Liveaboard/cruising Cats w/kids

[pangaea6]

Papa, I've also looked at some of the boats you mentioned and they look cool. Thanks for that list.

[Talbot]

with a family of 6, you would need a pretty big mono to get everybody into the cockpit! and there wouldnt be room to move once you had. Whereas I have had 13 in the cockpit of my 29' catamaran.

Going better to windward would be nice (my old catalac is not good to windward), but the real advantage shows when running before the wind. A mono will roll to the point where people are totally fed up, whereas the cat will just keep going upright.

If you are cruising which direction will you be going?

[pangaea6]

I'm gonna show my lack of sailing knowledge here. Do you mean north/south or what areas would I be sailing? Or with the wind or whatever As far as I know I'll be cruising the east coast and Carribean.

[BambooSailor]

I agree with Papa, Catana is probably too comlicated and powerful for what your need. I also agree that Lagoon 410 would be a good choice. She has a beam of 43' cat, is strudy, simple, a lot of space. She has good volume hulls with a lot of weight carrying capacity, relatively good bridge deck clearance (compared to South African cats - most of them slam badly), very little weight forward. Either of aft cabins would probably sleep all your kids at once as they have king-sized berths. You can get pre-owned one starting at around $300k. Before you make a decision, I suggest you charter one for week, Papa for sure can give you a good deal .

[pangaea6]

Thanks Bamboo, Lagoon 410 sounds like its getting good rec.'s. Is there much of a difference between the 410 and 410 s2?
Where's a good place to charter a cat and check out the sea legs? I'm in NC. Is a week charter nec. or will a few days be enough to get a feel?

[BambooSailor]

From cata-lagoon.com:
Modifications to the Lagoon 410 have been made in many areas – ergonomic, comfort, maneuverability – and the new S2 version has even more standard equipment.
All primary sail control lines, including the main halyard and reefing lines, are now brought back to the cockpit where the addition of an electric winch increases the ease, efficiency and safety of managing mainsail loads.

Other difference I was able to observe (never been on 410 v1): S2 has slightly different galley layout – sink faces aft, allowing whoever is washing dishes be part of a party in the cockpit (at least that’s the idea)

As for your other questions: try to find catamaran closest to you, but for beginner sailors BVI is hard to beat. You may be able to find a charter company that may let you try different cats, most likely during off-season, few days for each, so you can get a feel and see for yourself what's important for you and what is not.

[pangaea6]

Thanks Bamboo and all the others. Hopefully I'll be able to make it to a boat show and check out some boats then look for a charter sometime. What's everybody's experience with liveaboards w/ kids? Do they like the choice they made, wish they had done it sooner or just doing it for a few years or did they think they made a mistake?

[Talbot]

Another boat that is worth a look is the BroadBlue 42 - although I suspect that not many have made it across the pond yet.

A follow-on from the Prout designs without that horrible nacelle. This is a fast boat capable of dirty weather, and have knowledge of one as steady as a rock in a 40 knot blow, but was actually doing 20 knots at the time.

[pangaea6]

I'm still looking for boats. I THINK I have narrowed it down to a Lagoon 05-06 410 S2 or a Manta. I like everything about the Manta except it seemed small and the salon seemed closed in with just the door for vision to the cockpit. i don't know how space would affect a family of 6 on a long cruise. I like the looks of the Lagoon more and the space. Sailed on the Manta and it seemed fine and gonna do a Lagoon sail next week, I assume it'll feel about the same. It just seems like a Lagoon might feel more like a 'home' whereas a Manta might feel more 'boaty.' If, according to others experience they perform roughly the same and sail with equal ease, then the Lagoon might win out.
Of course I just saw a 46' Prout 1999 and 46' BB 2004 for sale. I haven't looked at these ( I will next week) but I think they have the galley down, which I didn't want to begin with but might could live with if other aspects of the boats are good. They're asking price is 425k and 449k respectivly and seem pretty loaded. The new Manta can be sorta loaded at 460k and the Lagoon also at about that price maybe 10k higher.
So I guess my question is, what are the opinions on the comparison of those 4 boats? Thanks for any and all replies.

[RandyAbernethy]

You might also look at a Voyage 440. The first thing everyone will shout is that they have a low bridge deck and that they pound. Both statements are true. That said I lived on one for three days recently and really liked it. The boat is well put together, strong and a blast to sail if the swell is not too steep. Also a five year old example looks like a one year old anything else due to the heavy use of easy to maintain (but somewhat plastic looking) laminate. You can get a nice one for well under $400K loaded. I don’t think I would buy a Moorings or a Sunsail Charter boat but I would look at a Voyage out of Voyage Yacht Charters.

[db8us]

I would say even a 38ft Cat would be big enough.
My boat is usually sailed by 2 persons, but with my brohers family we were also 6 without problems.
I own a oweners version of a Lagoon 380S2. The 410S2 is also a good choice, but i opted for a new 380 instead a used 410. Some money went into Radar, Caribe Dingy, stainless steel anchor and chain, upgrated electronics etc.
I wanted to have an owner version with a big shower for 2 :-)

[pangaea6]

Is there generally any wiggle room on the price of a new boat, say one already built waiting to be sold (maybe adding a few additions) as opposed to a custom built to order?

[Sunspot Baby]

Suggestion:

Charter a cat of about the size you think you would buy. Make sure you and the family can handle it.

Read up on manufacturers and how well the boats are built. We bought an older Prout because they are so darn sturdy.

Older Lagoons IMHO are stronger and better than the newer ones. Privilege is among the sturdiest of the French boats.

The South Africans tend to build stiffer boats while the French go with flexible.

Mantas are reputed to be strong but I have also heard a couple of stories that made me wonder.

These are BROAD generalities & I will probably start a p*ssing match with everyone supporting their particular preference. Sorry if I have offended.

In short: Try chartering before buying. Buy with a sturdy boat over one that looks pretty. You want a boat that will carry you and your family through that unexpected gale or worse. Quality and condition!

[gosstyla]

If you are going to live aboard and cruise the bigger the better. Go with the 46s. I like the Voyage 440 but it definitely does not have enough free payload.

[Harriet]

There is probably no greater fan of Manta than I am, but I wouldn't recommend it for you. You have 4 kids, all of whom are going to grow over time and need increasingly more space. A 3-cabin Manta is simply going to be too cramped. Given the initial expense of buying a cat, you want it to meet your needs for as long as possible. That means a 4 cabin layout.

I heartily endorse Sunspot Baby's suggestion to charter. You will be amazed at how differently similarly-sized boats are configured and how they handle. Chartering is well worth the time and money to eventually create a "short list".