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Old 24-09-2014, 15:42   #271
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Re: Lagoon Cat smashed in Thailand

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Originally Posted by DoubleWhisky View Post
I know about several companies at least (even smaller scale production builders) having their boats engineered by High Modulus. Oyster is one example. But I am not aware about any mass production builder using HM services. Do You may be know something more about it?
Dont know about mass or others but Seawind certainly did
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Old 24-09-2014, 15:52   #272
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Re: Lagoon Cat smashed in Thailand

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Dont know about mass or others but Seawind certainly did
Good for You! I think it add well to the good sleep
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Old 24-09-2014, 16:28   #273
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Re: Lagoon Cat smashed in Thailand

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This thread brings us back to some of the Basic Laws Of The Sea (BLOTS).

1) Never, ever let your plastic boat drift onto rock or reef.

No matter what your fiber glass laminate thickness is, if your boat is left in strong wind and wave, over time it will become dust. This also holds true for metal boats, but just takes longer.

2) The Law of Tonnage. Stay away from bigger boats, because even when you are right and the ships captain is wrong, if youíre in there way, you and your crew will suffer the consequences and most likely will not be at the ships captains jail sentencing.
The law of gross tonnage always applies. And as far as plastic boats. I can recall the Capt., a female, of a container ship on the radio. The gist was, my radar is fifty miles and my bridge 62 ft. above the water and I can't see you. Wasn't me but was also a good lesson. Fly that radar reflector but don't bet you can be seen.
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Old 24-09-2014, 16:48   #274
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Re: Lagoon Cat smashed in Thailand

[QUOTE=Cadence;1636626]
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Originally Posted by a64pilot View Post
Post #223, but this is it cut n pasted, not much to it.



Out of curiosity I called Island Packet yesterday asking what the laminate schedule was for my boats hull. Their answer was they weren't sure they had it due to the boats age, but they would look for me. This morning I got an email from them, it's below.

Hi Jody,

Thanks for the note. 1 Ĺ oz mat skin, plus four layers 3408 Triaxial glass.

Hope this helps,

Thanks, I won't go blinder.


I hope the schedule is better than that? I feel they make a reasonably good hull and doubt that is the layup toe rail to keel.

PS, you may want to revisit your post about the rolling weight increasing stability. I feel sure you meant decreasing. It was re: power generation originally at an anchorage and you where just pointing out someone else's idea.

--
A rolling weight as long as the energy is extracted from it will be a stabilizing force. The reason is the energy has to come from somewhere, in this case from the movement of the hull, extract that energy and you will reduce the rolling moment.
As far as what IP sent me, I know it's not really a schedule, read what I replied to Minaret

Have I done something to you?
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Old 24-09-2014, 16:50   #275
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Re: Lagoon Cat smashed in Thailand

As far as the rolling weight, think of it like the pendulums put in skyscrapers, same thing
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Old 24-09-2014, 17:09   #276
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Re: Lagoon Cat smashed in Thailand

[QUOTE=a64pilot;1636746]
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Originally Posted by Cadence View Post

A rolling weight as long as the energy is extracted from it will be a stabilizing force. The reason is the energy has to come from somewhere, in this case from the movement of the hull, extract that energy and you will reduce the rolling moment.
As far as what IP sent me, I know it's not really a schedule, read what I replied to Minaret

Have I done something to you?
Not at all. Feel free to rag on anything I say.

If someone doesn't question how can we learn?

I still don't agree with your reasoning on the "rolling moment". I'd have to go back to the books to make my point with the correct terminology. At my age, so what. You might want to or not? Suggest beginning with how the GM shifts and the righting moment.
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Old 24-09-2014, 23:17   #277
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Re: Lagoon Cat smashed in Thailand

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If you are a genuine customer at least some production builders will take the time to explain the build/engineering. EG at least one manufacturer had the build process including structure dimensions tooling all engineered by High Modulus a formerly New Zealand company specialising in engineering lightweight strong composite structures. In short some companies do not just employ an old salt with a chopper gun and throw some resin at it and hope.

Then how can we compare, be genuine customer for all the types of cats on our shopping list?



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Old 24-09-2014, 23:19   #278
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Re: Lagoon Cat smashed in Thailand

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Then how can we compare, be genuine customer for all the types of cats on our shopping list?



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Exactly as I said, approach your dealer and sit down and ask the questions, in my case we will work through the information in conjunction with the factory.
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Old 24-09-2014, 23:23   #279
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Re: Lagoon Cat smashed in Thailand

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Exactly as I said, approach your dealer and sit down and ask the questions, in my case we will work through the information in conjunction with the factory.

Its just that it would be great to be able to eliminate the types of construction to what we want for the purpose and use of the cat we have. It should be possible, very simple, for the builders to, in their brochures, on their web sires give us enough detailed technical info so that we can consult a surveyor or other very knowledgable person concerning hull construction to advise us.


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Old 25-09-2014, 07:35   #280
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Re: Lagoon Cat smashed in Thailand

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Exactly as I said, approach your dealer and sit down and ask the questions, in my case we will work through the information in conjunction with the factory.



If you are a sales agent for three different builders, how about posting some laminate schedules for various models?
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Old 25-09-2014, 07:36   #281
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Re: Lagoon Cat smashed in Thailand

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3408= .077 per lam. We'll call it .08. Four plies then equals .32, or almost exactly 1/3 of an inch. This will be the thickness at the sheer. The entire boat is certainly not built of only four plies of 3408. They will spray gel in the mold, skin coat it with matt, apply the quoted four plies of 3408, probably by infusion, and this will build a part. By the time the two hull halves are joined, and extra layers are added down low, the hull thickness will taper from 1/3" at the sheer (if we don't allow an 1/8" for gel and skin coat, which we should), to 3/4" or more at the turn of the bilge. An email saying your boat is built from four plies of 3408 might as well say "please go away, we have no time to answer your question with an actual laminate schedule". No boat is built with the same thickness everywhere. This should look a lot more like the lam schedule neilpride posted, but here they have only given the "main" plies.


Fiberglass Thickness + Weight Fabric Sorter
The calculator I have lists it at 0.072, which I rounded down to 0.07 - so the difference between our calculations comes to a whopping 0.02" over 4 layers.

I wasn't making any judgement on that - only providing the thickness of that particular laminate schedule because the poster asked for it.

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Old 25-09-2014, 07:52   #282
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Re: Lagoon Cat smashed in Thailand

Before we bought our boat second hand from a private owner, we visited the Manta factory. They took the time to show us their build techniques, discuss the lamination schedules and show us core plug samples of the hull and deck. And we weren't even buying one from them! After we bought the boat, Manta emailed me the lamination schedules for pretty much every part of it (I don't have the schedules for the interior molded furniture pieces).

I remember an old Lagoon blog - maybe it was Indigo Moon - where they bought their boat new and visited the Lagoon factory to see the hull being laid up. In that blog, they showed the laminate schedule, the production methods and samples of core plugs. Lagoon didn't seem to be hiding anything about their boats, but one did have to ask.

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Old 25-09-2014, 08:12   #283
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Re: Lagoon Cat smashed in Thailand

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If you are a sales agent for three different builders, how about posting some laminate schedules for various models?
Why - you interested in buying one of our boats.

Happy to share with genuine customers. If you are a client - even for a second hand boat of our brands, happy to share. But via the factories, I have no authority to post corporate Intellectual Property.
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Old 25-09-2014, 08:31   #284
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Re: Lagoon Cat smashed in Thailand

Factor, that answer says soooo much


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Old 25-09-2014, 08:41   #285
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Re: Lagoon Cat smashed in Thailand

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I have no authority to post corporate Intellectual Property.
If it is a good laminate schedule, they should be proud of it.

We endlessly debate the construction of anchors. The type of steel used is subject to the most detailed scrutiny.

Contrast this with boat manufacturers that won't even make the most basic construction details public .
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