Leopard 39/38 vs. Lagoon 380

[Camp Director G]

There was an old thread on this question that got derailed and fizzled out. I'm interested in overall personal opinions on which of these boats is a better choice for a couple to live aboard for one to three years cruising East Coast U.S. and the Carib. Interested in a buy and re-sell either new or used up to ten years old. Looking for thoughts on live-aboard life and space, sailing ability, ease of handling, safety, ease of maintenance, price/resale value, etc... and price is an issue. We are new to cruising, but not new to sailing. Of course I know it's a matter of preference and compromise, but I am curious about what you would choose and why. Thanks!

[Ex-Calif]

Originally Posted by Camp Director G

There was an old thread on this question that got derailed and fizzled out. I'm interested in overall personal opinions on which of these boats is a better choice for a couple to live aboard for one to three years cruising East Coast U.S. and the Carib. Interested in a buy and re-sell either new or used up to ten years old. Looking for thoughts on live-aboard life and space, sailing ability, ease of handling, safety, ease of maintenance, price/resale value, etc... and price is an issue. We are new to cruising, but not new to sailing. Of course I know it's a matter of preference and compromise, but I am curious about what you would choose and why. Thanks!

Great question and my two choices as well.

There is a Leopard at our club now. I don't find it a handsome boat at all.

I got up close and personal with a Lagoon 380 at another Marina. Still a much prettier boat for me.

I am not in the fantasy mode of boat set up, sailing performanace and all that jazz yet but beauty always floats up real high on the list.

I am looking forward to comments on this...

[Camp Director G]

Interestingly, I didn't like the look of the Lagoons at first. The vertical windows seemed as if they were not made for movement, but they're growing on me. And the windows do seem to be a good idea. They apparently cut down on sun and the heat that tilted windows would bring and they give more interior room. From what a lot of cruisers say, you spend most of your time anchored or tied to a ball and roomy comfort is nice.

[Highland Fling]

As one of the most popular production crusing cats ever it has to be the L380 for as many reasons as you can think of. For the Caribbean its a little short and not very fast but for the ICW for two people it is about as good as it gets - perfect IMHO

[SearenitySail]

Originally Posted by Highland Fling

As one of the most popular production crusing cats ever it has to be the L380 for as many reasons as you can think of...

Actually, I believe the only catamaran model that has exceeded production numbers for the Lagoon 380 is the Gemini 105. And there is NO comparison between the two, and is the mainstay model in the Lagoon line.

If price is an issue, you will undoubtedly find many more Lagoon 380s on the market--and more privately owned.

I would expect that most of the Leopard 39s on the market will have come out of charter. While I am not familiar with the Leopard 39, it is designed by Morrelli & Melvin who also designed Gunboat catamarans (though there has been a split between them--covered on another thread).

Marshall

[Camp Director G]

Robertson and Caine, who make the Leopards are probably second in production only to the Lagoons. They make the Moorings version of these which are named under the Moorings specific L4000 or something like that for the Leopard 40. They have tons of boats on the water and I've heard nothing but good things. They're heavy, but so are the Lagoons and they have great load carrying capacity and it appears slightly better sailing polars than the Lagoons. A lot of people on these forums say after-charter boats are a bad idea, which is what I thought until I talked at length about it with the guy who runs the sailing school I attended. He says he thinks it's a fine idea to buy one after charter, at least from the big, reputable companies. The Moorings sells a lot of Leopards after charter and from what I generally hear, they have excellent maintenance. After all the horror stories I have heard about new boats and what had to be fixed, the after-charter deals don't sound too bad.

[Privleoplag]

This has been beaten to death..Lagoon 380 vs Leopard 38/39 for sure... but when some of the new Leopard 39 hit the market as used...maybe 3-4 years from now, I think they'll be looked at very kindly.

Climb up to the helm of each (which can be done from only one side on the Lagoon), see how things are placed and what the view is like, and the Leopard will be the better. The new Leopard has so many great features right off the line. Hard top bimini, generators, air, fantastic fridge/freezer, solar, good davits, etc., etc.,. But until the Leopard 39 starts hitting the used market, I don't think they can be compared to the used Lag.380's and the older L38's.

(edit)
I see the new Lagoons have a hard bimini but on checking fuel and water capacities the leopard has about twice the capacities.

[Steve_C]

If you are going to compare the new Leopard 39 then I think you need to compare it to the Lagoon 400. I believe the intent of the OP was to compare the older and more affordable versions that are currently on the used market.

To truly make a valid comparison you need to pick a specific model of each and then compare for a specific use. Both are great vessels, with certain strengths. It will boil down to Your specific needs and uses, and what boats are available in your price range, when you get ready to buy.

I personally find the Lagoon to fit my preferences better, but thats due to my height (6'5") and the overall feel on the Lagoon. but that's just me....

[Privleoplag]

Here's a side by side.. Size wise, I think the Leopard 39 still needs to be compared to the Lagoon 380. But rating and capacities, the Leopard is closer to the Lagoon 400.

Leopard 39, Lagoon 400, Lagoon 380

Length Overall 37 ft 6 in. / 39ft *3 in/ 37ft 11 in
Hull Length 36 ft / 37 ft 7 in/ 36' 1 in
Beam 19 ft 9 in. / 23 ft 9 in/21 ft 5 in
Draft 3 ft 5 in. / 4 ft/ 3 ft 9 in
Sail Area 991 sq ft / 952 sq ft/ 883 sq ft
Mast clearance ?? ft / 66 ft 7 in/ 56 ft 10 in
Standard Power 2 x 21 hp/2 x 29hp/ 2x20 hp
Fuel Capacity 92 gal. /106 gal./ 52 gal
Water Capacity 206 gal. / 79 gal./ 79 gal.
Displacement 18,340 lbs / 22,817 lbs / 16,005 lbs
EEC certification *A for 10 persons/A for 10 persons/A for 8 persons

I didn't see mast height for the Leopard. I did see that the leopard shows outside seating for 14 passengers (CE rating C)

[SearenitySail]

Steve C may be correct. The OP stated "either new or used up to ten years old" so specs on the original Leopard 38/Moorings 3800 should also be considered as the OP may be in the "search for as much information as possible" phase.

Dimensions
LOA: 38 ft 0 in
Beam: 21 ft 4 in
LWL: 33 ft 9 in
Maximum Draft: 3 ft 7 in
Displacement: 17190 lbs

Marshall

[Privleoplag]

Originally Posted by SearenitySail

Steve C may be correct. The OP stated "either new or used up to ten years old" so specs on the original Leopard 38/Moorings 3800 should also be considered as the OP may be in the "search for as much information as possible" phase.

Dimensions
LOA: 38 ft 0 in
Beam: 21 ft 4 in
LWL: 33 ft 9 in
Maximum Draft: 3 ft 7 in
Displacement: 17190 lbs

Marshall

http://www.morrellimelvin.com/recrea...YMUTREE_0_2%7C. Had conflicting numbers on the 38... The Beam width and LWL kinda threw me, below, water and hp must be with the options and not the standard equipment.

Length Overall
37 ft 5 in / 11.43 m
Length at Waterline
36 ft / 11.00 m

Beam 20 ft 1 in / 6.14 m
Draft 3 ft 5 in / 1.05 m
Engine Yanmar (2) 29 HP
Fuel 92 US gal / 350 ltr
Water 264 US gal / 838 ltr

[SearenitySail]

Privleoplag,

Just to cut through everything and try to prevent any misunderstanding:

The original R&C Leopard 38/Moorings 3800 was designed by Alex Simonis and was produced from late 1990s to early 2000s. (the model cited by me above)

It was later replaced by the R&C Leopard 40/Moorings 4000 designed by Morrelli & Melvin (circa 2006). It has been discontinued, but many are becoming available out of charter, so the OP might want to throw that in the mix.

Morrelli & Melvin later (circa 2008-2009) designed the R&C Leopard 38/Sunsail 384 which became the Leopard 39.

The Lagoon 380 began production in the late 1990s and, I believe, over 600 units have been produced in various configurations.

Marshall

[Privleoplag]

Originally Posted by SearenitySail

Privleoplag,

Just to cut through everything and try to prevent any misunderstanding:

The original R&C Leopard 38/Moorings 3800 was designed by Alex Simonis and was produced from late 1990s to early 2000s. (the model cited by me above)

It was later replaced by the R&C Leopard 40/Moorings 4000 designed by Morrelli & Melvin (circa 2006). It has been discontinued, but many are becoming available out of charter, so the OP might want to throw that in the mix.

Morrelli & Melvin later (circa 2008-2009) designed the R&C Leopard 38/Sunsail 384 which became the Leopard 39.

The Lagoon 380 began production in the late 1990s and, I believe, over 600 units have been produced in various configurations.

Marshall

I see we have added specs for actually 2 different 38ft Leopards.. The 38/384 Sunsail which I posted above, and the 38/3800 Moorings which you posted.

I didn't realize there was such a difference between the 2. Thanks. Really surprised at the difference in beam!

[Sand crab]

Originally Posted by Camp Director G

Robertson and Caine, who make the Leopards are probably second in production only to the Lagoons.

I started this thread
http://www.cruisersforum.com/forums/...ers-69895.html
I think that the rankings and numbers are
1. Lagoon Can't get actual data
2. FP 2050
3. Gemini 1100
4. Leopard? over 800
Can't get the data for Catana, Privilege and others. I suspect Catana is close to Leopards production. Interesting that Lagoon has built almost as many 380s as Leopards total production. Not saying that it's good or bad. It's just there.

[Sand crab]

Just updated figures on Lagoon on other thread. May not be #1.
http://www.cruisersforum.com/forums/...s-69895-3.html