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View Poll Results: Do you prefer mono- or multihull sailboats for cruising?
Monohull 138 36.70%
Multihull 238 63.30%
Voters: 376. You may not vote on this poll

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Old 19-01-2008, 13:11   #181
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I can agree some multihulls look funny!

Third
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Old 25-01-2008, 18:15   #182
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Steve Dashew now drives a powerboat

Of course, the Dashews now cruise in a powerboat, the Wind Horse. In my view, when you want or need something easier to handle than a marconi rigged boat-you can either go with a powerboat, a junk rigged boat, or a wingsail hybrid such as I show on the webpage in my signature.

The Dashews in their bible, "The Encyclopedia of Cruising" or whatever their big book is called, goes into details on the pros and cons of multi versus mono hull: Their conclusion was something like: Monohulls are more forgiving and therefore more suited for offshore conditions
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Old 25-01-2008, 18:28   #183
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Fast cats = "little" big cats

"Cruising cats are never quick cause we all wanna carry stuff."

Unless you build a long, light one that has minimal accommodations for its length-say a 65' cat with the accommodations usually found on a 45' catamaran. You can see an example of this thinking on my web page, shown in my signature. If I was going to the Roaring 40s, I'd probably want a monohull, too. I have an example of each type, a very seaworthy mono and a really fast cat on my webpage-both designed for DIY home building by yours truly. I'm going with the catamaran.
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Old 25-01-2008, 18:54   #184
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Whatever happened to tris?

I've drawn all 3-Monos, cats, and tris. Trimarans have the least accommodation of the 3, for a given length, and that is why you don't see them any more. Basically, tris make good daysailers and weekend boats, and that is where you see them in quantity these days-Dragonflys and small Farriers. Trimarans are also wider than catamarans, making it really problematic to put large ones in marinas. Catamarans, of course, have more room than either tris or monohulls of a given length. Kelsall believes that cats have more speed potential than tris, as well, and I notice that the maxi-racers are using cats more and more, and tris less and less

"I like to think of a centre hull for accommodation etc and the outriggers as lightweight floats for stability."

Any comments?[/quote]
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Old 25-01-2008, 19:07   #185
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Catmaran hulls are all companionways- sometimes

"Big cats 40-50ft are great but do you need ALL that room, and much of the room is in the hulls which are passageways."

It doesn't have to be that way. Wharrams aren't like that, and neither is my design on my webpage. As far as I am concerned, it is win-win to eliminate the big house usually found on catamarans, and enter individual cabins in the hulls from the bridgedeck.

You have to build a bigger catamaran to get the same accommodation as on a room-aran with a big house, and that is a good thing. A boat designed like this ends up with more waterline per pound of displacement, has more watertight compartments, has more privacy for the cabins in the hulls, eliminates "shelves" aka steps for berths, is easier to build and costs less per foot of length to build. Those are all good things.
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Old 25-01-2008, 19:22   #186
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That would be Wharram cats-and I know I'll get flamed for saying so-

"I guess I am a bit of a luddite, but I remember reading about multihulls breaking up in heavy seas - the crossbeams that held them together came loose or cracked or something so there were two unstable hulls and no rig"

I suspect that has happened to some Wharram cats. I remember on bad six month stretch when I was cruising in the S. Pacific and two Wharram cats disappeared. It was 1977-1978, and "I Love You II" disappeared on the way from Tonga to New Zealand, and "Tanya" disappeared on the way from New Zealand to Australia. My thought at the time (no proof, but a gut conviction,) was that I suspected that they had come apart, as I thought that they were flimsy boats with very questionable attachment points for the connector beams.

I actually towed Tanya from Whangarei harbor, behind Batwing, as Shawn Blanchford left for Australia, and I headed for Fiji. A huge storm hit that evening, despite a favorable forecast. My wife and I were the last people to see Shawn alive.
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Old 25-01-2008, 19:44   #187
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Richard Woods and parachute sea anchors.

"Richard Woods Abandons Ship. Wood, a cat designer, says many of the same things I have said."

Actually, Woods was using a much smaller parachute than recommended, and on a shorter rode than recommended to boot. His boat actually survived the storm in question, without its crew, as he abandoned his boat for a Coast Guard ship. So his loss of morale was the real problem. He had his family with him, and in his opinion staying on his boat was too dangerous, but it was seen floating and upright later, after the storm.
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Old 25-01-2008, 20:27   #188
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Meow

"P.S. I don't dislike cats, either, but I consider myself more of a dog person."

If I wanted to be 'catty', I'd say that this was no coincidence-as monohulls are dogs, compared to cats. Sorry, couldn't resist, I feel quite hangdog for stooping so low, doggone it.
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Old 25-01-2008, 21:02   #189
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"The Cat that I delivered was a 38' (some French design????). I delivered it from Fiji To Brisbane, Aust. There wasn't a lot of windward work (fortunately) but enough to know that I couldn't sleep in anything over 15kts of wind. The pounding almost drove me out of my mind"
Well, you need an adequate bridge deck clearance. An inch per foot of beam is one rule of thumb. Also, those pop outs called shelves are often too low and too boxy, and then there are nacelles. Kanter has a lot to say about them (and nothing good,) on his website at the following page:
The Elusive Cruising Catamaran Performance .
I think he is a little conservative about beam, however. My design is 55% (beam / length,) and Gregor Tarjan suggests that as the maximum desirable beam. A number of cats designed in the last decade have 55% beam overall.

As far as wind vanes on catamarans go, as was said above, maybe on a relatively slow and heavy one. The Cape Horn would probably deal with the height and windage of a cat best. See http://www.capehorn.com/ .
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Old 19-02-2008, 18:05   #190
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I own one of each....lived aboard the mono for nineteen years, and have run the charter cat for four. I love 'em both, and still enjoy the mono, but the cat is faster, safer, smoother, bigger.....but much more expensive. Expense aside, it is a strong win for the cat.
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Old 20-02-2008, 06:08   #191
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Something not mentioned in this thread, is where do catamaran owners plan to put their boats when a hurricane is coming?
With many of the posters advocating longer lengths for cats, I wonder where they intend to plonk them when a tropical storm or hurricane is forecast in the area?
Florida and the Caribbean have some good hurricane holes, but space is extremely limited. In fact, in the Caribbean, its become very difficult to lie at anchor as swinging room no longer exists. It has become more common to tie into the mangroves side to side. Obviously, catamarans take up considerably more space, whether at anchor or tied into the bush.
I once spent two days putting out 5 anchors and preparing my small boat for an approaching named storm, only to have a large catamaran come in and anchor only a few feet in front of me. Having had alot of experiences with catamaran's tendancies to sail at anchor and drag, I was needless to say, quite put out that all my hard work was for naught as I would surely have been plowed down by this large vessel, were it to break free or drag.
Others in the harbour were also less than welcoming to this vessel, as there was simply not much room to work with, and the catamaran needed twice the space of everyone else, and no one wanted him anchored in front of their vessel. There is also some discussion as to catamarans carrying less heavy anchoring gear in a desire to lessen payload, which combined with their windage seems a recipe for dragging.
As these larger cats are growing in popularity, I wonder where they intend to go when hurricanes are forecast and what consideration they plan to extend to others who take up far less room and have far less the windage and its associated risks in high winds.
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Old 20-02-2008, 06:22   #192
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To each his own, but nothing beats a Cat for cruising. Cats have livability hands down. Imagine not having to go up and down stairs when going into and out of the boat. A nice sliding or swinging door? What could be better? And all that deck room for the wife and kids to enjoy.

The downside, in my opinion is losing some of the "magic" of sailing a monohull that can't be described. The motion of a cat is kind of akward where the motion of a monohull is heaven on earth. But that is a small sacrifice if it means the difference between the wife actually wanting to come with or not.
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Old 20-02-2008, 06:31   #193
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A valid point, Littleboat.

In talking with cat owners down here in Ft Lauderdale, many are basically at a big disadvantage when it comes to hiding from tropical systems.

They can't fit in a lot of the mangrove hurricane holes and frequently have to pay yard deposits and reserve haul out space in advance for the storms. They have to reserve these spots by order of their insurance companies.

I may have switched to cats, but the one I got is only a foot wider than my old mono. So I'm happy I'll still be able to fit into all the same spots (it's also 10 feet shorter).

Those bigger cats do have a hard time finding spots.
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Old 20-02-2008, 18:16   #194
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Originally Posted by little boat View Post
Something not mentioned in this thread, is where do catamaran owners plan to put their boats when a hurricane is coming?
With many of the posters advocating longer lengths for cats, I wonder where they intend to plonk them when a tropical storm or hurricane is forecast in the area?
Florida and the Caribbean have some good hurricane holes, but space is extremely limited. In fact, in the Caribbean, its become very difficult to lie at anchor as swinging room no longer exists. It has become more common to tie into the mangroves side to side. Obviously, catamarans take up considerably more space, whether at anchor or tied into the bush.
I once spent two days putting out 5 anchors and preparing my small boat for an approaching named storm, only to have a large catamaran come in and anchor only a few feet in front of me. Having had alot of experiences with catamaran's tendancies to sail at anchor and drag, I was needless to say, quite put out that all my hard work was for naught as I would surely have been plowed down by this large vessel, were it to break free or drag.
Others in the harbour were also less than welcoming to this vessel, as there was simply not much room to work with, and the catamaran needed twice the space of everyone else, and no one wanted him anchored in front of their vessel. There is also some discussion as to catamarans carrying less heavy anchoring gear in a desire to lessen payload, which combined with their windage seems a recipe for dragging.
As these larger cats are growing in popularity, I wonder where they intend to go when hurricanes are forecast and what consideration they plan to extend to others who take up far less room and have far less the windage and its associated risks in high winds.

You can usually get cats up into much shallower water. ESP cats with daggerboards and lifting rudders. Mine will take up a fair bit of space, (44' x 22') but it will float in 500mm of water, so it won't be taking up space a mono could have used.

But in reality, there are bigger boats, and smaller boats - big boats take more room than small ones - you could direct the same question to the owners of any bigger boat, mono or multi.
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Old 20-02-2008, 19:07   #195
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you are quite correct about the size of boats and the room they require, 44.
you're probably right also about being able to use space that would 'go to waste' for monohulls in many hurricane holes of the world.
but in the caribbean, there is most always 5, 6 feet or more right up to the roots of the mangroves. the problem is space. boats are backed in side by side mostly now, as i mentioned that swinging room is becoming very scarce. this is definitely the case in the more sheltered holes.
most all the caribbean sailors pride themselves on helping one another out when there is a run for a hurricane hole. this includes especially helping those who have little or no experience in dealing with named storms. if time is short, those with dinghies in the water ferry anchors and line to the mangroves for those whose dinghies are lashed on deck or not inflated...its a group effort.
but what perhaps is not so well known is that everyone already prepared and anchored in anticipation of a named storm's heart drops when a larger catamaran enters the hurricane hole; and everyone wishes that he will anchor someplace as far as possible from their own vessel. there simply is very little room to go around and the windage and size of the catamarans being discussed in other threads here as desirable take up the space that would accomidate at least a couple of monohulls that have much less windage.
i do think the larger boats mono or multi are endangering my small boat, but obviously, all i can do is do my best to get away from them. i always try and seek out a small indentation where they might not blow down on me; though i've had them come alongside anyway. i've also been told outright by the captains of larger yachts that they are insured and will be going to shore rather than risk staying aboard; larger boats are owned by people who like comfort; perhaps that is why they seem to be the ones most often leaving for land.
i personally would not want to find myself in a situation where a hurricane is impending and there simply is no room for me, nor take up an unfair amount of space, nor jam up against a vessel that is simply too small to handle the abuse a large boat can dish out.
i asked the question because with all the planning and questions about these large catamarans on this forum, i've never read of anyone even considering what their strategy would be, nor how it impacts others.
catamarans do very well hauled out, (if there is a lift wide enought to pick them up), as they haven't got the worry of being lifted off jackstands and falling a long way down. most yards are now putting them in a separate area, so that they won't fall prey to the domino effect of one toppling monohull.
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