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Old 19-09-2015, 08:08   #1
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Negotiating Price On a New Cat

Sorry if this is a dumb question, but I just never thought of it before.

Can, and DO people negotiate a price on a new catamaran? I know going to the boat shows, they always have 'deals'.. but some of their "deals" are still overpriced in my estimation, especially considering depreciation.

I've ALWAYS negotiated price on new cars when buying them... So, is it the same with Cats? will the manufacturers budge on their prices?
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Old 19-09-2015, 08:12   #2
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Negotiating Price On a New Cat

Have you ever paid asking price for such a big ticket item?

Now for full disclosure I've never bought a new boat, but wouldn't pay asking price for anything big.


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Old 19-09-2015, 08:34   #3
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Re: Negotiating Price On a New Cat

So, how would you figure out what a reasonable price would be to offer? I mean, you gotta figure they are making HUNDREDS of thousands of dollars of profit.. But how do you find an offer that is reasonable?
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Old 19-09-2015, 08:44   #4
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Re: Negotiating Price On a New Cat

At the dealer/broker level, new boat profits are typically made in the add on equipment (sails, electronics, etc) and services. The mark ups are nowhere close to what the public buyer may think. Unlike auto dealers who typically get factory money to push crtain models, yacht dealers rarely get this kind of help. Even a $500,000 boat does not have anything close to 'hundreds of thousands of profit" to the dealer. Factory/builder direct negotiations at a show may have greater leeway than a local dealer but again hundreds of thousands are a non-starter.
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Old 19-09-2015, 09:13   #5
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Re: Negotiating Price On a New Cat

Average dealer commission is around 15%. Take out cost of doing business for the dealer and his break even price is around 8%. Obviously he won't sell at a break even price so figure the maximum discount to be around 5%. Larger manufacturers usually have several types of special deals. One is a 2% discount on boats in stock, which are only boats that have gone into production for an order that has since fallen through. Another is boat show specials, where they will usually include some items such as dinghy set, pack upgrades etc totalling around 2%, as well as factory discounts up to 2%. Expecting a saving of around 4% if ordering during a boat show isn't unreasonable.
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Old 19-09-2015, 09:18   #6
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Re: Negotiating Price On a New Cat

Surely he meant hundreds OR thousands of dollars?
If I had to guess and it would only be a guess, I doubt there is much more than 10% profit, but like most anything this big it's floorplanned, meaning it cost them money to sit there un sold, they are better off selling it fast. You can't use automobiles as an example as that game is very well played. In fact a dealer can sell an automobile for less than they paid for it, as the manufacturer will give them various incentives to sell, that of course off sets the price the Dealer paid. It's a game remember.
Problem I have is they are Pro's at this, it's their game field, they write the rules and are the referee, while I'm only a novice at best. Now just myself as I have gotten older, I find myself not buying new nearly as much anymore, seems the depreciation in the first few years is huge.
Course there is nothing like new


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Old 19-09-2015, 09:31   #7
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Re: Negotiating Price On a New Cat

If you don't ask for a discount, you won't get one.

If I was looking at new, I would probably knock 20% off and see how they respond. No they probably won't give you 20% off but it puts the ball back in thier court to make a counter offer.

Of course I'm assuming you are willing to take existing stock. The more customization you want, the less likely they are to negotiate. On the other hand if they have a boat sitting there, they may be willing to make a deal. Maybe it's last years model but never sold. Or they may hold firm on the price but will give you some extras.

Can't say where they will come out on the exact percentage. Back in 2008, you might have got the 20% off as there were a lot of manufacturers desperate for cash flow. It's a bit better now so probably less likely.
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Old 19-09-2015, 10:01   #8
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Re: Negotiating Price On a New Cat

Quote:
Originally Posted by scarlet View Post
So, how would you figure out what a reasonable price would be to offer? I mean, you gotta figure they are making HUNDREDS of thousands of dollars of profit.. But how do you find an offer that is reasonable?
Seriously ?

Do the work to see if this is true. Pick a boat, lets say a Magical xyz. It uses e.g. an Allyacht Spars rig, price that up, it uses 10 harken winches , etc etc etc. Then add labour. Seriously - hundreds of thousands ?
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Old 19-09-2015, 10:15   #9
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Re: Negotiating Price On a New Cat

If you decide to buy a new boat that has a production waiting time of more than a couple of months then you are competing with the other buyers who have already sealed a deal. If you expect to get a discount of more than the boat show specials you need to be looking at boats that are already in stock or unsold boats at a boat show.

Look at it from the builders perspective; why would they discount a boat price for you when they are already selling them as fast as they can build them?

The European boats are selling fast in the States because the dollar is relatively strong against the Euro right now.
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Old 19-09-2015, 10:53   #10
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Re: Negotiating Price On a New Cat

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Originally Posted by Factor View Post
Seriously ?

Do the work to see if this is true. Pick a boat, lets say a Magical xyz. It uses e.g. an Allyacht Spars rig, price that up, it uses 10 harken winches , etc etc etc. Then add labour. Seriously - hundreds of thousands ?
Sorry.. it was an intentional exaggeration..
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Old 19-09-2015, 10:55   #11
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Re: Negotiating Price On a New Cat

But is it really a sellers market? When did that change?


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Old 19-09-2015, 16:49   #12
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Re: Negotiating Price On a New Cat

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Originally Posted by Factor View Post
Seriously ?

Do the work to see if this is true. Pick a boat, lets say a Magical xyz. It uses e.g. an Allyacht Spars rig, price that up, it uses 10 harken winches , etc.
Pricing up your potential new boat based on the asking price for its individual components is not a true indication of manufacturer's cost.

Seriously? I have just paid the list price for some Yanmar parts. One nut for A$74 and three copper washers for A$111. Using the "Factor calculation" my boat's engines alone would be worth several million dollars!

Go with Monte's advice.
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Old 19-09-2015, 18:43   #13
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Re: Negotiating Price On a New Cat

My point was that there is a bottom line component cost for any boat. An AYS rig is an AYS rig is an AYS rig. A manufacturer will not sell a boat for less than the cost of the bits.

A manufacturer will not sell a boat and do so at a loss.
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Old 20-09-2015, 01:40   #14
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Re: Negotiating Price On a New Cat

I know exactly what the dealer made on my new boat because he sent me the wrong spreadsheet... he left on the commission details from the factory. It was 15% on the boat and 10% on the extras.


Negotiating... Not much chance back then. 9 month waiting list for a launch date on a Privilege but if I wanted to pay MORE I could have bought the boat another agent had bought for stock that would be delivered earlier. Of course this was a while back and I don't know what it is like these days.
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Old 20-09-2015, 08:27   #15
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Re: Negotiating Price On a New Cat

Quote:
Originally Posted by valhalla360 View Post

If I was looking at new, I would probably knock 20% off and see how they respond. No they probably won't give you 20% off but it puts the ball back in thier court to make a counter offer.
Pushing Builders down by 20% may deliver no any answer at all as Builders will take it clear that Buyer does not understand things.

There is a little chance to have Dealers respond that they could negotiate boat specs to meet Buyers budget.
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