Screecher/Code 0 or Asymmetrical Kite for cruising?

[AndyBerry]

Originally Posted by SV DestinyAscen

Screeches would definitely be easier to manage - you could also try goose winging with your jib with your main down.


If you haven't already - consider getting quick releases that work well under tension for your spinnaker, it makes it a lot easier to handle if you can drop the working sheet at the bow after you're all ready to pull the non-working sheet around/pulling the sock down.

Can someone please define the sail choices? What is the difference between a Code 0, Screecher, and Asym kite? Are there other choices as well besides the symmetrical spinnaker? All the names seem to be interchangeable.

Thanks

[Mirage Gecko]

We have a screecher fitted on a Furler that stays fitted as long as we are on the boat and is simplicity itself to use.However after a number of dramas including it ending up in the water and or being dumped on the tramps a couple of times we now only deploy it in true wind to max 15 knots.Above 15 knts I can get all the performance this boat is capable of with the standard sails.
My opinion is it is a better sail upwind than down and am seriously considering changing it to an Asym and a top down Furler considering what I have seen with others using them this season.
You see a lot of different types of cats cruising the QLD coast and the ones I see making the miles down hill ,regardless of boat brand,are the ones flying kites.

[SVNeko]

My suggestion would be both, on interchangeable furlers.

[YARGESOL]

Originally Posted by SVNeko

My suggestion would be both, on interchangeable furlers.

As I understood the OP would like to have a screecher to avoid rising/dropping down..I was also prepairing to put a screecher on my cat (got 3 quotes,almost bought a furler and, based on advises of CF was sereously bound for articulating sprit). But, than the local obreros refused to work on sprit (I asked 2 mtr long) and, finally the mast builder (Selden) said,that I can't add another haliyard and should use spinaker haliyard with their "two to one purchase". Than I stopped: why should I add another trouble of handling extra sail and haliyard ? The reason for Code O/Screecher (for me) is if it always ready to fly/furl. So, finally I left with what I have: standard sails+ ASY with a bridle.
The last one(ATN sock) with a line/sheet leaded to main winches is very handy.
Control of a tack/clew gives option of 70-180 apparent

[packeteer]

code 0, great for those light winds

[knockabout]

all 3

[Kaptain Ken]

BOTH!!! We have both on our Lagoon 440. Make sure you have the asymmetrical spinnaker in a sock. Ideally, you have separate halyards for the code zero and spinnaker as we do - much more flexible.

[Stumble]

Originally Posted by AndyBerry

Can someone please define the sail choices? What is the difference between a Code 0, Screecher, and Asym kite? Are there other choices as well besides the symmetrical spinnaker? All the names seem to be interchangeable.

Thanks

All the sails discussed here are asymetric spinnakers. They are just different types.

A Code 0 is the flattest cut asymetric that reallytakes the place of a really big genoa. It is an upwind sail that I see really designed for a true beat, not reaching. However because they are also the easiest asym to use on a furler on cruising boats theyget pressed into use as reaching sails as well.

A Screatcher is similarly to a Code0 but cut for deeper reaching. Generally a fuller cut, which gives real advantages to deeper angles but doesn't work as well on tight luff furler.

I think most people are using 'asym' to refer to an A2 (reacher) or A3 (runner). They are the traditional asymetric spinnakers that will only work on a top-down furler not a tight luff.

If you look at the chart below the key is:
C - Code
G - Genniker
A - Asymetric
S - Symmetric

[svrevelations]

Originally Posted by Morph

I have a 11.7m Pescot catamaran which is more at the performance end of cats (dagger boards, 4.5 tonne weight etc) we are mainly cruisers, however we really love the performance sailing that we get from the boat.
I've just bought a large asymmetrical kite for wind angles greater than 70 degrees. The kite is great when it's up but it is a total pain in the arse to manage even with a sock--it is pretty scary. I'm wondering about going for a code 0/screecher type arrangement set up on the prodder for off the wind, especially as its either just two of us or single handing?

Our sailing is fairly full on, I'm based in Sydney and go up and down the coast regularly--the last two weekends we have been in over 40 knots and 3-4 metre seas so I need something that is pretty bullet proof

If I were you, I would keep the asymmetrical spinnaker. Instead of replacing it with a screetcher, find ways which will enable you to easily deploy and depower the asymmetrical. We have a screetcher and a big asymmetrical spinnaker on our yacht, they each have a purpose and I will never do away with our asymmetrical spinnaker. Our spinnaker is rigged in such a way that one person can do everything. Although, getting the spinnaker from the sail locker and fully deployed on the mast takes quite a bit of work. For wind from behind, the asymmetrical spinnaker is hard to beat.

[UNCIVILIZED]

On a cat/multi, unless you're talking about a true Code 0 which requires a bar taut luff, it's often possible to move a sail's tack to weather, which somewhat alters the wind angles at which you can fly it. Yes, it requires more work on the part of the crew, but it can boost the versatility of a sail a bit.

Also, for A-sails that are flown on furlers. Be they Code 0's or other types, it's generally best not to leave them up when furled, as the wind can start to pluck at them. Especially if you didn't get it to furl perfectly, which isn't uncommon.

Speaking of which, imperfect furls are something to consider when buying such sails. Since if/when this occurs, sometimes the only plausible way to fix things is to unfurl the sail on land later on, & then rehoist it unfurled & refurl it. As at times they can get snarled in some nasty wraps around themselves. It's less common now, but something to consider.
This, however, is part of why it sometimes makes sense to use a sock/snuffer on A-sails. That, & since the cost of an anti-torsion cable for each A-sail runs about the same price as does a snuffer for the sail.

Also, for a downwind sail that's easy to handle in moderate - heavier winds, as in above 15kts, you can add a detachable Solent Stay & fly a hank on reacher from it. In addition of course, to heavy air upwind sails. And depending on how you design the stay's detachability connection, it can be simple to greatly alter how tight or loose the stay is. So that you can use this as another tool for sail shaping & tuning.

Good thread BTW.

[tomfl]

Originally Posted by Morph

ISNIP

Our sailing is fairly full on, I'm based in Sydney and go up and down the coast regularly--the last two weekends we have been in over 40 knots and 3-4 metre seas so I need something that is pretty bullet proof

The sails you mention are normally flown in 15 knots or less. Even at 10 knots it can be a problem to take them down; especially if you are not careful with the furreling and get the line wrapped to tight or too much on the drum. Most boat makers suggest you start reefing at around 20 knots or so, and another reef at 25. Once you get to 30 knots or above storm sails are suggested.

I easily hit 9 knots on my Seawind flying the working alone if the wind is above 15 knots. In fact for most down wind sailing I never use the main sail, I will just sail wing on wing with the working jib and the screecher.

Bottom line is above 20 knots flying big sails is asking for trouble.

[Dave_S]

Originally Posted by tomfl

I will just sail wing on wing with the working jib and the screecher.

I was going to ask about this, wouldn't this be almost as good as a spinnaker for straight down wind?

[UNCIVILIZED]

Originally Posted by Dave_S

I was going to ask about this, wouldn't this be almost as good as a spinnaker for straight down wind?

Unless you're on a fat lead mine, like a 12m, DDW is Slow, particularly for a multihull with any legs (performance potential). You're much better off playing your gybing angles.

[clownfishsydney]

We have a screecher, 110% genoa and spinnaker. The vast majority of the time we use the screecher, sometimes without the main. It is great downwind by itself or in conjunction with the genoa. We have used it like this in up to 30 kts. If the wind is over 20 kts, then we will often just use the screecher by itself, gives far more speed than the main (which is the same size). It is the easiest sail to control/extend etc by one person.

We love our screecher!

[MIRELOS]

on a cruising cat those are light air sails, after 20knts you start to reef main and jib...else you are playing with the safety of the vessel, not to mention crew.