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Old 13-07-2011, 18:36   #16
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Re: Multihull Cost

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I've come to realize over the last couple months that Cruisers Forum is probably not the place to look for it.
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Oh, boo hoo!
Case in point.
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Old 13-07-2011, 18:44   #17
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Re: Multihull Cost

i will pass you a hanky when i have time,,,,
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Old 13-07-2011, 19:48   #18
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Re: Multihull Cost

I would go in a 32 to 37 foot monohull around the world if I was not married to a person who likes level sailing. That's the reason I ended up with a catamaran. My wife does not feel comfortable on a yacht that heels over. I have to admit, that I get more tired when sailing on a monohull because I feel wobbly on my legs, and it is a bit harder for me to relax.

I planned on sailing around the world on a Westsail 43, and ended up sailing around the world on a Privilege 39, and I worked a couple of extra years to make up the difference. For me it was worth it because it meant my wife would enjoy the trip a lot more. She is terrified by heeling on a yacht.

I have always been fairly good at working for long term goals. But as I get older, the meaning of long term is shrinking. A long term goal now is about a year.

Here is a small piece I wrote about plans.



THE MAN WITH THE UNPLAN

I am the man with the unplan. What is the unplan? The unplan is simple: my long range plans are firmly set in jello, and are therefore subject to revision, reversal, and massive change. Although I know who I am and where I am going, I don't have any long term plans set in concrete.

My life is full of maybes, perhaps, and possibilities, but real long range plans are clearly out of the question. Three of my colleagues who had long term plans are no longer alive, and the handwriting is on the wall and in clear focus. The message says, "Today is the only day I have, and I need to make it count for something good."

I used to be a man with a plan, When I was halfway through college, I made a plan to go to medical school, and I did it right on schedule. But after that, the unplan took over. When I was an intern, I planned to become a pathologist, but instead, I became an eye surgeon. I planned to practice general ophthalmology, and instead became a retina and vitreous surgeon. I made a plan to work overseas in Saudi Arabia for five years, and instead stayed for eleven years before I set sail on the ocean of my dreams. I planned to spend two years sailing around the world on my yacht, and it took eleven more years to complete my circumnavigation.

Life has been full of twists, turns, and reverses, and it's easy to see why I am the man with the unplan. I didn't realize I was the man with the unplan until I had a car accident in New Zealand. When I rolled the van I was driving, I broke two legs, five ribs, one scapula, and I punctured one lung. I spent nine days in the intensive care unit, had three operations, and received seven units of blood - all of this was quite unplanned. I stayed in the hospital for two months and gradually regained my ability to walk. It took six months to be able to bend my right knee ninety degrees, and that made it difficult to climb on and off my yacht.

While I was hobbling around on crutches in Whangerei, New Zealand, I passed a real estate office that had an advertisement in the window for waterfront property - one kilometer of ocean frontage. At the bottom of the advertisement were the words, "For long term plans." I looked at those words and burst out laughing. Those words - long term plans - were massively presumptuous in the world in which I lived. In my world, I didn't know if I would ever walk normally again. Skipping and running were out of the question. First, I had to progress from hobbling to limping. Even my trip around the world on my sailboat was up in the air; I didn't know when or if it would ever continue.

I realized then and there that I was the man with the unplan. Although I had a general direction to my life, and I had a list of things a mile long I wanted to do, I no longer had solid plans or even a schedule. My life was full of possiblities, but long term plans were a thing of the past. When you are fifty old, and you don't know how much time you have left, you leave the long term plans to young whippersnappers who feel like they are immortal.

Since that time, I have been living more in the moment. I have a general direction to my unplanned existence. I planed to sail across the Atlantic Ocean sometime in November, December, or January, conditions permitting. I will probably cruise in the Caribbean from January to June, and then I will arrive back in the USA in June, July, or August. That's my unplan.

The truth is, I was never very good at squeezing my life into any type of mold, and plans are sometimes the most restrictive molds of all . Anyway, the majority of my plans have turned out different, maybe even better, than I had hoped. So I have decided to stick with my unplan and see what happens. One thing you know for certain, we will be surprised when we see how it all turns out.

By the way, God, if you happen to be listening, I would appreciate it if you would extend my unwitting and unplanned existence for another forty or fifty years, because there is so much to do and so little time, and I want to make the next fifty years into a real adventure. I promise I will do better this time. Amen.

THE MAN WITH THE UNPLAN*** I am the man with the unplan
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Old 13-07-2011, 19:58   #19
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Re: Multihull Cost

I've spent time on both monos and multis. I like the multis enough that if one year more would put me in a nice cat I'd go for it.
Different strokes etc.
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Old 13-07-2011, 20:54   #20
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Re: Multihull Cost

Not sure if yo usaid where you plan on sailing, but we also live in FL, ( I had to drive past Howie in the hills on my way to orange park today for work) lol
Anyways, we plan on doing lots of coastal cruising and keys, and DT and bahamas. We just purchased an Endeavor 30 cat for alot less then most geminis, and in my opinion it is just as good or better in terms of quality. Very affordable if thats the type of cruising your doing. This is our 4 year boat as in in 4 years if we are ready to live aboard we may re review our choices. The couple that sold us ours had lived aboard in NY, Canada, and the Bahamas- keys.
There is a great priced prout 37 snowgoose elite for sale in TX for 80 k +/-
Great blue water liveaboard boat in nice shape. Dont know if that qualifies for go small go now, but how many people and how much room do you need? A 32 ish cat has the interior room of a 40' mono, and a 38' cat probably a 48-52' mono?
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Old 13-07-2011, 21:10   #21
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Re: Multihull Cost

I understand where you are coming from. I would love to get a Catamaran. In addition to the comfort, it would open up a whole new world of gunkholing in the Bahamas. I want one so much, my friends won't talk to me about it anymore, because I'm obsessed with it, and they're tired of hearing about it.

The reality is however I bought a monohull for 26K that has standing head room and allowed me to cruise the Bahamas these past two winters in reasonable comfort. How many cats with standing headroom and reasonable freeboard can be purchased for even three times that amount?

It's all about trade-offs and those trade offs are not always easy to evaluate. Go now, or go in more style later? Go in style or retire earlier? How will health issues factor in down the road? How about the economy?

There's certainly something to be said for going simpler and going now, but if spending more on a boat is what keeps your wife happy for example, well that's something you can't just ignore.

All the best with your decision.
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Old 14-07-2011, 00:24   #22
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Re: Multihull Cost

Maxingout... Thanks for the unplan narrative. It rings true.
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Old 14-07-2011, 06:01   #23
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Re: Multihull Cost

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Originally Posted by nautical62 View Post
.....The reality is however I bought a monohull for 26K that has standing head room and allowed me to cruise the Bahamas these past two winters in reasonable comfort. How many cats with standing headroom and reasonable freeboard can be purchased for even three times that amount?
This answer is surprising, as it's more than you think. The Endeavor 30 mentioned above is one example, a Catalac that I sail is another, both are high quality boats and sail well (I've sailed on both). I should mention that I have ... 6' 5" headroom....

The rub is these are older cruising catamarans. You guys know how that goes, as it's the same for any kind of boat. Some of these boats are gorgeous and cared for meticulously, and then again, many are not. I received an email from a Catalac 8M owner in the Carolinas who discovered his boat on a lift...in a boat shed. It had been stored there by an elderly couple for many years, and the boat looked new.

My point is that deals do exist and they are out there. I will point out that neither example given here was probably intended to cross oceans, although the small Catalacs have done it many times.
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Old 14-07-2011, 06:18   #24
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Re: Multihull Cost

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Originally Posted by kevingy View Post
.....The reality is that money is an issue - perhaps the only issue.
Yeah, the 2 hull thing is tough on our wallets, no question about it.

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I guess what I'm looking for is validation that working and saving for a catamaran is worth it, when I could probably buy a monohull for a third to half of the cost and "go small, go now". I'd be heeling while underway and rolling at anchor, but at least I'd be underway and anchoring.
This is a tough question. If you do a Cat vs mono search in this forum, the search results would take a month to read, as this subject has been hashed thoroughly. The bottom line is that ultimately the decision is totally up to you as none of us know what you plan on doing with the boat.

When I went shopping for my boat, I intended to buy a monohull. (shhh.... don't tell anyone). It was during a day sail on a friend's boat that it became very obvious that my lady did not appreciate heeling. This is what triggered my initial interest in catamarans. I took almost a year to look around, and with an eye toward my budget, bought an older, solid little catamaran with twin diesels.

Was it worth it? Here I am 6 years later, and my answer would be ...hell yes. I'm of the opinion that if the price differential were smaller between monos and cats, we'd see a lot more sailors in 2 hulls.

Take a minute or two and read my website about my decision making process, it's too long to go into here. But I will suggest the obvious:

Solid glass hulls (only because of the delamination issues possible with older cored hulls)
diesel engine(s) (they just last longer and there's little maintenance)
not wider than 17' (you want the slip cost reasonable)
The boat should look cared for....

Good luck
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Old 14-07-2011, 06:31   #25
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Re: Multihull Cost

Older Geminis are reasonably priced also, BUT,you can have your pick of many much larger monos for the same or less money.
Steve.
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Old 14-07-2011, 06:38   #26
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Re: Multihull Cost

Well, I didn't believe I could afford a Cat either. But I bought one for 7500 (30ft Iroquois Mk2) that needs repairing, probably requires 10 weeks of work (done about 5) and will cost an extra 4000 to get it near perfect. That's 11,500.

My next Cat will probably be an Outremer, which can be picked up for 90k (a few years in the future though!). But I could go out and spend 350,000 on a new one (if I had the cash).

But I'm happy at the moment. I have a cat!
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Old 14-07-2011, 06:50   #27
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Re: Multihull Cost

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Originally Posted by kevingy View Post
... I was simply looking for validation ...
... That is, I was looking for some encouragement. I've come to realize over the last couple months that Cruisers Forum is probably not the place to look for it.
If it's unconditional support, and unquestioned validation you desire; you might be right.
It seems that you may have to choose between two mutually exclusive wants - ie: cruise a catamaran or do it now.
I wholly support your (apparent) conclusion that, difficult as it may be, it will be worth the wait to earn enough money to purchase a catamaran, and support your cruise.
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Old 14-07-2011, 07:05   #28
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Re: Multihull Cost

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Well, I didn't believe I could afford a Cat either. But I bought one for 7500 (30ft Iroquois Mk2) that needs repairing, probably requires 10 weeks of work (done about 5) and will cost an extra 4000 to get it near perfect. That's 11,500.

My next Cat will probably be an Outremer, which can be picked up for 90k (a few years in the future though!). But I could go out and spend 350,000 on a new one (if I had the cash).

But I'm happy at the moment. I have a cat!
I always liked the look of those Cats

But how much of that happiness comes from a) having a boat you can afford and b) from not having to work 24/7 for a year or so - just to end up still broke, except with higher outgoings? For everyone the answer will be different......some no doubt happy with a larger boat - and being broke.
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Old 14-07-2011, 07:08   #29
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Re: Multihull Cost

I will add that we love our cat. Our last boat a Bombay clipper 31 sailed and handled the seas beautifully and we had been thru some nasty stuff with her. The Cat does not have that "I am Sailing!!!!" feeling, little heel, little sense of speed, unless you look back at the transoms, and little see motion or just different sea motion from a mono. I could see us in the years ahead maybe going back to a larger mono, but then again, I think we may just upgrade to a larger more "rough water friendly "cat.
But $ comparrison as many posters have said above, I sold my Bombay for a 1/3 of what the Endeavour cat cost me. Both are great boats and we miss many aspects of the mono, you just have to decide what sailing your doing, how much time at anchor, where you want to go etc etc,
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Old 14-07-2011, 11:18   #30
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Re: Multihull Cost

I look back 20 years ago when we bought our first cat and realize we made a mistake. We are now boat less and looking for our next boat. If we had never taken the plunge into cruising cats 20 years ago finding the next sailboat would have been easy as there are a ton of great monohulls on the market for a good price. Now I don't think I could go back to a mono, still like them but not my cup of tea.
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