Importing a Boat to Australia

[Jamel]

Originally Posted by BillAU

G'day James,

No mate, only one of the yachts I'm looking at, is in Queensland and that one's a Hartley South Seas...A Ferro Cement yacht. If all the boats I'm looking at had been Australia Registered, I would not be interested in looking off-shore.
I have since found a few other yachts that interest me, three more FC yachts and one Jim Brown Searunner...Yep, I know...From a West system/ply Tri to FC mono yachts I do like Tri's but not having deep pockets, I'm looking for the best bang for my buck and, the best bang for my buck looks to be buying a yacht off-shore and sailing it back to Australia.
After doing a lot of reserch on FC boats, I'm thinking a Pro built FC yacht may be a better choice for me and my needs

Cheers James.

Bill
Australia

Hi Bill, Please bear in mind that although the prices O/S seem attractive you must factor in costs such as airfares e.g. I flew to LA to check my purchase...$2000! when I fly back to pick it up....$2000! Haulout, antifoul, few bits like rope cutter on propshaft ...$3000, SSB, AIS, liferaft, 200amp alternator kit...$7000, insurance to cross S.Pacific...approx $3000??? Australian reg..$1190 and lots of other small stuff thats needed to get the boat back. It's great fun but no great saving when you get back and have to hand over another $18,000 for GST + compliances and quarantine!

[BillAU]

Originally Posted by Jamel

Hi Bill, Please bear in mind that although the prices O/S seem attractive you must factor in costs such as airfares e.g. I flew to LA to check my purchase...$2000! when I fly back to pick it up....$2000! Haulout, antifoul, few bits like rope cutter on propshaft ...$3000, SSB, AIS, liferaft, 200amp alternator kit...$7000, insurance to cross S.Pacific...approx $3000??? Australian reg..$1190 and lots of other small stuff thats needed to get the boat back. It's great fun but no great saving when you get back and have to hand over another $18,000 for GST + compliances and quarantine!

G'day James,

Thanks for those tips, I know about most of them...Our Aus' tax and customs like to get their pound of flesh and I could not be bothered trying to avoid paying duty and GST...Even if some parts of the GST are a extra rip-off.
I still have a lot to take care of before making any decission on any yacht so I may find a good FC pro built yacht...At a good price...Here in Aus', if I do, you can bet that's the FC yacht I'll buy. As to a Trimaran...I would like to know why a 40' Searunner, in great nick, in the USA is asking $43,000US while for an older 37' Searunner in Aus' they ask $75,000AU, and both yachts carry similar equipment.
In Aus and the States, FC yachts, in most cases, are priced at a much more competive asking price and, in a number of cases, it's just not worth the time and hassle to buy off-shore but, if a FC yacht is honestly advertised as "Ready For Sea" and I can save $35,000 + by buying off-shore, then I think that off-shore boat should be strongly considered.

Oh well, we'll see what I end-up with in the end. BTW, if I do end-up traveling off-shore to buy a boat, I'll only go one time, I would stay with the boat till I got it home. For now, I'll go sailing in my little Careel 22'...If I can get my mate to come along and help me rig it

Cheers James, and good winds on your trip back from the States with your purchase

Bill

[D&D]

Originally Posted by BillAU

if I do end-up traveling off-shore to buy a boat, I'll only go one time, I would stay with the boat till I got it home. ...
Cheers James, and good winds on your trip back from the States with your purchase

Cheers and good luck to you too Bill, to you both.

We agree with most of the posts above and might add that, as one means of protecting against the costs and risks of buying offshore, it may be a good idea to do your negotiating before you leave OZ. Presumably you will know the broad value(s)of the vessel(s) you're considering...and thus what you are willing to pay, all things (including import costs etc) included. So you should therefore be able tender offers to probe the vendor's willingness to sell at your price before leaving OZ. If your offers are conditional on survey and sea trials, i.e. basically where you are able to withdraw from the purchase, you can avoid landing overseas as a committed buyer with no agreed price. Conditional offers are well understood, accepted and frequently used.

The trap in the conditional offer process, however, is the need to put up a deposit as the conditional offer needs some consideration to be enforceable on both parties. Who holds the deposit is critical if you want to be confident of seeing it returned in the event you don't proceed. If you are using a well-recognised broker, there should be no problem and the broker will hold the deposit. If you are not using a well-known broker, your deposit may be at risk; in that situation you might consider engaging a local bank or attorney to hold your deposit, another cost unfortunately but perhaps cheaper than having to chase your deposit against some (obviously reluctant) party overseas.

Another thought might be to use a 'buying broker'. Whilst it's an unusual creature (working for the buyer but being paid by the seller) it does seem to work in some instances. We came across one such creature that we found trustworthy (including returning our deposit when we didn't proceed!) in the US. For various reasons we didn't end up using the buying broker, but we were still impressed with their services (including on-site inspections and reports, plus negotiation support) and their ethics; the latter being not all that common in many areas overseas!

[Johnathon123]

This is a little off topic but I just spoke with a broker re the price of boat in Australia when I can get the same boat 80-100k cheaper os.

He rattled off all the usual reasons, all of which have been canvassed here and then proceeded with one I had not heard before.

"If you buy a boat overseas you will have northern hemisphere compasses whereas this boat has southern hemisphere compasses and don't underestimate how much it costs to change those over"

Now I have never heard that one anywhere before.

Tell me he is tugging my chain?

Still can't stand 90%of brokers!

[hogesinwa]

Happens mostly with flat compasses like the orienteering ones. The arrow tends to dig in when used on the opposite hemisphere i.e. it is counterbalanced on the south when made for the north and when it's being used in the south the weight makes it sit on the bottom of the well. Opposite for the other. I think it only affects small ones, otherwise every cruiser that visited Oz would have no clue where they were as their compasses wouldn't work. More bs with a small grounding in truth I think.

BTW, I have just encountered another hitch in the buying overseas. You need to get your SSB unit licence and personal licence issued by your home/flag country. Can't get one in the USA without a Social Security Number (or the alien registration number you get with a work permit). Since ACMA doesn't even have SSB in its Glossary of Terms, finding out what to do is problematic.

[D&D]

Our compass seems to be working OK, as it did as well in the voyage from Sardinia to Sydney, although it has not been specifically checked here as yet...might get around to that during our upcoming cruise up the NSW coast at the end of this month...

So perhaps your broker may indeed be tugging your chain. Dare we ask -- PM if you prefer -- which broker?

For those looking at vessels currently cruising in and around the USA, however, we might note the importance (and potential incompatability with large conversion costs) of the AC circuits.

[Nauticatarcher]

Problem with compasses is called Dip and yes there are Northern and Southern Hemisphere compasses but it only really gets to be a problem when you get into higher latitudes

[dirkdig]

Great idea to have conditional agreement before you go.
We got sucked in by a New Zealand broker who told us the owner would take $ 650,000 om a $700,000 boat only to fly there,check it out offer the $650,000 again only to be knocked back as they never agreed to the $650,000 in the first place.
The broker was counting on us falling in love and upping our offer.

[D&D]

Originally Posted by Nauticatarcher

Problem with compasses is called Dip and yes there are Northern and Southern Hemisphere compasses but it only really gets to be a problem when you get into higher latitudes

Interesting...and what might constitute "higher latitudes"? We note you're from Tassie...and we're heading there in January this year...would YOU be in such a higher latitude?

[Nauticatarcher]

The needle of a compass aligns itself with the earths magnetic field as you get closer to the poles these lines start to dip in so to allow compass card or needle to swing freely it is compensated, I would doubt you would have a problem in Tassie

[Jamel]

Originally Posted by D&D

Cheers and good luck to you too Bill, to you both.

We agree with most of the posts above and might add that, as one means of protecting against the costs and risks of buying offshore, it may be a good idea to do your negotiating before you leave OZ. Presumably you will know the broad value(s)of the vessel(s) you're considering...and thus what you are willing to pay, all things (including import costs etc) included. So you should therefore be able tender offers to probe the vendor's willingness to sell at your price before leaving OZ. If your offers are conditional on survey and sea trials, i.e. basically where you are able to withdraw from the purchase, you can avoid landing overseas as a committed buyer with no agreed price. Conditional offers are well understood, accepted and frequently used.

The trap in the conditional offer process, however, is the need to put up a deposit as the conditional offer needs some consideration to be enforceable on both parties. Who holds the deposit is critical if you want to be confident of seeing it returned in the event you don't proceed. If you are using a well-recognised broker, there should be no problem and the broker will hold the deposit. If you are not using a well-known broker, your deposit may be at risk; in that situation you might consider engaging a local bank or attorney to hold your deposit, another cost unfortunately but perhaps cheaper than having to chase your deposit against some (obviously reluctant) party overseas.

Another thought might be to use a 'buying broker'. Whilst it's an unusual creature (working for the buyer but being paid by the seller) it does seem to work in some instances. We came across one such creature that we found trustworthy (including returning our deposit when we didn't proceed!) in the US. For various reasons we didn't end up using the buying broker, but we were still impressed with their services (including on-site inspections and reports, plus negotiation support) and their ethics; the latter being not all that common in many areas overseas!

In my case I negotiated with the sellers broker by email from Australia.
Here's how it went:

I emailed "I'd like to put an offer in on ...... for $160,000 (boat was just reduced from $184,900 to $179,000. Broker straight away sent me an offer and acceptance contract made out at $160,000.( NO DEPOSIT ASKED FOR and written into the contract was "Offshore Delivery"). Seller counter offered @ $169,000. I told broker I'd have to think about it...he emailed straight back saying "I think if you upped your offer to $165,000 you will have a deal.....I did and it was accepted subject to inspection, sea trials & survey! NOW THE 10% DEPOSIT WAS ASKED FOR ($16500, which I duly sent through Ozforex, they are excellent, professional and efficient.) $16500 US cost me $15800 or so. I flew out, inspected the boat,it was better than the internet photos with heaps more gear onboard too. Next day sea trials, following day survey, great surveyor found broken engine mount & dangerous condition PSS shaft seal! Yard estimated repairs, seller agreed to compensate an amount and the deal was sealed! I flew home after 5 days in LA, a very happy man!

I have been and still, very happy with the broker who is overseeing the work on the boat for me and recieving to his office equipment that I'm buying to have installed for the trip home in November . I would recommend them without question!!

[Mr B]

If you do buy a boat from the USA, their Epirbs are illegal on Australian registered boats and vice versa,

My boat in Fiji has a USA registered Epirb and I have bought one and registered it to me in Australia and taking it with me to Fiji,
You must be carefull when Buying an Epirb here as some cant be carried on planes,

[Morrissey]

Originally Posted by D&D

Interesting...and what might constitute "higher latitudes"? We note you're from Tassie...and we're heading there in January this year...would YOU be in such a higher latitude?

Here's a map of inclination. It is probably a case of cheaper compasses not being designed to tolerate the range and in particular the dip at higher latitudes. Do more expensive compasses include a spec. listing their limits?

[Jamel]

Originally Posted by Nauticatarcher

Problem with compasses is called Dip and yes there are Northern and Southern Hemisphere compasses but it only really gets to be a problem when you get into higher latitudes

Quite true, in my case I took my Fremantle home port boat up to Southern Ireland....52 degrees N, compass was hardly readable it was dipped over so much!

My new boat is from CA at approx 34 degrees N, so coming back to WA to 34 south will not be much of a compass problem I don't think. I won't be going much further south than Tassie.

[hoppy]

Another problem with buying a northern hemisphere boat is that the toilets are designed to flush in the opposite direction to those in the south, so you need to factor in a head replacement into the price