Lipari 41 vs. Leopard 39

[jonarck]

Hi, Everyone


My wife and I will be buying a cat next year when we move to West Palm Beach, and we're down to the Lipari 41 and Leopard 39 (if we buy new). We hope to see and sail the Lipari and L39 during our vacation in August (and to decide between the two). We bought our current boat (1997 Catalina 34) new and never regretted it.


We'd appreciate hearing from those of you who had/have the same decision to make so that we can learn about your experience and though process.

If you also could give us some information on your broker or dealer in Southern Florida and how the buying process went, including dealing with the factory (we'll treat it as confidential), you can write to us at jonarck@kelarc.com, if you prefer.

Cheers,
Jon

P.S. It's interesting that there isn't a separate Leopard Forum (not enough interest?)

[Factor]

Just for accuracy Lipari is 39 and leopard is 37, not having a go, just dont pick your boat sizes by name.

[Dulcesuenos]

There is a leopard owners group on yahoo. Lots of helpful info. We did not buy brand new but we viewed two Fp's and a few leopards. We decided on the Leopard for a few reasons. We felt the leopards are better laid out for living aboard and cruising. The FPs both felt flimsy almost spongy like as we had seen on Geminis. The leopard felt more solid. The leopard made no noises in a rough seaway, 4-6' seas on all angles and no groaning creaking or horrible noise at all. The FP was a diff story.
Loaded with cruising gear I think they would perform comparably. Empty the FP is probably faster. The new (39)'s seem much lighter construction than the older 38's also the Venezia we inspected had horrible blisters between the hulls above the water line and they were numerous and large some almost having sharp points.
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[ausaviator]

As much as I sound like a broken record...

Leopard = Balsa / timber cored construction.
Lipari = Glass / Foam construction.

Do you want a boat made of timber?

Although, I am unsure however, the Lipari as many boats do likely has timber core above the waterline in the cabin area construction.

[Dulcesuenos]

If water penetrates either it can be very bad. Which one has more of a history of this happening?

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[ausaviator]

Unless you are Noah, as in the Noah that built the arc, I'd stay away from timber.

[jostalli]

I have sailed neither but have been all over each of them. The Lipari is the one I would choose. It has a longer waterline length and is just roomier all around.

I'm still confused why Leopard decided to make this new generation shorter than the last even with the smallest beam of all their competitors.

[Speeding Ticket]

Interestingly we are looking at a cat this size - lipari is currently preferred - and have a Catalina 350 purchased new in 2006. I also like the look of the Nautitech open 40 but of course haven't seen one. At this stage haven't sailed on any one of these but looking forward to it.

[downunder]

Originally Posted by ausaviator

As much as I sound like a broken record...

Leopard = Balsa / timber cored construction.
Lipari = Glass / Foam construction.

Do you want a boat made of timber?

Although, I am unsure however, the Lipari as many boats do likely has timber core above the waterline in the cabin area construction.

Aus,

Can you refer me to an example of a balsa cored leopard with problems its balsa. Could be issues certainly if de-coring was not done where fitting as put on. Generally manufacturers that use cad design should allow for that with their laminate where fittings are to be installed.

We know that has been an issue with some decks and worse in some USA vessels but is it a known issue with Leopard.

Cheers

[Dulcesuenos]

Originally Posted by downunder

Aus,

Can you refer me to an example of a balsa cored leopard with problems its balsa. Could be issues certainly if de-coring was not done where fitting as put on. Generally manufacturers that use cad design should allow for that with their laminate where fittings are to be installed.

We know that has been an issue with some decks and worse in some USA vessels but is it a known issue with Leopard.

Cheers

Really good point. I know where all thru hulls and deck hard ware attachment points are there is solid glass no core. Also we have a core sample from when an additional thru hull was installed and it is impressive as hell how thick both the inner and outer layer of glass is.

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[Olivergm]

Not one of your suggested options but worth a look is the Maverick 400. I bought one last year via The Multihull Company (Alexis) and have no regrets at all. Very roomy for a 40ft boat and well made. The Maverick 400 Catamaran: http://youtu.be/XWKdP2bGvRg

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[Barra]

Sailed both.

If you want to enjoy your sailing go the Lipari. The difference in performance on all points of sail was noticable. Dont believe the Leopard provided polars - they are rubbish. Agree with the other post though the lightness has com at a cost in terms of flexing however.

On the other hand if you sit at anchor more and are happy to motor more often then the leopard has a much better layout for livaboards IMHO.

[jostalli]

Originally Posted by Speeding Ticket

Interestingly we are looking at a cat this size - lipari is currently preferred - and have a Catalina 350 purchased new in 2006. I also like the look of the Nautitech open 40 but of course haven't seen one. At this stage haven't sailed on any one of these but looking forward to it.

I am extremely impressed with the Nautitech Open 40. It just looks brilliantly executed and first reviews say it sails much better than expected. I like it much more than the Lipari 41 and definitely more than the Leopard 39.

[Rohan]

Interestingly, these two boats are also on my short list. I've been in both, and sailed the L39. I thought it sailed fantastic. Leopards are delivered all the way from South Africa, so you know they are seaworthy. Balsa core is not an issue unless you damage the hull, and in that case the Lipari would suffer as well. Liparis are lighter though, so they may sail faster depending on your sail plan.

If it's just you and your wife most of the time, I would go with the Leopard because it's more than big enough for two. Actually, it's big enough for four people with no problem! But if you are planning on bringing a lot of family/guests, I would go with the Lipari.

Other comparisons:

Leopard pros:
Slightly better overall quality
Nicer styling both inside and out (in my opinion)

Lipari pros:
Larger galley
Nav desk in salon
You can buy an enclosure for the cockpit to expand your living space even further

[scarlet]

Both of these boats are on our.. "if we can't afford XXXX then we will happily settle for" list..

We really like both. The only consideration that is holding us back, is that we want a bit more space. You didn't say, specifically, but I'm guessing your comment about moving, gives us the clue that you will NOT be a live-aboard. My husband and I will be.. so, thusly, we would like more space.

The Lipari we toured was beautiful with a lovely layout.. but it all felt just a little too small for us, as live-aboards. But, if you will just be a weekend, or vacation sailor? I think either is just a fine size...