MULTIHULL MONOHULL SURVEY

[MarkJ]

Originally Posted by Southern Star

What I don't understand is a monohull owner who chooses to turn some interesting musings about personal preferences into a personal attack on those who prefer multihulls.

Originally Posted by Southern Star

Brad

And visa versa as it often appears that its anti monohul on this forum! So it just goes to show that ALL members can get irritated at these debates. Its the only thing I don't like about CF and I wish the Mods would understand peoples feelings on this subject.

We are all interested in interesting musings about personal preferences But interesting musings need to be understood by writers to be carefully worded to cause no offence

Viva la difference!
Viva peoples own decisions on the type of boat that figures in their dreams and those who are lucky enough to be able to have made them a reality!

As I look across this anchorage there are 13 yachts ('sail boats' to some), pristine white sand, and clear turquoise water in which we are just about to plunge in with our new Noodle Chairs. How sad it would it would be if all those boats were the same!

[Southern Star]

I hear you (and agree that there are also multi-hullers on the site who tend to overstate their case), but that hasn't happened in this thread. Whether or not it has statistical validity, I suspect it was intended to simply ascertain preferences for a next boat if money were no object.

Brad

[Pelagic]

Guys! ……..My “nervous Owners” comment was tongue in cheek meant to poke some fun at the “hullier than thou” multihullers who aggressively say…… we are the best!

I don’t understand it! I love all boats whether they are made from leather or carbon fibre and I did preface my statement by saying that personal preferences on boats were hard to compare because of so many variation in priorities.

I did not say anything about the quality and execution of the build or materials as we all should assume them to be the same in this survey. Builders do calculate costs based on tonnage of a given material as it also relates to labour in working it……. and from my observations Multis do have a higher per tonnage cost than monohulls. Why?

Most economists believe that marketing has a great deal to do with perceived value, so based on that and my own priorities I answered the survey.

Guys, I would never deem to call another’s boat hamburger and mine steak so that is not a level I want to go to.

But one last observation to answer C-spots; “How much does lead cost per ton?” ..........All depends on whether your keel is pointing to the Sea or Sky

(Sorry, I couldn't resist)

[Keegan]

Originally Posted by Pelagic

Guys! ……..My “nervous Owners” comment was tongue in cheek meant to poke some fun at the “hullier than thou” multihullers who aggressively say…… we are the best!

(Sorry, I couldn't resist)

Please quote the "aggressive" posts so that we can see what you are interpreting as aggressive. I keep hearing about the aggresive quotes but a rarely can find them. I believe that almost everybody that sails appreciates monohulls even if they own a multi,afterall, sailing is great, regardless of number of hulls



Keegan

[David_Old_Jersey]

Originally Posted by MarkJ

And visa versa as it often appears that its anti monohul on this forum! So it just goes to show that ALL members can get irritated at these debates. Its the only thing I don't like about CF and I wish the Mods would understand peoples feelings on this subject.

I don't see the Cat owners as "anti Monohull" (after all, I figure they liked Monohulls soooooooo much.......they bought two ).....

But I find puzzling the inability of some folk on CF.com to even countenance that others may have a genuinely held different opinion based on experiance and personal needs and their own understandings (however obtained), let alone be willing to simply agree to differ once views are exchanged.....

It's like hearing from Mr R#cna, on Crack .

In many respects I truly am not fundamently bothered what other folk do - Cat or Mono - in the same way that in Monoworld whilst I am genuinely perplexed on both folk with the attitudes of sell the wife and cat and "go for it now" to cruise the world on a Lilo and of those who feel the "need" to work 20 years to buy (pay off the finance?) on a boat that can take 2 Washing Machines and a Grand Piano........I don't lecture (well, I try not to!), will express an opinion, try and offer some reasoning and leave folk to make their own decisions.....on the basis that no matter what I say they will do their own thing anyway!

BUT, the "Cat thing" is getting out of hand on CF.com given that any posts that even hint that Moses did not descend from the Mount with the Tablets on a Catamaran (or was that Noah? ) are jumped on to a degree that is way past defending one's own position / pride and joy......with the result that the questioning will be reluctant to post. Hell, even I usually do not bother posting on Cat threads or subjects, cos' it is simply too much like hard work........For me, I do not accept it as bullying, but for others with less confidence???......Even if I was thinking of moving from a Mono to a Cat I would 100% not ask on CF.com, both on the simple aggro factor and also the lack of balanced opinions.

I do understand that Cat Owners want to promote their pride and joy, but it is simply counterproductive to shout dissenting voices down to acheive the appearance of agreement....folk hearing silence sometimes read this as acceptance and re-inforcement of their viewpoint, when the truth is not always so straightforward. Hell, I don't phone the Pope up every day* and point out he's a Tw#t who believes nonsense - don't mean I do agree with him. *Well, not every day

Now, IMO none of this would really matter - and I would just carry on with being puzzled and slightly annoyed now and again, the world ain't perfect and nor do I expect CF.com to be perfect for me......BUT I honestly think that a lack of allowed questioning of Cat related matters is in danger of presenting a view to the uninformed that they are not only 100% perfect but are also 100% safe, no matter what the Sea throws at them or the Crew does. I won't use the term "the perfect idiot proof boat" cos' no boat can be........Actually, it's wayyyyyy too tempting, I will

[Keegan]

This mono multi debate obviously wants to be discussed. This thread alone has garnered 1000 views in only two days. There is another mono multi debate thread that has 22,000 views and still counting. Most threads on CF do not get anywhere close to 22,000 views, or 1000 views in two days. I suspect since the MODERN multihull movement is relatively new (yes, I know, 1000s of years ago the polynesians used multihulls, but besides that) it keeps the discussions lively and ongoing.


I was watching a movie last evening and the leading man and good looking leading girl were sailing on a beautiful classic schooner. It was an aerial view of the boat, gracefully sailing along with full sail. Made me want to jump up off the couch and go buy one even though I love my catamaran. Anyhoo, sailing is fun, so everyone should get out there and do it more often.

Keegan

[Pelagic]

Originally Posted by Keegan

This mono multi debate obviously wants to be discussed.

Keegan, I apologize if my comment caused thread drift as this thread has not been as contentious as others I have read on choosing between the 2 types.

But you do have to decide if this is a debate or a discussion?

I am not interested in debating but happy to discuss that for the same amount of money I would prefer to build a custom monohull to my own design over choosing a top end production multihull.

[Keegan]

Originally Posted by Pelagic

Keegan, I apologize if my comment caused thread drift as this thread has not been as contentious as others I have read on choosing between the 2 types.

But you do have to decide if this is a debate or a discussion?

.

No offense taken.

For some it is a debate and for others it is a discussion. BTW-A debate can be considered a discussion. Enjoy.

Keegan

[catty]

Originally Posted by Pelagic

Guys! ……..My “nervous Owners” comment was tongue in cheek meant to poke some fun at the “hullier than thou” multihullers who aggressively say…… we are the best!

I don’t understand it! I love all boats whether they are made from leather or carbon fibre and I did preface my statement by saying that personal preferences on boats were hard to compare because of so many variation in priorities.

I did not say anything about the quality and execution of the build or materials as we all should assume them to be the same in this survey. Builders do calculate costs based on tonnage of a given material as it also relates to labour in working it……. and from my observations Multis do have a higher per tonnage cost than monohulls. Why?

Most economists believe that marketing has a great deal to do with perceived value, so based on that and my own priorities I answered the survey.

Guys, I would never deem to call another’s boat hamburger and mine steak so that is not a level I want to go to.

But one last observation to answer C-spots; “How much does lead cost per ton?” ..........All depends on whether your keel is pointing to the Sea or Sky

(Sorry, I couldn't resist)

Cats have more surface area, hence more man hours when comparing similar construction methods.

[Pelagic]

Not as much as you might think Cat if you compare a deep draft full pilothouse mono with a multihull having similar accomodations.

As said before, hard to compare on length as it should be more on "bale capacity"

[rickm505]

Originally Posted by Keegan

This mono multi debate obviously wants to be discussed. Keegan

I'd like to add some perspective. When I first joined this forum, catamaran owners were scarce. We were fair game and suffered through enough attacks that we became defensive.

It's also interesting to note that when the multihull attacks begin, those posts are left for all to see and the dissension follows. When a reciprocal comment is made by a multi guy, it is sometimes removed by a moderator. It happens to me and others, but then again I guess I'm one of the aggressive ones.. in any event, these discussions are hardly informative. We've been covering the same material for years.

I think we'd all be a lot happier if multi attacks would be MODERATED. Defensiveness ends, no battles and everyone is happy.

[Pelagic]

Thanks for clarifying that Rick. I am new to all Forums and did wonder why there was such touchiness about what is simply a personal choice.

I’m with you in principal, but if I happen to disagree with a certain design feature of either a multi or a mono….is that an attack?

I would hope the reader would give me the benefit of the doubt and not be “already listening”

[rickm505]

Originally Posted by Pelagic

Thanks for clarifying that Rick. I am new to all Forums and did wonder why there was such touchiness about what is simply a personal choice.

I’m with you in principal, but if I happen to disagree with a certain design feature of either a multi or a mono….is that an attack?

I would hope the reader would give me the benefit of the doubt and not be “already listening”

You bought a mono because you prefer a mono, right? Who could disagree with your choice? Certainly not I.

I would like to point out that you don't see any of the multi guys in a mono thread telling mono people they bought the wrong boat and giving the reasons for it. Would I be correct in feeling that you would become 'touchy', if I entered a mono thread and called your boat a lead mine and asked why the heck you bought it? Then ask why you're so 'touchy'? Do you see my point?

This discussion is in the multi thread, as are you today. The only question asked by the poll was what boat you would prefer, yet look what's happening to the discussion.

It really isn't my place to explain to you why you made a mistake in selecting a monohull. Neither is it your place to explain why I shouldn't have selected a catamaran. We've both already made our choices. The object here should be to respect those choices.

[Alan Wheeler]

This is addressed to ALL, not one individual and is form me with my ADMINISTRATORS hat on.
We will no longer tolerate baited posting and retaliatry remarks. Keep these threads on the topic they started or they will be closed, simple. The Team is tired of these Multihull threads going in the direction they are. And that is both sides (mono/multi) fault. In fact, it could be seen as the topic of this such thread was started for one purpose. Kind of obvious by the way the poll is loaded as one sided for a start.
No More folks. I mean it.

[Pelagic]

Rick we do agree and I did not note that this was a survey meant only for multi folks.

Alan, this thread asked for a choice and a reason why. Do you really consider that it is baiting to discuss market values?

Seems to me, any misunderstanding was being worked out amicably, but again, I am new to this and often wrong....cheers!