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Old 24-05-2009, 08:16   #1
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Removing 'Old' Ceiling - Installing 'New'

I am in the process of buying a Morgan 382. I will need to remove the 'OLD' fabric ceiling and install a 'NEW'. I would like to install cedar stripping. I did this years ago to a wood John Alden 30. At that time I ripped each individual piece from 2x8 cedar boards, sanded them, bull-nosed them and screwed them in place. I do not want to do that again ...if possible. The Morgan being a fiberglass hull I will have to glass vertical strips to which I can attach the 'NEW' ceiling ...I think, unless someone has a different way of doing it. I would also appreciate any information on new ceiling material available that would produce the same results e.g. a stripped ceiling. I have attached two photos. One showing the current cloth ceiling and the other showing a 'NEW' stripped ceiling that I would like to end up with.
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Thanks for any and all help,

sv_kalise
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Old 24-05-2009, 11:23   #2
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I have done it before like you. Also did the overhead "ceiling". I used white cedar which I cut each piece to fit, temporary installed and then removed and numbered the backside. I then spray varnished all the pieces outside the boat and reinstalled them. It was beautiful... varnished white cedar. You do need to attach vertical batten strips to screw the pieces to. One at least every 2 feet or so. In a 5 ft length I would put one at each end and one in the middle. Cut .5 to.75 Plywood to length, If the hull is curved, cut slots about half way through all along (the short direction)these batten boards so they will bend. You can Bondo these to the hull, the slots help hold the bondo. Then it would be best to put a short strip of thin "boat glass" over it a couple of places, although I have skipped this step before with no apparant problem, depending on the surface condition. Rough up the surface first.
There is an amazing one part glue made by Fuller that I would not hesitate to use in this application all by itself, or even for attaching the cedar strips with no battens. Unfortunately, it's only commercially available and in 5 gallon buckets. It cures wet or dry (better wet!) and is very strong. The problem is if you put it in a little container, you can never get the lid off! It's only about $100 for 5 gals If I remember right....
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Old 25-05-2009, 07:23   #3
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Thanks CHEECHAKO,

I had some trouble with my sign-in to the Cruiser's Forum causing my delay in answering you.

About the ceiling ...I am happy to know about the Fuller Glue. I'll do a search for it as I intend to do the hull ceilings in the entire boat and will very likely need a fair amount of the glue. I still do not look forward to the project because sailing is my game ...but it is something that needs to be done to preserve the value of the boat.

If anyone else out there knows of any time-saving methods (like the Fuller Glue) I would be happy to hear about it.

sv_kalise
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Old 25-05-2009, 10:34   #4
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I'll try to find my info on the glue.
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Old 25-05-2009, 12:09   #5
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Thanks for the help. I've been to H.B. Fuller ...but there are a lot of choices. If you can get me to the glue you referred to ...I would appreciate it.

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Old 26-05-2009, 09:31   #6
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Yea, I spent about an hour trying to figure it out on their web site yesterday to no avail. My best guess is that it is "one part moisture curing" Urethane or acrylic glue. I think I know someone else who might have the part number, I will contact them.
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Old 26-05-2009, 13:09   #7
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This is how my ceiling is installed. There is a small strip attatched to the ceiling. The pieces are cut to fit this, and then a wider strip goes on top of the smaller one. This willa llow you to insulate also.You can see the walls are the same. If you need a detailed pic? I can take one for you.....i2f
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Old 26-05-2009, 15:37   #8
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THE glue....

OK, here it is, the best thing since swiss cheeze! They need to find a way to package this stuff for household use!
UR0218

Rocky Mt. Adhesives

303 660 9247

It is a clear thick sticky liquid, a bit like the consistancy of Epoxy. It is one part... (no hardender) etc. It is aided in curing by a light mist of water. It swells slightly when curing and has a whiteish foamy look when cured. It is very slightly flexible. It is amazing at putting non compatible things together like ceramic and chrome, metal to rubber etc. It will glue the lid on the container, so be carefull to clean the lid etc well. It doesnt seem to have a bad smell or anything like that.
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Old 26-05-2009, 15:42   #9
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But do you want at some time access to the underside of the ceiling?......i2f
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Old 26-05-2009, 15:50   #10
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He was originally talking about the "ceiling" strips. (inside the hull on the sides) see his pic.

This appears to be the same stuff in smaller containers: Urethanes from Glueit.com
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Old 26-05-2009, 17:47   #11
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I may be doing the same thing on my boat Espina. She is steel with no insulation or ceiling, and needs some renovations. I've started dissecting the galley and think thats where I'll start with the process of insulation and ceiling.

Personally I can't think of any material that you can buy ready to use that would give the look you want. To buy the strips ready made would be incredibly expensive, so I am planning on a work weekend with some friends. Ripping, routing the edges, sanding and finishing all in one weekend. Beer and steaks on me!

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Old 26-05-2009, 21:19   #12
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"Removing 'Old Ceiling' - 'Installing New'

Thanks to all for the suggestions. Thanks to Cheechako for the right stuff on the Glue. Putting it all together I can see that there is no way around doing it the tried and true way. Since I've done this before (20-years ago) I know well the work involved in getting the amount of strips ripped, bull-nosed and sanded while still avoiding knots and outstanding blemishes. It will take some time and a lot of hand-picked 2x6's, 8's & 10's. I do not have a crew that can come to my aid for a weekend so it will be just me and my beer ...doggedly persistant until the job is done. I have also planed on insulating with that reflective material available in many places. I used this stuff on the overhead ceiling of a boat I restored in Mexico. It cut the heat entering the cabin by over 35 degrees! When I did the Alden 30 wood boat I screwed the strips in place with stainless pan head screws. It looked very good so long as my line-up of the screws reamined true. I will like using the glue this time around.

One last question. Those of you who have done this before ...did you leave a space between the adjoining strips? Or did you butt them together? On the wood Alden 30 I did 20-years ago I spaced them with an 1/8-inch gap. At that time my thinking was ventilation (air movement around and through).

sv_kalise...
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Old 27-05-2009, 06:02   #13
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OH!........i2f
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Old 27-05-2009, 09:14   #14
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I would leave a small gap between the strips. On the boat I did with Port Orford white cedar I had a millwork company split the 4/4 boards so I could get double the yield in 3/8 thick strips. They had a large band saw (really large!) so they split the 1 x 6's into .5 x 6's and then milled it all into bullnosed strips. Wasnt really that expensive to have done. The perfume in that white cedar was so strong my eyes watered sometimes but I loved it....
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