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Old 29-10-2013, 19:39   #31
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Re: New cat made in china

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Originally Posted by Gpolar View Post
FarnovaYachts Ltd. 法诺游艇

Saw one in boat show. Much cheaper than lagoon. But quality ! Some details scares me.
Hi Gpolar,
Could you expand on "Some details scares me" please?
I'm not sure what you mean.
re. location of factories:
Labour costs aren't always the deciding factor in the total cost of production, real estate costs, the costs of building the facilities, providing raw materials and importing those items that can't be supplied locally usually amount to much more.
Gunboat imported highly skilled craftsmen from NZ, the transplanted Hakes Marine team. Build Team
and Hudson Yachts seem to have a quality line up of brands and expertise:
HUDSON YACHT & MARINE.
I've also not heard of Farnova Yachts before but it is grossly unfair of anyone to assume that soley because a company manufactures in China the quality must be low.
I hope they [and any others] succeed in introducing a viable more affordable, well built alternative to the established European cat. manufacturers, only time and the standard of quality control will tell.
Cheers,
Mac
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Old 29-10-2013, 22:47   #32
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Re: New cat made in china

And these were on structural watertight's not on furniture panelling? Strange way to do things if on a fair dinkum bulkhead!

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Old 29-10-2013, 23:29   #33
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Re: New cat made in china

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I agree. Having just returned from China, I believe that they can manufacture (copy?) ANYTHING to ANY quality level.
Having been a Toolmaker and Engineer for over 35 years, I have yet to see anything from China on a high quality level. Let alone anything unique.

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Hard to beat that buck an hour wage in China however
Yes hard to compete with sweat shops where children are kept out of school to hone the bottom line, so we can have our toys.
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Old 29-10-2013, 23:59   #34
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Having been a Toolmaker and Engineer for over 35 years, I have yet to see anything from China on a high quality level. Let alone anything unique.
A significant high portion of electronics we use come from China. Most people would say they're pretty good quality.

Its not that they cannot produce good quality, it's that there are significant number of smaller shops that won't produce good quality if they're not supervised.
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Old 30-10-2013, 00:21   #35
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Re: New cat made in china

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Originally Posted by Celestialsailor View Post
Having been a Toolmaker and Engineer for over 35 years, I have yet to see anything from China on a high quality level. Let alone anything unique.


Yes hard to compete with sweat shops where children are kept out of school to hone the bottom line, so we can have our toys.
I think it really depends on what your looking at, the LiFeYPo4 batteries coming out of China are world leaders in manufacture.

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Old 30-10-2013, 04:27   #36
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Re: New cat made in china

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Yes hard to compete with sweat shops where children are kept out of school to hone the bottom line, so we can have our toys.
I don't wish to appear as an apologist for things Chinese, and I'm sure there are plenty of sweat shops. However, I'll insist that the Chinese can make excellent quality products, iPhones and a friend's CHINESE manufactured Audi A6 come to mind.

They seem to be doing an excellent job at educating their masses as well. I doubt many Chinese kids miss out on school. The Chinese technical and higher education system is improving in leaps and bounds, whereas the Australian system (ie. TAFE) is cutting costs, quality and opportunities for our kids.

I know which country will be the next global "top dog", if it isn't there already.
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Old 30-10-2013, 04:34   #37
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Re: New cat made in china

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Originally Posted by Gpolar View Post
FarnovaYachts Ltd. 法诺游艇

Saw one in boat show. Much cheaper than lagoon. But quality ! Some details scares me.
What boat show ? I am sure Nathan Stanton the designer could answer any questions.

FreeFlow Catamarans
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Old 30-10-2013, 05:03   #38
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Originally Posted by Wraith_Mac View Post

Hi Gpolar,
Could you expand on "Some details scares me" please?
I'm not sure what you mean.
re. location of factories:
Labour costs aren't always the deciding factor in the total cost of production, real estate costs, the costs of building the facilities, providing raw materials and importing those items that can't be supplied locally usually amount to much more.
Gunboat imported highly skilled craftsmen from NZ, the transplanted Hakes Marine team. Build Team
and Hudson Yachts seem to have a quality line up of brands and expertise:
HUDSON YACHT & MARINE.
I've also not heard of Farnova Yachts before but it is grossly unfair of anyone to assume that soley because a company manufactures in China the quality must be low.
I hope they [and any others] succeed in introducing a viable more affordable, well built alternative to the established European cat. manufacturers, only time and the standard of quality control will tell.
Cheers,
Mac
I believe a lot of chinese made product are good after it have been doing it for while. With a outside team supervision。

The boat look perfect from the outside.

But when i open one of the cabinete . The inside is like totally not sanded or finish. Just have white paint. I can't imagine how the inside hull look like. And things you cannot see.

The window is english brand.

And i ask the salelady. Where is the mast made. She cannot answer me.

If one is very experienced with building boat and can go to factory everyday. And sometime spot check at night. I cannot trust my life on it.

And the factory owner did not look nice.

Gpolar
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Old 30-10-2013, 05:12   #39
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I was always want to buy a cat made in china
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Old 30-10-2013, 06:34   #40
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Re: New cat made in china

Having just viewed there site ( FreeFlow Catamarans), the vessel did not appear to be built in China. The quality "appeared" to be very good from the pictures.
Those of us "senior citizens" remember the "quality" of every thing that came out of Japan in the early 1950's. With the demands of higher quality products, as they say, "look at them now". China too will reach that point. Time frame? It's happening daily.

I like the Free Flow design. With everything, we all would make a personal change or two but still a nice cruiser....
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Old 30-10-2013, 07:02   #41
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Re: New cat made in china

Very nice looking boat, much nicer lines to my eyes that Lagoons.
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Old 30-10-2013, 07:04   #42
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Re. The web page; contact me page doesn't work.


Pictures are only thumbnails


Tooling up, but where?


It's all very vague.

Dan
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Old 30-10-2013, 07:23   #43
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Re: New cat made in china

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Originally Posted by Gpolar View Post
FarnovaYachts Ltd. 法诺游艇

Saw one in boat show. Much cheaper than lagoon. But quality ! Some details scares me.
Coming soon to a Walmart near you?
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Old 30-10-2013, 07:31   #44
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Re: New cat made in china

Quote:
Originally Posted by fjwiley1 View Post
Having just viewed there site ( FreeFlow Catamarans), the vessel did not appear to be built in China. The quality "appeared" to be very good from the pictures.
Those of us "senior citizens" remember the "quality" of every thing that came out of Japan in the early 1950's. With the demands of higher quality products, as they say, "look at them now". China too will reach that point. Time frame? It's happening daily.

I like the Free Flow design. With everything, we all would make a personal change or two but still a nice cruiser....
The boat on the FreeFlow site was built in Australia (Between Brisbane and Gold Coast), by the designers and his team. And the quality of that boat was quite stunning
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Old 30-10-2013, 14:56   #45
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Re: New cat made in china

Make no mistake, good sailboats can be built in China. Consider the FT (Flying Tiger) 10. The FT 10 was desgined by Bob Perry and produced in China by a company headed up by Bill Stevens, an experienced builder who was also from the US west coast. While there were some understandable, but minor teething problems in the first 10 or so boats built, the company has gone on to develp a solid reputation. The boats are high performance and relatively high-tech with carbon fibre rigs ( including a carbon fibre telescoping sprit) and high tech sails, plus name-brand hardware. Used ones are now typically selling above the original pre-production introductory price of $39,995.00 with sails and the fleet has grown to over 100 boats worldwide.

Yes, the original purchasers took a risk. However, the reputation of those involved with the project (as well as the time spent by them in China starting up and refining the production process) gave some comfort about the eventual product. I, for one, would consider purchasing a Chinese produced boat if:
1. I knew and trusted the designer and builder, based upon their past experience in their relative fields.
2. They were taking a hands-on approach with respect to the production of the boats.
3. The running and standing rigging and hardware were all name-brand.
4. The boats had been in production for about a year and there had been an opportunity to get back reports from current owners (and if the company would not provide contact information, I would look elsewhere).
5. The price was markedly less than a comparable boat produced elsewhere (the Flying Tiger aside, you are likely safe to assume that depreciation will be greater on a relatively unknown Chinese-built boat than on a better-known production boat from France, South Africa, the USA etc.).

Brad
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