Jibber jabber.

[catsketcher]

I used to sail wing and wing with the genoa led to a pulley on the rail - but it doesn;t work as well as using a pole - at least for my 110% genoa. It does work but I can get the sail flatter, and put thew clew further forward with a pole. I certainly need it for the screecher. Whether you need (or could do with a pole is pretty much a matter of foot length and beam.
As to "tacking downwind" it is what all the racing sailors say. Even though we all gybe it has ended up called tacking. I think the reason is because on assymetric boats you must zigzag down the square run just like tacking upwind. On a symmetrical style boat you can turn the brain off a bit and just go with the flow. On an assy boat going square is very demanding on the calling of shifts and pressure. The gains can be huge - and without using similar strategy to upwind sailing you are left far behind. So the shift in thinking requires a change in wording - hence "tacking downwind".

[StuM]

Originally Posted by catsketcher

As to "tacking downwind" it is what all the racing sailors say.

Not any of the racing sailors that I race with or against!

Even though we all gybe it has ended up called tacking. I think the reason is because on assymetric boats you must zigzag down the square run just like tacking upwind. On a symmetrical style boat you can turn the brain off a bit and just go with the flow. On an assy boat going square is very demanding on the calling of shifts and pressure. The gains can be huge - and without using similar strategy to upwind sailing you are left far behind. So the shift in thinking requires a change in wording - hence "tacking downwind".

First time I've ever heard of assymetric vs symmetrical style boats other than proas etc. And tacking/gybing them is a whole different ball game. It gets very interesting here when the local canoes are racing in the harbour at the same time as we are.

[44'cruisingcat]

While tacking or gybing downwind may not be faster in a cruising boat, in light breeze, it can often be far more enjoyable and pleasant.

[44'cruisingcat]

With our assymetric kite we have no difficulty sailing DDW. Did 100 miles in 11 1/2 hours yesterday, in mostly around 15 kts breeze, all pretty much DDW.

We simply run the tack off a bow.

[belizesailor]

Originally Posted by catsketcher

I used to sail wing and wing with the genoa led to a pulley on the rail - but it doesn;t work as well as using a pole - at least for my 110% genoa. It does work but I can get the sail flatter, and put thew clew further forward with a pole. I certainly need it for the screecher. Whether you need (or could do with a pole is pretty much a matter of foot length and beam.
...

When wing on wing on my cat, I take a line from the jib clew thru a standing block on the bow (intended for use with symetrical spin guy lines) and use it in combination with the jib sheet.

This does not give quite as positive control as a pole, but its pretty good.

[Snowpetrel]

The lazy way is just to sheet the jib in hard to leeward behind the main (as long as it's a non overlapping jib). It doesn't seem to flog much (if at all) if its a reasonably flat sail and the sheet leads are right. And set like this it seems to help the steering and prevent broaching, plus on a mono it helps damp rolling. A pole is far better speed wise, and I use it on longer runs but it is more work and can limit your maneuverability.

[Cavalier MK2]

We can be faster downwind tacking but when cruising it gets down to how hard you want to work on getting there. In breezy conditions there is less benefit as the dead downwind speeds increase.

[Seaslug Caravan]

Originally Posted by catsketcher

I used to sail wing and wing with the genoa led to a pulley on the rail - but it doesn;t work as well as using a pole - at least for my 110% genoa. It does work but I can get the sail flatter, and put thew clew further forward with a pole..

Yer , Mr Catsketcher, I came to the same conclusion. I've had the wisker pole for 5 years now and love it.
As for Asymmetric V Symmetric spinnaker, friends like their symmetric set up, but after having had a couple of freebee symmetric kites I still prefer my asymmetric tacked to the windward bow. I find it more versatile in the sense that unless the wind direction is really consistent all day, like on the Qld coast, one has to swap kites for the shyer angles, plus the higher clew of the assy makes sheeting angle more forgiving, with the wind shifts . I have a central prodder which I drag out and install for racing, but always remove it for cruising as I find it a little hard on the boat when bucketing to windward in the heavy stuff (burying it into waves etc). I adjust the tack location between the bows with tack lines to each bow.

I suspect our view points are based on where we sail.

[catsketcher]

Gday Seaslug

Most of my cruising has been up and down the Qld/NSW coast.

I had my assy up only last weekend, it's a nice sail. One thing I like about the symmetrical is that you can run deep without the main and gybe without touching a sheet. For deep angles I like the symmetrical (No main) and shallower angles I like the reacher - the assy doesn't fit with my sailing style much anymore.