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Old 09-05-2013, 00:45   #1
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Privilege?

I am rapidly running out of excuses not to buy a catamaran and we are going to try and buy a cat in the next 3 months. I am leaning towards a privilege because they sound like they are built well, and maybe most important to me they are foam cored instead of balsa so I am hoping an older model like a 2002 will still have some good years in it before needing work.
I like the payload,helm position, deck layout, engine access and location, wide bunks, and supossed to be seaworthy.
Not sure sure exactly what the bridgedeck clearance is on 435, 445, 465, 495.Not crazy about the greenhouse effect with the windows. Boat sounds slow and a bit heavy. Not sure cruising speed with motors. Not sure about the nacell. Some say it is fine others say it will pound and I did see a video of a 39 privilege pounding pretty good in bad weather.
I need to sleep 8 and even the 435 privilege will do this in slightly cramped conditions. I have 300000.00 U.S.to spend but can't be spending another 50 thou to get the boat seaworthy and this could be the reason I don't buy a boat. Can afford some boats but maybe not the boats that don't need lots of work. Anyone with more experience than me(not hard) have some good reasons why not a privilege and any better recomendations. Please be brutally honest. Joe
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Old 09-05-2013, 01:02   #2
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re: Privilege?

I have a Privilege 37. I bought this boat to ensure that I had a comfortale cruising boat, thus good at anchor and at sea. The window design does lend itself to thermal transfer, but most (including mine) solve this by use of shade cloth over the windows. It does not stop me looking out, but it stops most of the thermal transfer. It also provides additional privacy during the day.
A side benefit is that the shade cloth significantly reduces UV damage to the acrylic.
These boats are not performance oriented, but if you are doing sort handed long distance cruising I consider this to be a benefit.
There are courses and wave conditions that will cause any multihull to pound.
Additional spend after purchase is not just a factor of boat condition, but also of intended use and how anal you are at preventative maintenance. I will be leaving next year on long term cruising, and am spending a lot of money bringing my boat back to as new condition in order to minimise the risk of major maintenance needs in exotic locations. Other people jump onboard, fill the tanks, raise the sails and they are off - taking the breakdowns as they come.
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Old 09-05-2013, 03:15   #3
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re: Privilege?

A side benefit is that the shade cloth significantly reduces UV damage to the acrylic.
These boats are not performance oriented, but if you are doing sort handed long distance cruising I consider this to be a benefit.
There are courses and wave conditions that will cause any multihull to pound.
Additional spend after purchase is not just a factor of boat condition, but also of intended use and how anal you are at preventative maintenance. I will be leaving next year on long term cruising, and am spending a lot of money bringing my boat back to as new condition in order to minimise the risk of major maintenance needs in exotic locations. Other people jump onboard, fill the tanks, raise the sails and they are off - taking the breakdowns as they come.[/QUOTE]
Thanks for the reply. Yes I think I understand that privileges are not performance oriented but I am hoping the boat will cruise at 7.5 knots under power. What motors do you have and what is your cruise under power. For me the trade off of more space and larger payload is worth some performance loss. I have been on power cats when they pound and one cat under sail in 62 knots of wind. The boat was 60 ft long and had maybe 4 feet of bridgedeck clearance. It pounded very little but flexed a lot . I felt it wouldn't flip but I was unsure whether it would break apart. It didn't of course.
Have you been on other cats your size and how do you find the ride on yours in comparison. Maintenance? I probably fall somewhere in the middle of keeping it new and doing the minimum. My biggest maintenance boat had twin 315 cummins on V drives and a 12.5 yanmar generator. Probably cost me 20 thousand a year to maintain. I expect that a cat with twin 55 horse motors will cost less.What do you think?I have no idea what sails and rigging costs to maintain.
Joe
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Old 09-05-2013, 04:33   #4
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Re: Privilege?

where are you planning on sailing it? full time cruising or just weekend stuff? and needs to sleep 8? Will 8 people live abord full time?
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Old 09-05-2013, 04:39   #5
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Re: Privilege?

43ft Privilege will have different power to my 37. I have just fitted new 3YM30, and changed the pitch of my prop. I have yet to do a trial, but would expect 7+ kts at cruise on both engines.

I do not yet have a feel for average maintenance costs of this boat, and in any case maintenance costs are proportional to the amount of use.
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Old 09-05-2013, 10:09   #6
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Re: Privilege?

What are you including in maintenance that it cost you $20k/yr on the previous boat?

We are on a smaller Gemini but we are on the order of $2-5k/yr depending on what comes up and had similar numbers on a 31' twin engine power boat before that.

Just want make sure we are comparing apples to apples.
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Old 09-05-2013, 14:21   #7
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Re: Privilege?

Quote:
Originally Posted by monte View Post
where are you planning on sailing it? full time cruising or just weekend stuff? and needs to sleep 8? Will 8 people live abord full time?
Home to New Zealand then for the next few years to Tonga and back to New Zealand. My wife and 5 kids ranging from 23 to 7 years. Not living on the boat full time but a month at a time. I also run spearfishing charters now and the boat will need to sleep 6 divers plus 2 crew so 8 total over night. Maybe 2 nights max. My present boat does 30 knots so sleeping over night is not required. New boat will be to slow to day trip.
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Old 09-05-2013, 14:23   #8
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Re: Privilege?

I do not yet have a feel for average maintenance costs of this boat, and in any case maintenance costs are proportional to the amount of use.[/QUOTE]
I would expect you to get 7.5 knots with both engines as well but I really don't know for sure. Will look forward to your report. Joe
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Old 09-05-2013, 14:30   #9
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Re: Privilege?

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Originally Posted by valhalla360 View Post
What are you including in maintenance that it cost you $20k/yr on the previous boat?

We are on a smaller Gemini but we are on the order of $2-5k/yr depending on what comes up and had similar numbers on a 31' twin engine power boat before that..
I was diving the channel islands in California for sea urchins at the time. Ran the boat 80 miles a day 100 days a year. Very hard on gear. 20K was just maintenance. No fuel , slip fees exc.
I am still thinking 20k a year for all costs including slip fee's,insurance, exc for the cat but I am worried that what I can afford to buy may need 100 k to get it where 20k will keep it maintained. I am just not sure about this.
Joe
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Old 09-05-2013, 14:35   #10
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Re: Privilege?

I think you would need a pretty big cat to handle 8 divers with gear, tanks, compressor etc. At least 44 ft
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Old 09-05-2013, 19:15   #11
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Re: Privilege?

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I think you would need a pretty big cat to handle 8 divers with gear, tanks, compressor etc. At least 44 ft
Yes I think 435 privilege is the minimum as well . We don't actually have dive tanks or compressors because all spearfishing for us is freediving but it is still a lot of gear and people on a 44ft boat!
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Old 10-05-2013, 23:30   #12
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Re: Privilege? YES

I have a 1993 P43 (43ft) Privelege originally fitted with 38hp 3jh Yanmars. Typical cruising speed 2500rpm was easily 8 kts, weather dependent. Later changed to 56hp 4JH engines; now cruise at 10kts, max12.5 and 7.5 on only one engine. About the time I added the larger engines, I also increased transoms 4ft which increased bouyancy and decreased squatting at cruising speed in shallow waters. Pounding is virtually non-existent until seas exceed 2 meters and then only on some angles. Sailing to KWST last fall on edge of hurricane Sandy, with 28kt AWS astern, sailed 14.5kts for several hours only on Assym spinnaker. Even I was surprised, because last haul out load scales read 32,000 lbs! This pre-Alliaura hull is bulletproof. Even after 18 years owning, this my "last boat". Obviously, I am highly biased to/for Privileges. They are now being built by original owners again. Feel free to ask me any questions.
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Old 11-05-2013, 01:16   #13
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Re: Privilege? YES

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Originally Posted by emcmia View Post
I have a 1993 P43 (43ft) Privelege originally fitted with 38hp 3jh Yanmars. Typical cruising speed 2500rpm was easily 8 kts, weather dependent. Later changed to 56hp 4JH engines; now cruise at 10kts, max12.5 and 7.5 on only one engine. About the time I added the larger engines, I also increased transoms 4ft which increased bouyancy and decreased squatting at cruising speed in shallow waters. Pounding is virtually non-existent until seas exceed 2 meters and then only on some angles. Sailing to KWST last fall on edge of hurricane Sandy, with 28kt AWS astern, sailed 14.5kts for several hours only on Assym spinnaker. Even I was surprised, because last haul out load scales read 32,000 lbs! This pre-Alliaura hull is bulletproof. Even after 18 years owning, this my "last boat". Obviously, I am highly biased to/for Privileges. They are now being built by original owners again. Feel free to ask me any questions.
Thanks for the reply. Great information! When you went to the bigger engines did you need to lengthen the boat to compensate for the added weight. Did lengthening the boat help with pounding as well? Your speeds are very encouraging. How do you think your hull compares to the 435 and 445.Would you expect to get the same speed with same horsepower in a 435,445.?What are the negatives of your boat? What would you change? Do you have to be careful with weight forward with the nacelle? For you, what are advantages and disadvantages of the nacelle? I think for a while some boats were built in Germany(not sure about this)Do you think there were years privilege boats were not constructed as well as the old boats?
Thanks Joe
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Old 13-05-2013, 08:28   #14
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Re: Privilege?

Joe Burke, the 4 cylinder 4JHE only added about 25kg per engine. The hull extensions were part of a longer term plan unrelated to the engine upgrade. I added the additional length to increase bouyancy (reduce the "porpoising" that sometimes occurs in short choppy seas) and to increase the waterline length. In addition, they provide a much more substantial platform for assembling dive gear and bringing larger fish into the boat. I have only sailed on a later model (2001) 435 and although somewhat lighter, hull speed seemed encumbered on viturally all points of sail. The engine HP increase, hull extensions, boom furling and few others mods have effectively overcome the "negatives". Forward weight has never really been a problem. My stbd forepeak is my saillocker with extra anchor rode and scuba tank storage; port forepeak has extra ground tackle (2 anchors and 200 m of 3/4" rode) plus docking lines, fenders and a 150L holding tank for the forward port head. Even when I'm carrying a Yamaha WaverRunner on the port hull, the stability never appears to be an issue. The centerline nascelle contains my master stateroom (it's a 3-cabin, 3-head boat) and anchor locker and the added rigidity definitely stiffens the forward end and I believe it inceases safety when personnel are forward during heavier seas.

As for German manufacture, I am unaware that any boats have every been built outside of France. Jeantot Marine was the original manufacturer and was aquired by Alliaura during the late 1990s. Alliaura perportedly went under due to their emphasis on bigger cats (75 to 100 ft) during the worldwide recession. I was recently contacted by a group that represents the original Jeantot Marine boat builders and they have re-acquired the molds and have set up shop near their original yard and headquarters and are back in production. As for build quality and craftsmanship, I have always found it better than average/most. To query other Privilege owners, I suggest that you go to http://www.cruisersforum.com, which has boat specific forums. For more specific info and photos, you can contact me at emc-miami at att dot net.
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