N
76 23.942' W

The boat had been on distance to closest point in North North West roughly 66 miles = ~57 nautical miles. See attached image.

(Original Google map link:
https://www.google.com/maps/place/33...-76.1704662,9z )

As already mentioned, even a Trimaran going offshore should keep on board a set of storm sail in reserve. - It was a big mistake by the skipper not having such on board, right ?
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Old 04-10-2015, 16:54   #12
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Re: Shocking video from coast guard: abandoning a 40 ft. Tri because of damaged sails

Quote:
Originally Posted by Steady Hand View Post
Ahoy!

That video is old. It was recorded in February 2015 and has been discussed on the forum back then, when it was recent news.

Condor 40 trimaran

As I recall, it had been recently purchased and the crew was attempting to travel when a storm was predicted then, and the skipper and crew were seasick and tired, fatigued, exhausted. Something like that.

As to the question of why the USCG would not drop them a new sail?

First, I don't see that as the job of the rescue helo and crew. Secondly, I don't think the boat required a new sail. And thirdly, even if the boat needed a new sail, there is a great chance that a boats crew could not use it properly, given the state of the crew.
Ah yes, thanks for straightening that out.
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Old 04-10-2015, 16:56   #13
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Re: Shocking video from coast guard: abandoning a 40 ft. Tri because of damaged sails

Quote:
Originally Posted by Steady Hand View Post
Ahoy!

That video is old. It was recorded in February 2015 and has been discussed on the forum back then, when it was recent news.
Hey, Hoh !!!

Okeys, Okeys... I didnt want bother anybody or let feel somebody beinb bored.

But I am new here on the forum (and I had no idea where to search). Sorry.... I feel guilty :-) hehe...

I think, its nothing bad to discuss again and again "sea rescues". Beginners and experienced ones can learn a lot, isnt ?? :-)

At least I got such "cases" again and again in my own sailing education, even old ones... and I did it in sail academy with my students, as I am sail instructor on my own.

Nothing wrong to remember "bad examples" and learn from, right ? :-)
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Old 04-10-2015, 17:01   #14
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Re: Shocking video from coast guard: abandoning a 40 ft. Tri because of damaged sails

Quote:
Originally Posted by paxfish View Post
They got in over their head and bailed.

You should definitely send a letter to the CG suggesting the helicopters carry a compliment of various storm sails with different track slides and sizes and stuff.
Good idea, Paxfish ! :-) Will give it a try.... ;-)

Maybe DHL, UPS or Fedex have such "air based delivery services" with drones, hm ?
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Old 04-10-2015, 17:02   #15
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Re: Shocking video from coast guard: abandoning a 40 ft. Tri because of damaged sails

I'm not looking for a fight here, one guy commiting fraud, sure, but 4 guys conspiring? Its just my opinion that's all not an attack.

I have a little bit of insight into what people with an injured psyche are capable of on the water.

Some of that insight I got during my 13 years in the Coast Guard. 9 of those years as a Rescue Specialist/SAR Tech. If you're not familiar with the term, those are the guys who willingly insert themselves into storms, sinking and burning vessels and rocky ice covered shore lines to provide emergency medical care, stabilise the situation and save peoples lives.



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