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Old 08-07-2008, 14:10   #16
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Originally Posted by Gludy View Post
There are two other St Francis 50's for sale - one a demo 2008 and one a 2004 - they are a fair bit below the price of that one unless he is quoting AUS $.

The St Francis 50 comes in a fair bit less expensive than the FastCat and has a faster delivery schedule.

I am evolving my thoughts:-

In really heavy weather be it a Fast or slower boat the speed will be limited by the weather right down to almost zero with a parachute out. The lighter boat will have less mass to bang against the sea but may be less comfortable. I do not know.

In just heavy weather, you would again limit the top speed, to say 10 to 14 knots, so probably there is little in it between boats.

Its in winds below 20 knots that the faster boat should show its paces - so really a fast boat is all about how well it performs in light air 0 in all other cases speed does not matter...... do I have that right?
90 % of the sailing time is in winds below 25 knots so being able to sail well in these light wind conditions is important. That is one of the things that bothered me most on heavy cats. the speed with winds of lets say up to 15 knots is almost non exhistend a heavy boat will only start to perform reasonably well from 20 knots up and with well I mean having a speed of 9 knots plus.
Why would anybody want a low speed with 10 to 20 knots of wind ?
I cannot imagine.
The average catamaran that I have seen around will motor up to 10 / 15 knots and only then will they lift their sails, what a waist for a sail boat. I think if that is the idea one better sticks with a powerboat since fuel will be used .

My 2 cents worth
Greetings

p.s. the St Francis I am selling costs Euro 500.000 ex vat with at least 200.000 worth of options and it can be delivered in one month
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Old 08-07-2008, 14:29   #17
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Good then I seem to have that right- let us say winds below 25 knots is what it is about. Above that my concern would not be about speed but slamming.

So what do you say about being tied to a parachute doing 1 knot - is the heavier boat more or less comfortable?

The lighter boat at half almost half the weight must have almost half the energy within it to hit the sea with ..... so according to the lecture on the MaxingOut site the implication must be that a light boat - providing it is strong enough, is better at riding out a storm because it contains less energy, in fact proportionally less energy so half the weight is half the energy for a given speed ..... or is it that its very difficult to slow down a light cat? Comments on that logic (or lack of it) are welcome.
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Old 08-07-2008, 16:13   #18
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Relying to myself now - its getting bad



A cork floating in a stormy sea will not suffer because it is so light but it does get tossed about a lot - so maybe in a heavy sea there is safety at one end with comfort at the other side of the scale?
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Old 09-07-2008, 07:47   #19
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LMAO! I think some manufacturers have that info!!

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Obtaining that info on a test sail will require a very understanding owner...
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Old 10-07-2008, 02:17   #20
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Gludy View Post


A cork floating in a stormy sea will not suffer because it is so light but it does get tossed about a lot - so maybe in a heavy sea there is safety at one end with comfort at the other side of the scale?
I wished I could built our cats as light as cork but unfortunately I will never achieve that
Being able to produce a cat that is roughly half the weight of an average cruising and create a payload that is on average double has not been an easy accomplishment .
What it did however is making sailing even with 8 knots of wind a pleasure and gives no reason to start the motors and making speeds of 20 knots plus possible gives me a great feeling.

Different boats for different folks

Greetings

Gideon
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Old 10-07-2008, 03:47   #21
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But my question is still not answered.

The lighter boat must have less inertia, to beat against the seas in heavy weather and that would lead to a safer boat? I think it would.

On the other hand a light boat, although safer may get tossed around a lot more and therefore be less comfortable?

So is there a balance whereby increased weight can lead to a more comfortable ride?

When the speed is zero then the kinetic energy contained in a heavy or light boat is the same zero but the inertia of the heavier boat is still greater and this may mean that the heavier boat gets tossed about less?

I have not settled this in my mind as yet and would appreciate some comments.
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Old 10-07-2008, 04:42   #22
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Weight can be good in that it gives you a soft ride, lightness can be good in that it gives you speed but these are generalities. We weigh 65k lbs but easily sail 10 knots in 10 knots of breeze but it requires a bit of waterline and rig to do it.

Somehere in between a Nordhaven Trawler and a Reggie Fountain speed boat is what you are looking for. Which way you tip is a personal preference. All you can do is sail a bunch of boats and decide what is best for you. Sail the boats you like in a variety of conditions (i.e. demand to go sailing when the rigging whistles, the waves are up, and the period is short). You'll know what you like then.

Clear as mud?

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Originally Posted by Gludy View Post
But my question is still not answered.

The lighter boat must have less inertia, to beat against the seas in heavy weather and that would lead to a safer boat? I think it would.

On the other hand a light boat, although safer may get tossed around a lot more and therefore be less comfortable?

So is there a balance whereby increased weight can lead to a more comfortable ride?

When the speed is zero then the kinetic energy contained in a heavy or light boat is the same zero but the inertia of the heavier boat is still greater and this may mean that the heavier boat gets tossed about less?

I have not settled this in my mind as yet and would appreciate some comments.
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Old 10-07-2008, 08:15   #23
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glossy magazine boat reviews are mostly fluff but for what it's worth, Cruising World voted the SF 50 catamaran of the year in 2006.
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Old 10-07-2008, 09:03   #24
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"Clear as mud?"
Yes as clear as mud

I am going to try the boats out anyway - I am just trying to figure out what I want in theory first. That way I can now what features to look for...
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Old 10-07-2008, 19:25   #25
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Welcome to St Francis Marine | Specifications

They even give bridgedeck clearance, for a change. 2'8". A tad low, but not 'an obviously bad idea' low.

Not fast, though, with a hull beam I would estimate at a bit over 6' wide at the DWL, for a DWL/Beam ratio of @ 7.5, and using their displacement, which doesn't specify light or loaded, a D/L ratio of 118, and a SA/D ratio of 27 with the full genny. An unspecified displacement is usually quite a bit lighter than an actual loaded-for-cruising displacement.
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