Cruisers Forum
 


Join CruisersForum Today

Reply
 
Thread Tools Rate Thread Display Modes
Old 01-04-2008, 14:03   #106
Marine Service Provider
 
fastcat435's Avatar

Cruisers Forum Supporter

Join Date: Jul 2007
Location: Amstelveen Netherlands
Boat: FastCat 445 Green Motion
Posts: 1,649
Images: 10
Send a message via Skype™ to fastcat435
Quote:
Originally Posted by Nordic cat View Post
I will be following Gideons reccomendation on another thread and be using the Marguard Lexan. UV resistant and anti-scratch treated.

Regards

Alan
And it has another nice feature , it is self cleaning we have it installed on 4 cats now and it is the best window material we have ever used, we now even convinced BSI to make the hatches and portholes for us in the same
Lexan marguard , it is sold in 2 different green tintings make sure you do the preparation well with the correct Rimer G made by bostic and the sealant made by Bostik , if any body is interested I can get you the exact specs and manual for installation. the 9.5 mm is well suited for the saloon windows if not bigger than 1 squire meter otherwise go for the 12 mm
Greetings and Happy Sailing
__________________

__________________
fastcat435 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-04-2008, 15:54   #107
Registered User
 
Nordic cat's Avatar

Join Date: Jan 2008
Location: Denmark
Boat: FP Tobago 35
Posts: 721
Quote:
Originally Posted by fastcat435 View Post
And it has another nice feature , it is self cleaning we have it installed on 4 cats now and it is the best window material we have ever used, we now even convinced BSI to make the hatches and portholes for us in the same
Lexan marguard , it is sold in 2 different green tintings make sure you do the preparation well with the correct Rimer G made by bostic and the sealant made by Bostik , if any body is interested I can get you the exact specs and manual for installation. the 9.5 mm is well suited for the saloon windows if not bigger than 1 squire meter otherwise go for the 12 mm
Greetings and Happy Sailing

Not to hijack this thread, but I would appreciate the specs and manual. Also do you order directly from BSI?

Thanks

Alan
__________________

__________________
Nordic cat is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-04-2008, 23:37   #108
Marine Service Provider
 
fastcat435's Avatar

Cruisers Forum Supporter

Join Date: Jul 2007
Location: Amstelveen Netherlands
Boat: FastCat 445 Green Motion
Posts: 1,649
Images: 10
Send a message via Skype™ to fastcat435
Quote:
Originally Posted by Nordic cat View Post
Not to hijack this thread, but I would appreciate the specs and manual. Also do you order directly from BSI?

Thanks

Alan
outh

Yes we order directly from BSI , we are their distributor in South Africa
we send in |Marguard lexan to them since they cannot source it at a reasonable price
I will get you the lexan instructions and the type of sealant today
we are also the importer for bostik in South africa so if you build here let me know we can help.
we also carry the marguard in stock here

Greetings
__________________
fastcat435 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 30-05-2008, 20:11   #109
Registered User
 
svcattales's Avatar

Join Date: Apr 2005
Location: Apollo Beach, Fl
Boat: Privilege 37
Posts: 531
Images: 10
Unhappy Replacing Rudder Bearings, Privilege 37

Occasionally I hear a clunking noise coming from my starboard rudder area. When I dive on it, there is some "play" on the starboard rudder and none on port so I suspect the bearings are wearing out.

Has anyone replaced their rudder bearings and how big a job is it? Does the rudder post have to be removed completely? Do I need a 500 lb gorilla to lift the rudder back in? Any advice would be appreciated.
__________________
Greg, SV Cat Tales
svcattales is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 30-05-2008, 22:00   #110
Registered User
 
Strygaldwir's Avatar

Join Date: Dec 2004
Location: Deale, Maryland
Boat: SeaView - Privilege 37
Posts: 1,019
Images: 5
Funny you should ask Greg!

I pulled my rudder shortly before I saw you in Nassau a while back.

The rudders don't really sit in a bearing. If you look in your engine rooms, way back in the back, you'll see the steering quandrants. They are attached to the rudder post that run inside the tubes the quadrants are sort of sitting on. Inside the post at the top of the post and at the bottom are derylin bushing that the rudder post swivel in. To remove these bushings, you have to drop the rudders.

I had the boat hauled and put it on railroad ties as high as it would sit. I disconnected that cross piece that ties the two rudders together, removed the cquadrants and then dropped the rudders. The rudder post are quite long, even though I had the boat fairly high up, I had to dig a hole to get the rudders completely out.

Onceyou have the rudder out, you can see the bushings. They can then be rotated 90 degrees and slide out of a slot in the aluminum housing they set it. Rather elegant when you think about it. The bushings swivel within the housing and tend to be self adjusting and aligning. My problem was that they swell after a while and cause very stiff turning. I mearly took mine out, dressed them up with emory cloth until they rotated freely on the rudder post and within the house. Put them back and they have been good for I guess two years now. Beats the $500 or so Catamarn Co wanted to charge me for new ones.

Having said all that, I would not think it was the bushings that was causing the noise, they are just big plastic donuts. I'd think it were the quandrants, that cross piece, or perhaps the autopilot attachment to the quadrants. But on second thought, if they are very worn they could be shifting about a bit in the housings and causing some rackett.

Oh yeah, comming out I had no problem pulling them myself. Putting them in requires two folks. I guess they weigh somewhere arround 80 lbs or so. You'll need something to set them on while you redo the collar that holds them in.

If you have any more questions, don't hesitate to ask.

Good luck.
__________________
Strygaldwir is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 31-05-2008, 14:16   #111
Registered User
 
svcattales's Avatar

Join Date: Apr 2005
Location: Apollo Beach, Fl
Boat: Privilege 37
Posts: 531
Images: 10
Hi Keith,

What a coincidence. I just finished writing a private message to you and now I find you solving my rudder issue.

From what you said about the rudder bearings, I think I have the opposite problem in that I may have too much play in the bearings. If I grab the bottom of the starboard rudder, I can move it about one inch from side to side while the port rudder hardly moves at all. I think the noise may be caused when the rudder itself "flops" from one end of its sideways travel to the other. You mentioned that the delrin bearings fit in an aluminum housing. Is it possible that bearings shifted out side of their housings or do you think they are just worn out? Unfortunately, I can't look at them till I haul out next fall and the lead time for ordering replacements may take a month or so.

Warm regards,
Greg
__________________
svcattales is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 31-05-2008, 18:53   #112
Registered User
 
Strygaldwir's Avatar

Join Date: Dec 2004
Location: Deale, Maryland
Boat: SeaView - Privilege 37
Posts: 1,019
Images: 5
Yes, You're right, the rudders shouldn't visibly move at all.

Thinking about how the bushing is installed in the housings, it does not seem very likely the bushings would come out, unless one or more of them are totally disintegrated.

They are shaped like donuts. they are round, flat on top and botom and have a whole in the middle. If you think of the donut, the sides are curved till they reach the flat parts on the top and bottom. The housings are shaped arround the donut. the curved sides of the bushing fit inside the curved sides of the housing. To get them out, you remove the rudders, which keept the donut from turing on its sides. To remove the busing, you have to turn it 90 degrees on its side and pull it out of a slot in the housing. Not possible for it to accidently fall out.

But, if the bushing were disintegrated, or the housing was broken it could result in the symptoms you describe.

If it is the bushing, the catamaran Co down in Florida probably still has the set I didn't buy. If it is the housing, that's much more extensive. If it is the bushing, you can fix it your self when you haul. The housing, since it is glassed in is another issue!

I'll PM you a little bit later, just wanted to give you a heads up on the bushings.
__________________
Strygaldwir is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-06-2008, 04:24   #113
Registered User

Join Date: May 2008
Posts: 60
Exclamation Privalage cats ?

Hi all , we are still looking for a sutible Cat , can the Priv cats be used on a drying mooring . Steve
__________________
redbreast is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-06-2008, 08:12   #114
Registered User
 
Adaero's Avatar

Join Date: Oct 2006
Location: Devon UK,
Boat: Leopard 46 Cat "Tulliana"
Posts: 154
Images: 1
Quote:
Originally Posted by Strygaldwir View Post
Funny you should ask Greg!

I pulled my rudder shortly before I saw you in Nassau a while back.

The rudders don't really sit in a bearing. If you look in your engine rooms, way back in the back, you'll see the steering quandrants. They are attached to the rudder post that run inside the tubes the quadrants are sort of sitting on. Inside the post at the top of the post and at the bottom are derylin bushing that the rudder post swivel in. To remove these bushings, you have to drop the rudders.

I had the boat hauled and put it on railroad ties as high as it would sit. I disconnected that cross piece that ties the two rudders together, removed the cquadrants and then dropped the rudders. The rudder post are quite long, even though I had the boat fairly high up, I had to dig a hole to get the rudders completely out.

Onceyou have the rudder out, you can see the bushings. They can then be rotated 90 degrees and slide out of a slot in the aluminum housing they set it. Rather elegant when you think about it. The bushings swivel within the housing and tend to be self adjusting and aligning. My problem was that they swell after a while and cause very stiff turning. I mearly took mine out, dressed them up with emory cloth until they rotated freely on the rudder post and within the house. Put them back and they have been good for I guess two years now. Beats the $500 or so Catamarn Co wanted to charge me for new ones.

Having said all that, I would not think it was the bushings that was causing the noise, they are just big plastic donuts. I'd think it were the quandrants, that cross piece, or perhaps the autopilot attachment to the quadrants. But on second thought, if they are very worn they could be shifting about a bit in the housings and causing some rackett.

Oh yeah, comming out I had no problem pulling them myself. Putting them in requires two folks. I guess they weigh somewhere arround 80 lbs or so. You'll need something to set them on while you redo the collar that holds them in.

If you have any more questions, don't hesitate to ask.

Good luck.
Has anyone ever drawn up the bush as I can't believe a plain Delrin bush set would cost $500. Get a few Privilege owners together and have some made. Always useful to carry them as spares.
Regards
Adaero
__________________
Adaero is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-06-2008, 10:17   #115
Registered User
 
philip van praag's Avatar

Join Date: May 2007
Location: uk brighton
Boat: privilege 37
Posts: 181
Images: 18
Quote:
Originally Posted by redbreast View Post
Hi all , we are still looking for a sutible Cat , can the Priv cats be used on a drying mooring . Steve
yes no problem we kept ours on a drying moring for 2 years
and still do all our repairs by drying out.
__________________
philip van praag is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-06-2008, 13:49   #116
Registered User
 
svcattales's Avatar

Join Date: Apr 2005
Location: Apollo Beach, Fl
Boat: Privilege 37
Posts: 531
Images: 10
Quote:
Originally Posted by Strygaldwir View Post
Yes, You're right, the rudders shouldn't visibly move at all.

Thinking about how the bushing is installed in the housings, it does not seem very likely the bushings would come out, unless one or more of them are totally disintegrated.

They are shaped like donuts. they are round, flat on top and botom and have a whole in the middle. If you think of the donut, the sides are curved till they reach the flat parts on the top and bottom. The housings are shaped arround the donut. the curved sides of the bushing fit inside the curved sides of the housing. To get them out, you remove the rudders, which keept the donut from turing on its sides. To remove the busing, you have to turn it 90 degrees on its side and pull it out of a slot in the housing. Not possible for it to accidently fall out.

But, if the bushing were disintegrated, or the housing was broken it could result in the symptoms you describe.

If it is the bushing, the catamaran Co down in Florida probably still has the set I didn't buy. If it is the housing, that's much more extensive. If it is the bushing, you can fix it your self when you haul. The housing, since it is glassed in is another issue!

I'll PM you a little bit later, just wanted to give you a heads up on the bushings.
Keith,

Thanks again for your help. Unfortunately, I'm somewhat challenged in visualizing stuff. I can picture the delrin bushings, but I'm still not there yet with the aluminum housings. Based on your post, the housing stays inside the fiberglass rudder tube. Can you see the bottom housing with the rudder dropped about a foot? Does the rudder post spin inside the "donut hole" of the bushing or is the bushing attached to the rudder post and the bushing spins inside the aluminum housing? The reason I'm trying to visualize this is I'm thinking about dropping the rudder part way out while in the water just to look at the bottom bushing & housing. Then I would know what parts I need before a haulout. Is that a good or dumb idea based on your experience? I was thinking of making a sling to support the weight of the rudder so it doesn't drop out all the way. I have plenty of time before I work on this, so there's no rush for a reply. Greg
__________________
svcattales is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-06-2008, 14:46   #117
Registered User
 
Strygaldwir's Avatar

Join Date: Dec 2004
Location: Deale, Maryland
Boat: SeaView - Privilege 37
Posts: 1,019
Images: 5
Yes, You'll be able to see the housing and the bushing with the rudder dropped down a foot.

Let me think if I can describe this a little better.

The rudder assembly consists mostly of the blade of the rudder and a very long stainless steel pole (rudder post) it has 4 touch points with the boat. One at the very bottom of the hull, That's bushing number one. This post extends about 4 feet up from the rudder blade. The second touch point is bushing number two. Then there is a retaining groove, and finally the quadrant used to attach the steering cables and a very long aluminum pole that connects to the other quandrant on the other rudder.

So, the bushings. Lets start with a hockey puck. We take the puck a drill a large hole in the center. This hole is large enough for the rudder post to go through. We could just glass them into the boat, one at the bottom of the hull, one toward the top of the rudder post. we could then turn the rudder, no problem, except for all the water coming in from the space between the rudder post and the hockey puck. Well, to fix that, we put the pucks inside a alumuninum tube. We run this up on the inside of the boat and water will rise to the water level inside the tube, no higher, Glass it all in, we're done!

But! The pucks wear out. How do we replace them? We have to create someway to keep them from falling out, but we want to make them removeable. Hmmm. So we already have that big aluminum tube, lets make a housing out of it. we could just make a compartment in the aluminum tubing, by boring the tube a little larger, making it big enough to fit the puck in. We could then make a screw on cap for it, drill a hole into the cap so the rudder post would go through it, but not the puck. Screw it down, all done!

I suppose they could have done it this way, but Alliaura was a little bit more ingenous. They said suppose I take this puck, looking at it like it was sitting on the ice and rounded its sides sort of like

going from |_| to (_) (with a top on it, you get the idea)

now, we can build a housing like ( ) Big enough to put the puck in like:


((_))


So, we end up with somthing like this:

||
((_)) < Bushing 2
||
||
||
||
||
||
(( )) <- Bushing 1
||
-------
{ |
{ |
{ |
{ |
{ | <-- Rudder
{ |
{ |
{ |


The sides will keep the puck from ever coming out, if we keep it aligned in the same plane. Well, we use the rudder going through the middle of it to keep it aligned, but we still can't get it out for replacement.

What we do, if we are looking at the bushing from the under the boat and the rudder is out of the way, we cut a slot in the housing. This slot is slightly longer than the diameter of our puck. Since we rounded the inside of the housing, and the sides of the puck have been rounded, we can rotate the puck 90 degrees relative to the plane of rudder puck. So that the puck would be parallel to the axis of the rudder post, if it were still there. Now, we turn the puck untill it is aligned with the slots we cut into the housing. This allows us to pull the puck down and out! Pretty cool!!

If you have the rudders out and things are loose in there, replacing the puck takes all of 30 seconds. Push on one side of the puck till is 90 degrees, grab and rotate it until it is aligned with the slot and pull it out. Reverse is just as easy!

Challenge is getting the rudder out, hauling, lifting, that stuff. You could even do this with the boat in the water, might make it easier in some respects. Rudder would probably be conciderably lighter if nothing else, no holes to dig, no lifts, yards..etc Just have to make sure you have about 7 feet of water, not too much more. Clear water would make it much more enjoyable. You can go inside the engine room and measure the rudder post to the top, that should tell you how much space you need under the boat to get it out.

Oh, and if you have the rudder down a foot so you can see it, you've done about 90% of the work necessary to replace the whole thing.

Yes, the rudder spins inside the donut hole of the bushing. The bushing is a tight fit inside the housing. It should rotate and spin freely, but there really should not be any real play in this.


Hmmmm... Grrrr.... I probably have pictures. I'll check sometime to night and see about getting them up. (Should have thought about this before the lengthy explaination!) Senility is such a waste...
__________________
Strygaldwir is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-06-2008, 14:48   #118
Registered User
 
Strygaldwir's Avatar

Join Date: Dec 2004
Location: Deale, Maryland
Boat: SeaView - Privilege 37
Posts: 1,019
Images: 5
Well, I guess I need the pictures!! It does not like spaces. Reformated the heck out of my carefully crafted rudder!
__________________
Strygaldwir is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-06-2008, 14:49   #119
Registered User
 
Strygaldwir's Avatar

Join Date: Dec 2004
Location: Deale, Maryland
Boat: SeaView - Privilege 37
Posts: 1,019
Images: 5
Yes, I like the idea of having them made!!!! I think the factory was going to give them to me. Got a little lost in the shuffle at the dealer!
__________________
Strygaldwir is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-06-2008, 19:27   #120
Registered User
 
svcattales's Avatar

Join Date: Apr 2005
Location: Apollo Beach, Fl
Boat: Privilege 37
Posts: 531
Images: 10
Quote:
Originally Posted by Strygaldwir View Post
Well, I guess I need the pictures!! It does not like spaces. Reformated the heck out of my carefully crafted rudder!
Keith, Great description with graphics and everything. I get it now. I think I'll try replacing them in the water. It sounds like the tricky part will be putting the rudder back in while aiming the rudder post to go through both donut holes. I assume that the top bushing is removed from the top of the rudder tube. Correct?
__________________

__________________
Greg, SV Cat Tales
svcattales is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply

Tags
privilege

Thread Tools
Display Modes Rate This Thread
Rate This Thread:

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are Off
Pingbacks are Off
Refbacks are Off


Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
Privilege Fuel Shortage privileged Multihull Sailboats 12 23-12-2013 21:42
catana vs privilege malikalalu Multihull Sailboats 43 26-03-2009 20:31
Privilege 435 Rory Multihull Sailboats 3 04-01-2009 16:37
Considering a Privilege Nelson'sGrandson Multihull Sailboats 19 20-10-2008 06:45
Privilege 37 and 395 jrb1978 Multihull Sailboats 12 19-07-2008 20:29


Our Communities

Our communities encompass many different hobbies and interests, but each one is built on friendly, intelligent membership.

» More about our Communities

Automotive Communities

Our Automotive communities encompass many different makes and models. From U.S. domestics to European Saloons.

» More about our Automotive Communities

Marine Communities

Our Marine websites focus on Cruising and Sailing Vessels, including forums and the largest cruising Wiki project on the web today.

» More about our Marine Communities


Copyright 2002- Social Knowledge, LLC All Rights Reserved.

All times are GMT -7. The time now is 06:47.


Google+
Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.8 Beta 1
Copyright ©2000 - 2016, vBulletin Solutions, Inc.
Social Knowledge Networks
Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.8 Beta 1
Copyright ©2000 - 2016, vBulletin Solutions, Inc.

ShowCase vBulletin Plugins by Drive Thru Online, Inc.