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Old 17-11-2007, 20:04   #1
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info on Florida cat brokers needed.

I'm looking for some info on used cats and broker recommendations in Fla. We live in So Cal and are planning a trip to Fla between Thanksgiving and Christmas to shop for a used cat.

I'm looking for a well engineered and constructed 42-48' cat in the $250K +/- 100 range with liveaboard potential once back in CA. Since most cat builders are new, I think that leaves me with basically Privilege and Lagoon from the early/mid 90's in that price/size range. Also perhaps Manta. As I'm 6'4 and need a bit of elbow room, I don't want to want a charter version with 4 micro-heads. I'd prefer not to do major reconfiguration to find a spot for a small office/computer area - thus the older/bigger cats with good systems.

Can anyone familiar with the territory give me an overview the brokers that cover the territory. I would think there has got to be a relatively small number of brokers that really know sailing cats well. Any particular recommendations? e.g. are the folks at the big players (2hulls, Catamaran Co, etc) any good? Ideally I'd find someone who's been in the cat game for a while and knows the options from that era well.

My first thought is just to schedule time with the listing agents for each boat with the idea that they know that vessel better and I'll get to meet a number of agents and see who's good.

Thanks
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Old 17-11-2007, 21:15   #2
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2hulls is now part of the Catamaran Co. They are the biggest and most knowledgeable broker for catamarans in Florida. They also have a great website with listings and also list on yacht world.

I think you're taking an interesting path in selecting a Catamaran. I have to ask why in the world you'd trust an unknown broker to make recomendations for you? Their job is to sell boats...period..and they all are 'good' at it.

I can see that you are doing the research. The next step is to charter a couple of boats and see what you think. Then to spreadsheet the yachtworld.com listings for the boats that interest you, noting time on market and price reductions over time.

Lastly it's to use a broker to find 'your' boat.
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Old 17-11-2007, 21:59   #3
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Originally Posted by rickm505 View Post
2hulls is now part of the Catamaran Co. They are the biggest and most knowledgeable broker for catamarans in Florida. They also have a great website with listings and also list on yacht world.

I think you're taking an interesting path in selecting a Catamaran. I have to ask why in the world you'd trust an unknown broker to make recomendations for you? Their job is to sell boats...period..and they all are 'good' at it.

I can see that you are doing the research. The next step is to charter a couple of boats and see what you think. Then to spreadsheet the yachtworld.com listings for the boats that interest you, noting time on market and price reductions over time.

Lastly it's to use a broker to find 'your' boat.
Thanks Rick. All great points. It's not so much "recommendations" that I'm looking for, but an experienced professional. Yes their job is to sell, but good sales people really know their field and if they don't tell me something I don't know, then they are probably not worth my time. I also certainly won't take anything they say at face value - if anything I'm too much of a research-a-holic. As many of their clients have been down the road I'm traveling, if I don't get some new insights or perspectives, I'll be disappointed. Perhaps I expect too much.

I've chartered numerous cats over the past 12 years (and even owned a small 32' power cat for a bit), but up until recently charters were vacation and I was not thoroughly evaluating each cat for potential ownership & long term cruising. What I learn on this trip will certainly result in a charter or two as I narrow down the list to a few models. Those charter experiences certainly have fed this effort, e.g. Privilege is on the list, FP is not, I hate micro-heads, storage, storage, storage, etc. After a decade of serious racing and cruising in So CA, my first cat charter was a Privilege 39 in the early 90's, that is the boat that got me hooked on cats. As I think about a summer or two in BC and Alaska, winters in Mexico, and potentially living aboard, it's a whole new world to think about in terms of what kind of boat is right.

Thanks for the feedback, I'm always open to learn something new.
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Old 18-11-2007, 06:16   #4
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when we were looking for our cat we tried both of the mentioned brokers and found them to be very similar to dealing with used car salesmen. Then we called Phil Berman with Catamaran and Trimaran Brokerage Worldwide - The Multihull Company. We found him to be very honest, and easy to deal with!!! He knows catamarans very well, and is very much in tune with the markets
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Old 18-11-2007, 10:32   #5
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Mark,

Have you looked into finding a liveaboard slip for the Cat in CA? A friend of mine wanted very much to liveaboard in the San Francisco Bay. However, after checking with all the various marinas, there was not one liveaboard available, and the waiting list was some 3-5 years long. There is some sort of cap on the number of liveaboards. Marinas can't have more than 10% of their slips as liveaboards.

With regard to a broker, they are no better than used car salesmen or realtors. I have found that you can find what you need just by monitoring the listings on New and Used Yachts for Sale - YachtWorld.com
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Old 18-11-2007, 10:40   #6
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we basically used Phil as our buyer's broker, as he did not have what we were looking for in his brokerage. It cost us nothing and he dealt with all the brokers, held the escrow money and took care of our needs!! His fees came from the listing broker!!! He made the admiral feel very secure and treated us with all respect. Never talked down to us and always beat the **** out of the brokers for us
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Old 18-11-2007, 13:48   #7
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Have you made the complete list of boats with 6'4" headroom yet?
I am still working on mine.
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Old 19-11-2007, 13:45   #8
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Have you made the complete list of boats with 6'4" headroom yet?
I am still working on mine.
I'd love to see your list, but I'm dubious of manufacturers specs + I've found there is a lot more to it than just one headroom spec, e.g. the config of the step down into the hulls, if I have to wrap my legs around the pedestals on the cockpit and lounge table, and ..ah hem...head and leg room in the head.
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Old 19-11-2007, 15:00   #9
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Originally Posted by Mark424 View Post
I'd love to see your list, but I'm dubious of manufacturers specs + I've found there is a lot more to it than just one headroom spec, e.g. the config of the step down into the hulls, if I have to wrap my legs around the pedestals on the cockpit and lounge table, and ..ah hem...head and leg room in the head.
Room in the head is paramount, I agree.
I am compiling mine from what I can glean from people who have been on them. No one else - except FastCat.

I will put it together in a readable format. Right now it is chicken scratch.

Is there a way anybody knows that the table can be added to by posters?
Like a Wiki type thing.
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Old 19-11-2007, 15:09   #10
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Quote:
Originally Posted by JusDreaming View Post
. . . we called Phil Berman with Catamaran and Trimaran Brokerage Worldwide - The Multihull Company. We found him to be very honest, and easy to deal with!!! He knows catamarans very well, and is very much in tune with the markets
I will co-sign what JusDreaming has written about Phil Berman. He knows the catamaran market better than just about anyone, and he's a real pit bull as a buyer's broker.

Others have a different opinion, though. Check out the thread on Dolphin catamarans:

Dolphin Cat

Best of luck to you.

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Old 19-11-2007, 15:15   #11
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Originally Posted by Limpet View Post
With regard to a broker, they are no better than used car salesmen or realtors. I have found that you can find what you need just by monitoring the listings on New and Used Yachts for Sale - YachtWorld.com
It's good to see you're back and posting, Limpet. I don't want to hijack this thread, but can you bring everyone up-to-date on your catamaran plans? Are you still considering re-locating one to California, or have you decided to keep one in the Caribbean?

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Old 19-11-2007, 21:04   #12
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manta in bellingham

There is a very nice manta 42 set up for a tall owner in bellingham wa. It is in the top of your price range, but by the time you figure the cost of getting the boat to Cal. from Fl. it might pencil out.
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Old 21-11-2007, 01:46   #13
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Originally Posted by Limpet View Post
Mark,

Have you looked into finding a liveaboard slip for the Cat in CA? A friend of mine wanted very much to liveaboard in the San Francisco Bay. However, after checking with all the various marinas, there was not one liveaboard available, and the waiting list was some 3-5 years long. There is some sort of cap on the number of liveaboards. Marinas can't have more than 10% of their slips as liveaboards.

With regard to a broker, they are no better than used car salesmen or realtors. I have found that you can find what you need just by monitoring the listings on New and Used Yachts for Sale - YachtWorld.com
Finding any slip is a serious issue around here. There is a huge renovation project here in Marina del Rey (CA) that is tied up in the courts that has many 100's of refurbished slips empty. One never knows when that will open up. I've talked to a couple different liveaboards who basically said they found the boat themselves, and signed with the buyer's broker that got them the best slip. I've actually been told by a broker at a boat show slips could be found "for a price". Nice place huh? The bigger issue locally is that the lease holders for the various basins here have been raising their prices ~20%/year.

So yes, it's a serious issue that I'll need to keep working on.
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Old 21-11-2007, 09:14   #14
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We dealt with Alexis DeBouchard, the Multihull Companys broker in Ft. Lauderdale. He was by far the most honest and low pressure broker we have ever dealt with. I don't like dealing with real estate agents or boat brokers, but I would happily work with Alexis again.
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