My "post mortem" from the Miami Boat Show

[roetter]

Originally Posted by scarlet

... Or, for me.. a washing machine is a deal breaker! but, wow... they are 3 times the price of the "top of the line" one I have at home.. OUTRAGEOUS! !!!

We bought an LG washing machine at Best Buy and installed it ourselves. Great machine. It is on a L450.

[Cheechako]

I LOVE the front cockpit!
So... what did you like about it? I could be wrong but it seems to me to be one of those wierd ideas that is doomed to be an "albatross" after a few years.
Does it provide weather protection? sun protection? or just look good for parties at the dock? I havent seen one in the flesh, but... just seems wierd to me. Maybe if I saw it I would love it...

[Cuttyhunk]

Originally Posted by scarlet

Yup! that's how he did it.. Skiing!! he works really hard at rehabilitation.. but, he will never be 100% anymore.. But, I think that being on a boat will really strengthen his leg...

I've had a bum knee my whole life. Due to evil winter where I live, I am sailing only half the year. My knee hurts like heck the first month or so, then is great the rest of the season and about two months after the boat is put away. I've noticed this for years. Because there is always a handhold, I I can do more with the knee than I can on land...ironically, I am much less afraid of falling when I am on the boat. I've owned mono, tri , and cat, and all of them have helped my knee strength.

[Newcatcruisers]

...bones is my business!!! Own a clinic here in NZ..team sees 1200 people p/week dealing with simple to complex

some simple advice...post 50 get a bone desity scan(dexa)..specially women post menopause. Follow up scan will show relative changes and more valuable. Strong bones less likely to break regardless of sport. 75% morbidity rate within 2 years in 70s following break of femur....ie 3 out of 4 die after 2 years(!!)...main culprit osteoporosis.

Best thing for bones....weight bearing...standing/walking on rocking boat ideal, for core strength too. For joints, daily leg work(squats,step ups/lunges)..easy on boat. Spent yesterday taking wife on train trip up to the mountains for 50th birthday. Met an ex elite runner (olympic level) 60 and in incredible shape....works legs hard,walks hills and sprints. Inspirational. Diet ?? high protein/cacium/omega 3s.....can of sardines a day keeps the doc away...

Cardiovascular...train in circuits. On boat can use bands/free weights. Ie push ups,squats,abs.... Only need 20/30 mins 3 times pweek. KISS.

Limited calories usually on boat,water instead of soft drinks,ideal to maintain low weight.

All good news for cruisers.

Specifically for knee...keep GLUTES/hams strong not just quads. Bouts of deep massage around the knee cap and behind the knee by the other half will help too...ice at the end of the day on the joint. AVOID taking nsaids if possible. Not good side effects generally and some inhibit cartilage production....

Talking boats. On mine getting on and off difficult with elderly unless able to step straight on to back steps. Need to get a "gate" on SS rails on the side. Think each owner is wise to assess their "blind spots'....easy slip areas,big spaces with no handholds ..sp. in bad weather...pointy bits to jab ribs on etc etc.As you get older and more fragile....just got to think ahead a bit more...and keep going!!!!

Got a couple of gents with hip replacements still Skiing black runs with grandkids!!!!

[JPA Cate]

Hey, Newcatcruisers,

Great stuff! I love the couple of gents you know who are skiing the black diamonds with their grandkids, good on 'em!

I owe my presence on my boat to the skill of the revision surgeon who fixed my bilateral knee replacements with new inserts last Sept....and my 6 months work at the gym beforehand, plus losing 15 kilos.

Ann

[Newcatcruisers]

Go Ann! However good the surgeon...the end result is in the hands of the patient . Im sure you will encourage many. Over the years i have been constantly amazed by my patients. It confounds me that one will take the "docs"advise and stop playing bowls due to knee replacements....and others will decide to roam the seas in a boat with the same! Whats your routine?

Anther gent that would inspire is "PoP" Survived a bullet in the skull at Monte Cassino...strapped his helmet over his guts...didnt want a slow death!!!!! Had bilateral knees done in his late seventies. Shortly after cycled from Dunedin to Wanaka..over 200ks of hills!!! Still hunts for deer and fishes. Final say will be in the hands of the bloke upstairs. Till then he is going for it!

Your losing 15kgs and hard work the key to recovery, Well done.

Liked your earlier insight into sarcasm. Enjoyed the forum...xcept for when threads stray into the"dark side" No need for it.

[scarlet]

Originally Posted by Cheechako

I LOVE the front cockpit!
So... what did you like about it? I could be wrong but it seems to me to be one of those wierd ideas that is doomed to be an "albatross" after a few years.
Does it provide weather protection? sun protection? or just look good for parties at the dock? I havent seen one in the flesh, but... just seems wierd to me. Maybe if I saw it I would love it...

Well... there were several things we loved about it.. first off.. it had direct access from the salon via a door. (with a raise threshold)... it had a drain in it, for run off. those two things make it PERFECT for a "poop deck'.. sorry.. I have three little dogs, and having a safe place for them to go is important to me.

It is covered for sun protection... it is sunken into the hull a bit... so you aren't sitting real high... it, of course has nice seating, and pop up tables. All these things make it a perfect "second place" to go outside. Probably doesn't mean much to most people.. but for "soon to be" full time live-aboards.. having a second place to be outside.. away from each other when we need space.. is really a plus...

that being said... I hadn't thought of what it might do to the sailing aspect of the boat... it certainly may affect the speed.. not sure.. would probably need to take it out and see how it performs...

Anyone having any experience with that?

[mgstich]

Hi Scarlet,

I have read most of this thread, but jumped ahead a few pages when it went in odd directions.

I thought I would share with you my thoughts since I am a neophyte sailor.... I took the ASA courses you plan to take and learned a ton! I tried to study ahead in the books and found the terminology confusing and a bit unclear until I was able to get on a boat and actually use/see/touch the lines etc I was trying to learn.

I have been to two boat shows now and love going. However, they are a bit dangerous as my DH and I ended up buying a cat after attending the boat show! The purchase has been an excellent decision for us and we have our boat in charter in the BVIs since we can only use it about 4 times a year.

I also wanted to tell you that IMHO, sailing is not rocket science - even though "sail-speak" sounds that way sometimes! One of the best things about owning our own boat now, while I'm not very experienced, is that I can go out and actually sail without having the resume I would need to charter a boat on my own. (I actually took a girls trip in October!)

The long and short of this post is, you sound like a reasonable person who is studying and doing all you can to learn. Enjoy the ASA classes and find a way to get out and sail. I found that after the courses, I knew more than I gave myself credit for knowing and I can manage to sail and make good choices.

Those choices include having great respect for mother nature and the sea, but also having confidence in my own ability to make good decisions, even if that decision is to NOT sail in certain conditions. I certainly wouldn't earn any "Excellent Sailor" awards, but I am learning and having fun doing it.

Have a great time learning about sailing and boats and what is best for you and your husband. I look forward to hearing your thoughts as you move forward.

Personally, I can't wait until we can spend more time out cruising.

mg

[scarlet]

Originally Posted by mgstich

Hi Scarlet,

I have read most of this thread, but jumped ahead a few pages when it went in odd directions.

I thought I would share with you my thoughts since I am a neophyte sailor.... I took the ASA courses you plan to take and learned a ton! I tried to study ahead in the books and found the terminology confusing and a bit unclear until I was able to get on a boat and actually use/see/touch the lines etc I was trying to learn.

I have been to two boat shows now and love going. However, they are a bit dangerous as my DH and I ended up buying a cat after attending the boat show! The purchase has been an excellent decision for us and we have our boat in charter in the BVIs since we can only use it about 4 times a year.

I also wanted to tell you that IMHO, sailing is not rocket science - even though "sail-speak" sounds that way sometimes! One of the best things about owning our own boat now, while I'm not very experienced, is that I can go out and actually sail without having the resume I would need to charter a boat on my own. (I actually took a girls trip in October!)

The long and short of this post is, you sound like a reasonable person who is studying and doing all you can to learn. Enjoy the ASA classes and find a way to get out and sail. I found that after the courses, I knew more than I gave myself credit for knowing and I can manage to sail and make good choices.

Those choices include having great respect for mother nature and the sea, but also having confidence in my own ability to make good decisions, even if that decision is to NOT sail in certain conditions. I certainly wouldn't earn any "Excellent Sailor" awards, but I am learning and having fun doing it.

Have a great time learning about sailing and boats and what is best for you and your husband. I look forward to hearing your thoughts as you move forward.

Personally, I can't wait until we can spend more time out cruising.

mg

..

.... I am SOOO glad you wrote that. especially since you are a relative newby.. AND a woman. My whole life, I have let fear keep my from doing the things I really dreamed of doing. And, due to a host of back to back tragedies in my family... I realized I have to stop doing that.. face my fears... and insist on LIVING.

That being said.. I am scared. Can I do it? am I smart enough to be able to learn this new "language" of sailing? Can I do it physically? What about bad weather? what if something happens to my husband, and I need to get us to safety.. alone? Am I biting off more than I can chew?

It is sooo good to hear that someone else, similar to me.. has done just that. if you can do it.. I can too!

btw... I'd love to hear more about your sailing class. You can PM me if you want to take it "off line"... I'd just like to hear about your experience, and maybe ask some questions..

[Teknav]

Hiya Scarlet! Fear of the unknown is our worst enemy. That's why we read, study and hands-on practice to minimize our fear.

Medically speaking...If you are not going to cross the seven seas, medical emergencies can be serviced in a short period of time just about anywhere you're sailing coastally. Your family physician should be able to highlight your limitations on handling a medical emergency at sea.

In the middle of the ocean, medical emergencies are a totally different ball-game. You can call up on foreign Coast Guard, cruise ships, cargo ships with medics and fellow cruisers nearby who might be medics. (I performed a few minor surgeries while at sea; pharmacy background. Iodine solution is your best defense against external infections while at sea.) Have fun!

Mauritz

[mcerdos]

Good luck with your search for a boat. Just as an FYI we found the Catamaran Company to be very misleading and somewhat pushy during our search for a boat.

We opted for a mono-hull just because we both got seasick for the first time on a cat due to the unique motion. I personally liked the Lagoon models but didn't like the idea of the fly bridge. That is a long way to go to get to the helm quickly.

[roetter]

Originally Posted by mcerdos

Good luck with your search for a boat. Just as an FYI we found the Catamaran Company to be very misleading and somewhat pushy during our search for a boat. We opted for a mono-hull just because we both got seasick for the first time on a cat due to the unique motion. I personally liked the Lagoon models but didn't like the idea of the fly bridge. That is a long way to go to get to the helm quickly.

My wife and I sail mostly alone on a Lagoon 450. The view from the fly bridge is the best seat in the house. Unless the weather is really crappy, we are both always on the fly bridge because we love it there. When the weather is really bad or during long overnight passages we operate the boat from the inside. We installed a second autopilot control at the nav station and in bad weather we are well reefed and the sails do not need attention. I always have a preventer on the main, unless we are really close hauled. The time we have to spend inside is far less than 1%. We are now sailing in the Bahamas.

[mcerdos]

Originally Posted by roetter

My wife and I sail mostly alone on a Lagoon 450. The view from the fly bridge is the best seat in the house. Unless the weather is really crappy, we are both always on the fly bridge because we love it there. When the weather is really bad or during long overnight passages we operate the boat from the inside. We installed a second autopilot control at the nav station and in bad weather we are well reefed and the sails do not need attention. I always have a preventer on the main, unless we are really close hauled. The time we have to spend inside is far less than 1%. We are now sailing in the Bahamas.

I am glad you enjoy the view from the fly bridge. While that may work for you, I have sailed enough to know that set up would not be suitable for my needs. I prefer a helm station easier to reach and in close proximity to the rest of the boat. I also prefer not to leave the safety of the cockpit when at sea. And, I do not like to climb (unharnessed) to a fly bridge. Have you rigged a jack line to allow access to the fly bridge in rough seas? I could certainly understand you viewpoint while in the Bahamas but I do not see this as a viable option while in rough seas mid ocean at night. Just my 2 cents.

[BandB]

Originally Posted by Newcatcruisers

...bones is my business!!! Own a clinic here in NZ..team sees 1200 people p/week dealing with simple to complex

some simple advice...post 50 get a bone desity scan(dexa)..specially women post menopause. Follow up scan will show relative changes and more valuable. Strong bones less likely to break regardless of sport. 75% morbidity rate within 2 years in 70s following break of femur....ie 3 out of 4 die after 2 years(!!)...main culprit osteoporosis.

Best thing for bones....weight bearing...standing/walking on rocking boat ideal, for core strength too. For joints, daily leg work(squats,step ups/lunges)..easy on boat. Spent yesterday taking wife on train trip up to the mountains for 50th birthday. Met an ex elite runner (olympic level) 60 and in incredible shape....works legs hard,walks hills and sprints. Inspirational. Diet ?? high protein/cacium/omega 3s.....can of sardines a day keeps the doc away...

Cardiovascular...train in circuits. On boat can use bands/free weights. Ie push ups,squats,abs.... Only need 20/30 mins 3 times pweek. KISS.

Limited calories usually on boat,water instead of soft drinks,ideal to maintain low weight.

All good news for cruisers.

Specifically for knee...keep GLUTES/hams strong not just quads. Bouts of deep massage around the knee cap and behind the knee by the other half will help too...ice at the end of the day on the joint. AVOID taking nsaids if possible. Not good side effects generally and some inhibit cartilage production....

Talking boats. On mine getting on and off difficult with elderly unless able to step straight on to back steps. Need to get a "gate" on SS rails on the side. Think each owner is wise to assess their "blind spots'....easy slip areas,big spaces with no handholds ..sp. in bad weather...pointy bits to jab ribs on etc etc.As you get older and more fragile....just got to think ahead a bit more...and keep going!!!!

Got a couple of gents with hip replacements still Skiing black runs with grandkids!!!!

We're still relatively young but we've talked to various professionals such as yourself and believe we follow a program that helps our current fitness and will be good for our future. Now some aspects are personally tailored to our likes but any good program should be. Now this is just what we do and not a recommendation to others. In fact, our recommendation is work out what works best for you.

We believe in balanced and variable forms of exercise, not overtaxing any part of your body but keeping it all fit. We aren't sailors, so don't get that, but we do walk around and remain active when cruising. Sitting in one place and one position just is bad. Even when we worked we would make a point to get up from our desks and move around. We swim both at home and when cruising. We walk a lot. We walk beaches. We walk to explore small towns. We are very particular about our walking shoes to make sure we're well supported and cushioned. If we're on a long cruise we will actually walk some "laps" on the boat even if just back and forth. Any kind of movement. Also while cruising extended times we find hotels attached to marinas which have workout rooms and for minimum costs or even free we use some of their equipment. We carry tennis rackets and basketballs with us and play both tennis and basketball when we get a chance. Most every place you go has courts somewhere. A couple of things we don't do too. We don't jog on pavement. In our opinion, too much pounding on joints. We don't use free weights nor do we try to see how much we can do with other weights but we just use lighter weights and repetitions. No pulled muscles from weights which then stop all training for a while.

One other thing we do that helps us and may surprise people. We sing a lot. We'll spend hours singing together. We breathe deep from our diaphragm when singing and as a result have those same habits the rest of the time. So when we can outlast others on a tennis court, it's not magic, it's what we've built up through singing and learning to breathe correctly all the time.

We don't do a lot of formal, official type exercise, no rigorous gym professional trainer, work your butt off. But we are active and do it in very balanced ways and ways that strengthen muscles but don't overload them.

We get plenty of sleep. Don't ever underestimate that and don't think for a moment you're the person who doesn't need much. Sleep allows your body to replenish itself plus it gives you the energy to do the other things. Lack of sleep and mid afternoon you'll sit instead of move. We get plenty of sleep so then if we cruise and arrive at a location at 2 or 3, we're ready to get out and go things.

As to diet, we don't do anything extreme. But we do certain things that seem minor but we think help us. First, we do weigh daily and if we see a change we quickly adjust the next few days. The best way to control weight is not to let it build. 3 pounds is easy to lose. 30 is hard. 100 is extremely difficult. A couple of things we do. Neither of us has had a soda in over ten years. We don't drink coffee or tea, maybe once a year we might. We don't drink beer. As to other alcoholic beverages we drink them occasionally but not nightly. We may have champagne every couple of weeks. We may have mixed drinks every two or three weeks, normally two. We don't eat french fries or potato chips. Again, neither of us has had a french fry or potato chip in over ten years. If we need the chip feel we go for celery or carrots. We do eat baked potatoes occasionally and mashed potatoes a little less frequently so it's not no potatoes at all.

We look at sugars and salts. We love fruits but we can't eat them daily. The sugar intake impacts us both with weight and hunger, carb craving. As to breads. We never eat bread just as part of a daily meal. We only eat it on special meals at home or when a special meal in a restaurant. We're not big sandwich eaters either. In fact, we often grill hamburgers and hot dogs and eat them without the buns.

Now before you think we deprive ourselves, we do eat chocolate, we do eat ice cream, we do eat desserts. But we've made trade-offs. A simple example. Bread with dinner or a piece of chocolate cake an hour later. We pick the cake. May sound bad to some. But by going without a few things we feel comfortable eating others. Just not drinking soda or beer, not consuming alcohol daily, not eating french fries, we help ourselves a lot. And remaining active.

Also, if there is any ache or pain we respect it. Your body is speaking to you. Your knee hurts a little, don't just pretend it doesn't and ignore it. Respect it. Allow it to recover from whatever you did to it the day before. Cruising can lead to odd positions and twists and turns and I'm sure sailing more so. Massages. Both professional and ourselves. We've learned to massage and not just sensual or sexual massages, but those to relieve some pressures and pain. And we'll treat ourselves to professional massages sometimes, especially after several weeks on the boat. But one of us wakes up with a little neck or back pain and the other massages them. We also use warm baths and jacuzzi's to relieve that type of minor discomfort. To us swimming is a miracle drug.

What he said about NSAID's. Oh yes. They can cause all sorts of problems. Really tough on your kidneys. Any idea how many people go to ER in a year with Tylenol overdose? Lots. If your head hurts there is a reason. Figure out what is going on. Muscles and joints same thing. Let's see. Two Advil or spouse massaging back? I know which I'll take.

To us it's taking a balanced but active approach and not letting anything linger. One thing that makes it so much easier too is we do it together. Partners. Please support your spouses in this way and let them support you. One spouse watching what they eat and the other gobbling away on anything won't work. One exercising and the other sitting in the recliner watching Cops won't work. It's so much easier together.

[Factor]

Originally Posted by cwjohm

Yeah

And you reckon your parents had it toof; my grandparents went to sea in shoebox with a broom for a mast, a bedsheet for a main, and a pillowcase for a jib, and a only a store of beets to eat all across the Pacific, and they survived and were damned happy about it to.

Apologies to The Four Yorkshireman, Monty Python.

Luxury, we used to dream of shoebox.